King Ding Dong 540 Posted October 29, 2013 Share Posted October 29, 2013 I think the boy got confused between Pet Care MB (easy) and Dog Care MB (work). Dog Care is really hard to do without access to a dog... Maybe he has a girlfriend...... Link to post Share on other sites
qwazse 4344 Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 How did the boy get a MB card signed by his SM ? Sure he can take care of another dog but I wouldn't accept the cat. That may fall under the Pets MB. Check GTA 2013 7.0.4.7 Limited Recourse for Unearned Merit Badges You need to act swiftly, within 30 days. The Scout may have done the badge because he wants a dog. Hopefully what he did with the badge taught him how expensive owning a dog is. More than the cost of scouts in many cases.If it's any consolation, I had a parent on my case when I told him his boy will have to earn Cooking MB since he won't make Eagle until next year. Figured I'd take one for the SM last night. Link to post Share on other sites
Twocubdad 665 Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 I think the boy got confused between Pet Care MB (easy) and Dog Care MB (work). Dog Care is really hard to do without access to a dog... He be better of training a cat than a girlfriend. Link to post Share on other sites
Stosh 3452 Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 I think the boy got confused between Pet Care MB (easy) and Dog Care MB (work). Dog Care is really hard to do without access to a dog... Boys: They are bouncing off the walls, running around chasing things, getting into trouble. Dogs are little men in fur coats. Girls: They are finicky, they lay around all day, and if you try to talk to them, they sit there and just give you "the Look". Cats are little women in fur coats. And please, do not forward these comments to my wife, she'll pounce on me and claw my eyes out. Stosh Link to post Share on other sites
Basementdweller 608 Posted October 30, 2013 Author Share Posted October 30, 2013 Turns out the lad lied to the councilor. The merit badge councilor took the boy and moms word on the Dog training and log. Seems he had pictures of himself and a dog, not sure whose it is or was. There will be a discussion about honestly, then the card will be shredded....... You can yell at me and say you can't do that......Oh yes I can and will. Trying to make a point with the young man. I am sick of being lied to by scouts and scouters. My foot is down and firmly planted. If this is a deal breaker for the lad.....Sorry you can enjoy your scouting elsewhere because you didn't meet the merit badge requirements. I am done with the dishonesty. Link to post Share on other sites
Papadaddy 121 Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 Good for you. I would have shredded the card based on not having it pre-approved.by the SM. Committing fraud by the boy AND his parent to get a non-Eagle required MB would be grounds for dismissal from the Troop. Life lesson. Sorry...I"m old school. Link to post Share on other sites
Stosh 3452 Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 Turns out the lad lied to the councilor. The merit badge councilor took the boy and moms word on the Dog training and log. Seems he had pictures of himself and a dog, not sure whose it is or was. There will be a discussion about honestly, then the card will be shredded....... You can yell at me and say you can't do that......Oh yes I can and will. Trying to make a point with the young man. I am sick of being lied to by scouts and scouters. My foot is down and firmly planted. If this is a deal breaker for the lad.....Sorry you can enjoy your scouting elsewhere because you didn't meet the merit badge requirements. I am done with the dishonesty. Deep down I get the feeling that the emphasis on "getting Eagle" puts a lot of such temptation in front of the boys. Instead of enjoying and learning something with MB's, it seems (no evidence) that a lot of pencil whipping is going on. Okay, short cuts are taken and if one "gets away with it," no harm no foul seems to be a prevailing thought amongst scouts and their goal oriented parents. I do Bugling MB, have for years. The number of boys that start is kinda surprising, but the number of boys that don't bother to come back is even more surprising. Basically, the MB consists of: These are the bugle calls, learn them. Okay, expecting the boys to actually learn them and practice them so they can be used, is an overwhelming feat. I suggest it should take maybe 2-3 weeks of 1/2 hr a day practice to be somewhat proficient. And then, they never come back. It's kinda hard to cheat on this MB. Either you know it or you don't. It's the nature of the beast. Boys that have finished the MB honestly have provided a good service to their troops, but one still doesn't hear many bugle calls nor see the POR on many shirts. I'm sure there are other examples of MB's requiring some kind of measurable proficiency, but I don't teach them so others would have to comment. Stosh Link to post Share on other sites
Twocubdad 665 Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 Yeah, that level of blatant dishonesty deserves to be kicked up a rung or two. Dismissal may be steep, but removal from PORs and an extended period of probation under which he is ineligible for advancement is certainly in order. Any SM conferences or non-advancement boards of review need to include the parents. Honestly, how we resolve things like this depends much on the parent's attitude. If we feel as the parents are supporting and working with us, we are much more likely to let them deal with the situation. If mom and dad come in with an attitude it won't go as well. Link to post Share on other sites
Tampa Turtle 1011 Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 Turns out the lad lied to the councilor. The merit badge councilor took the boy and moms word on the Dog training and log. Seems he had pictures of himself and a dog, not sure whose it is or was. There will be a discussion about honestly, then the card will be shredded....... You can yell at me and say you can't do that......Oh yes I can and will. Trying to make a point with the young man. I am sick of being lied to by scouts and scouters. My foot is down and firmly planted. If this is a deal breaker for the lad.....Sorry you can enjoy your scouting elsewhere because you didn't meet the merit badge requirements. I am done with the dishonesty. I agree. We got so many boys trying to 'paper eagle' it. We had a meeting with an AWOL Patrol Leader who wanted his sign off for his term after missing many PLC's, Troop Meetings, and did not go on one campout. He is an 12 year old Star who transferred in from another local Troop and HAS to make Life for "his schedule" so he can beat his Dad who got Eagle at 14. We told him to look at the Troop requirements again for PL and come back and tell us if he really thinks he did the job. We'll see. His dad is a real piece of work--seems very critical of the lad so I do want him to be successful. But we told him no he is not gonna make his schedule because he just not ready on the leadership part (bangs out those MB Academy MB's though). When I do MBC I will try to be flexible IF the boy is really learning something and trying. But I get tried of communications and emails from the parents. And yes Scouters are part of the problem too. There are times I wonder how my own Son's completed some of these requirements. J Blake is right (scary I agree with him again ) We have had the same experience with Bugling MB. I hope my son who plays trumpet will step up. I have my Dad's old BSA Bugle from when he was Bugler in 1949. Seems like a fun job--get to wake everyone up at camp outs. Link to post Share on other sites
Sentinel947 1205 Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 Good for you. I would have shredded the card based on not having it pre-approved.by the SM. Committing fraud by the boy AND his parent to get a non-Eagle required MB would be grounds for dismissal from the Troop. Life lesson. Sorry...I"m old school. Why would it matter if it's a non-Eagle required? I think this is a great learning opportunity for the lad, cheating is never worth it. The hard way )actually doing things right) is worth the effort. Link to post Share on other sites
Stosh 3452 Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 Yeah, that level of blatant dishonesty deserves to be kicked up a rung or two. Dismissal may be steep, but removal from PORs and an extended period of probation under which he is ineligible for advancement is certainly in order. Any SM conferences or non-advancement boards of review need to include the parents. Honestly, how we resolve things like this depends much on the parent's attitude. If we feel as the parents are supporting and working with us, we are much more likely to let them deal with the situation. If mom and dad come in with an attitude it won't go as well.100% of the problem lies with the parents. If they promoted honesty in the first place, this would be a moot issue. Adding parents to the mix will only reinforce the problem, not solve it. Best case scenario would be allowing the boy to be punished because he got caught, not because what he did had any moral implications. Stosh Link to post Share on other sites
King Ding Dong 540 Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 Yeah, that level of blatant dishonesty deserves to be kicked up a rung or two. Dismissal may be steep, but removal from PORs and an extended period of probation under which he is ineligible for advancement is certainly in order. Any SM conferences or non-advancement boards of review need to include the parents. Honestly, how we resolve things like this depends much on the parent's attitude. If we feel as the parents are supporting and working with us, we are much more likely to let them deal with the situation. If mom and dad come in with an attitude it won't go as well.Jblake, could you expound on that a bit more, not sure I get where you are going. Link to post Share on other sites
Stosh 3452 Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 Yeah, that level of blatant dishonesty deserves to be kicked up a rung or two. Dismissal may be steep, but removal from PORs and an extended period of probation under which he is ineligible for advancement is certainly in order. Any SM conferences or non-advancement boards of review need to include the parents. Honestly, how we resolve things like this depends much on the parent's attitude. If we feel as the parents are supporting and working with us, we are much more likely to let them deal with the situation. If mom and dad come in with an attitude it won't go as well.It's kinda like doing 5 over the speed limit. It's okay as long as you don't get caught. The morality of our nation is not do what is right. Do what you think you can get away with. Character used to be measured by what a person did when no one else was watching. I don't think that's a hallmark in today's society. Just listen carefully at a lot of these comments on the thread. Here's the rules, but what about if we do this? Granted, some of the "rules" aren't written very well, but look at the problems mentioned on the forum, how many are pushing the envelop and how many are merely interpretations. To me a POR is doing the work for 6 months. Others feel 75% of work is okay, but what about 50%, or 25% of the work. Kinda cheats those that put in 100% and do the job. Then there are those who even go so far as to say that simply wearing the badge is sufficient. Ever wonder why they are called Paper Eagles? I don't. I often wonder if the only lesson some scouts and their parents learn is how to pencil whip. Stosh Link to post Share on other sites
Brewmeister 132 Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 Yeah, that level of blatant dishonesty deserves to be kicked up a rung or two. Dismissal may be steep, but removal from PORs and an extended period of probation under which he is ineligible for advancement is certainly in order. Any SM conferences or non-advancement boards of review need to include the parents. Honestly, how we resolve things like this depends much on the parent's attitude. If we feel as the parents are supporting and working with us, we are much more likely to let them deal with the situation. If mom and dad come in with an attitude it won't go as well.Well, a cat and a dog are both mammals, so there you go. Same thing. Link to post Share on other sites
King Ding Dong 540 Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 Yeah, that level of blatant dishonesty deserves to be kicked up a rung or two. Dismissal may be steep, but removal from PORs and an extended period of probation under which he is ineligible for advancement is certainly in order. Any SM conferences or non-advancement boards of review need to include the parents. Honestly, how we resolve things like this depends much on the parent's attitude. If we feel as the parents are supporting and working with us, we are much more likely to let them deal with the situation. If mom and dad come in with an attitude it won't go as well.I still don't get it. "Best case scenario would be allowing the boy to be punished because he got caught, not because what he did had any moral implications." Why is that the best case scenario ? Link to post Share on other sites
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