Who owns the troop's equipment?

[fred johnson 936]

I mostly agree with you. There is a slight difference though from the perspective of not actively reaching out to open a can of worms.

 

I've seen five charter orgs. I've moved units between charter orgs too. Only one requested to get monthly copies of the bank statements and did an annual audit. With that single charter org, I'd absolutely ask how they want to handle the money and equipment and closure of the unit.

 

In the other four charter orgs cases, the charter org was never involved in any way other than providing space and signing the recharter form. They never asked to see anything. Likewise, they never helped raise funds or purchase equipment or adminster the program.

 

They stil absolutely have the right to be involved in the answer. But I would not change course as part of closing the unit. If they were not involved in decisions up until dissolving the unit, I would not "reach out" to bring them in now. If they asked, absolutely yes. But I would just not reach out to open a can of worms and create more work for myself.

 

********************************

 

But this discussion is moot without knowing any details of a specific situation.

 

[packsaddle 753]

Yah, I always get a chuckle out of da BSA's language on the matter.

 

So yeh license a program from Microsoft to help with your business. One of those click-through things that yeh never read. Then yeh go out and buy a computer and a monitor and a hard drive and a bunch of other stuff to run the program.

 

Later on yeh decide to switch to a different program and dump your Microsoft license. Now, in Microsoft's Corporation's Rules & Regulations, they say that if yeh stop using their software then they require yeh to turn over your computer and hard drive and monitor to them.

 

Actually, some of those click-through licenses are about that bad, eh? But they're really unenforceable nonsense. This kind of overbroad legal language has always been around, but it's gotten a lot worse in da last decade or so. Yeh should see some of da crap I see. I think it's dishonorable. Really it's a way of a big player with a lot of resources to try to coerce a small player with limited resources.

 

So to answer da original post, "it depends". Each case is goin' to be a bit different; the troop may be incorporated or recognized as a 501©(3) as an unincorporated association, yeh may have a big donor who gave things with donor restrictions, yeh may have "scout account" money that was actually paid by families that you're really holdin' on a custodial basis, yeh may have loaned gear, etc. Da person who has title to da trailer is probably da one who owns da trailer. In general, though, da troop is a youth program of the Chartered Organization; the adult leaders are volunteers for the Chartered Organization, and da Chartered Organization owns the money and gear, no matter what da BSA's internal Rules & Regulations (which da CO typically doesn't even have access to) state.

 

Now, to the OP, tell us what's really goin' on. I suspect perhaps your CO is dumpin' the charter over da membership policy change? In that case I think yeh sit down and be trustworthy, loyal, and friendly with 'em, eh? Yeh tell 'em da gear is theirs, and yeh ask what they want yeh to do. It could be they want it for da Royal Rangers or somesuch, in which case yeh behave like good scouts and clean it all up and pack it neatly and turn it over with a handshake, and then volunteer to help their Royal Rangers leaders if they need it getting set up. Havin' other groups takin' kids into da woods and teachin' citizenship and character is a good thing.

 

I suspect what's more likely is that they don't really need it or have any plans, in which case yeh can ask if yeh can take it with yeh so the kids can keep camping, and I bet they'd be amiable. Or yeh can offer to pay 'em fair market value, up front or over time.

 

Da point is to be friendly and helpful and courteous, like a good scout should be.

 

Beavah

Welcome back! Hope your 'vacation' was a good one.

[Stosh 3452]

I'm starting a new troop and offered CO spots on committee, finance audits, etc. and they said, all we want to do is provide a room for your boys to meet and store their equipment. So it varies from one CO to the other.

 

Stosh

[Eagledad 2777]

I'm starting a new troop and offered CO spots on committee, finance audits, etc. and they said, all we want to do is provide a room for your boys to meet and store their equipment. So it varies from one CO to the other.

 

Stosh

Be careful about what gets lost and stolen and asking for their insurance to pay. Barry

[Beavah 205]

Yah, I always get a chuckle out of da BSA's language on the matter.

 

So yeh license a program from Microsoft to help with your business. One of those click-through things that yeh never read. Then yeh go out and buy a computer and a monitor and a hard drive and a bunch of other stuff to run the program.

 

Later on yeh decide to switch to a different program and dump your Microsoft license. Now, in Microsoft's Corporation's Rules & Regulations, they say that if yeh stop using their software then they require yeh to turn over your computer and hard drive and monitor to them.

 

Actually, some of those click-through licenses are about that bad, eh? But they're really unenforceable nonsense. This kind of overbroad legal language has always been around, but it's gotten a lot worse in da last decade or so. Yeh should see some of da crap I see. I think it's dishonorable. Really it's a way of a big player with a lot of resources to try to coerce a small player with limited resources.

 

So to answer da original post, "it depends". Each case is goin' to be a bit different; the troop may be incorporated or recognized as a 501©(3) as an unincorporated association, yeh may have a big donor who gave things with donor restrictions, yeh may have "scout account" money that was actually paid by families that you're really holdin' on a custodial basis, yeh may have loaned gear, etc. Da person who has title to da trailer is probably da one who owns da trailer. In general, though, da troop is a youth program of the Chartered Organization; the adult leaders are volunteers for the Chartered Organization, and da Chartered Organization owns the money and gear, no matter what da BSA's internal Rules & Regulations (which da CO typically doesn't even have access to) state.

 

Now, to the OP, tell us what's really goin' on. I suspect perhaps your CO is dumpin' the charter over da membership policy change? In that case I think yeh sit down and be trustworthy, loyal, and friendly with 'em, eh? Yeh tell 'em da gear is theirs, and yeh ask what they want yeh to do. It could be they want it for da Royal Rangers or somesuch, in which case yeh behave like good scouts and clean it all up and pack it neatly and turn it over with a handshake, and then volunteer to help their Royal Rangers leaders if they need it getting set up. Havin' other groups takin' kids into da woods and teachin' citizenship and character is a good thing.

 

I suspect what's more likely is that they don't really need it or have any plans, in which case yeh can ask if yeh can take it with yeh so the kids can keep camping, and I bet they'd be amiable. Or yeh can offer to pay 'em fair market value, up front or over time.

 

Da point is to be friendly and helpful and courteous, like a good scout should be.

 

Beavah

I was just passin' through checkin' to see if this software was any better. Looks like yeh are gettin' a bit more traffic anyways. Mostly I'm contributin' here and there on one of da social network groups when I find some time, but other things are takin' up too much of it these days.

[E V Augustine 10]

Unfortunately my troop has had to function on the basis of who has the assets in possession. The troop was chartered by a Catholic church for 71 years. The diocese closed the church as part of a consolidation program. A week or so before the official closing date the gear was relocated to a storage facility and the funds held in the name of the Troop remained. We were subsequently chartered by a parochial school formed in the consolidation. Now four years later the school trustees have decided we need to move before January 1, 2014. (Insert new thread here.) Its deja vu all over again.

 

Fortunately the troop has access to a fair number of trucks, strong backs and a stronger sense of self-preservation.