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skeptic

How About We Simply Work the Program to the Best of Our Abilities

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Scouter99 - he wants a policy for allowing kids to refuse to tent with the gay kid.
Silly either way. I can't imagine anyone forcing kids to tent with anyone they don't want to, so what would be the point. Ah well.

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I am focused on the boys when on the ground. The only time this issue has come up is when someone thinks we need a unit policy for dealing with when one Scout doesn't want to tent with a gay Scout. I simply asked why we needed something specific to gays - every campout there can be a scramble to avoid tenting with any particular Scout for a variety of reasons.

 

I have kept my actions at the National and District level only so fa.

 

Barry - The BSA stigmatized themselves through their actions, communications and lack of communications through the years. We as an organization are obviously still learning how to handle PR in the modern, connected world.

Sorry - figuring out how to comment on my own thread. We don't have an openly gay kid, we have a Troop adult who wants to make sure that his son does not end up tenting with a gay kid (assumably against his wishes).

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Scouter99 - he wants a policy for allowing kids to refuse to tent with the gay kid.
That was my thought as well. I always counseled the Patrol Leader on the subject on the best way to deal with the conflict. Part of my job description I felt - help train future leaders on how to deal with conflicts in the field.

 

This is the only time so far that the issue has come up, and it has been raised by an adult not by a youth. Then again, the unit has a problem with adult pushed rule books that the youth barely look.

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I am focused on the boys when on the ground. The only time this issue has come up is when someone thinks we need a unit policy for dealing with when one Scout doesn't want to tent with a gay Scout. I simply asked why we needed something specific to gays - every campout there can be a scramble to avoid tenting with any particular Scout for a variety of reasons.

 

I have kept my actions at the National and District level only so fa.

 

Barry - The BSA stigmatized themselves through their actions, communications and lack of communications through the years. We as an organization are obviously still learning how to handle PR in the modern, connected world.

NJ, I'm aware of a MOOC, a Massive Open Online Course. That's the only thing I can think of but that doesn't fit the context.

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I am focused on the boys when on the ground. The only time this issue has come up is when someone thinks we need a unit policy for dealing with when one Scout doesn't want to tent with a gay Scout. I simply asked why we needed something specific to gays - every campout there can be a scramble to avoid tenting with any particular Scout for a variety of reasons.

 

I have kept my actions at the National and District level only so fa.

 

Barry - The BSA stigmatized themselves through their actions, communications and lack of communications through the years. We as an organization are obviously still learning how to handle PR in the modern, connected world.

Pack: Yeah, I don't think that's what he meant either. "Mook" sounds like something that Detective Briscoe would have called someone on Law & Order. I had never heard of MOOC before. The article about it on Wikipedia has charts and graphs and everything.

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I am focused on the boys when on the ground. The only time this issue has come up is when someone thinks we need a unit policy for dealing with when one Scout doesn't want to tent with a gay Scout. I simply asked why we needed something specific to gays - every campout there can be a scramble to avoid tenting with any particular Scout for a variety of reasons.

 

I have kept my actions at the National and District level only so fa.

 

Barry - The BSA stigmatized themselves through their actions, communications and lack of communications through the years. We as an organization are obviously still learning how to handle PR in the modern, connected world.

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/Mooks

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Skeptic and TJ and packsaddle all have good points. Discussion and disagreement is good, but we also have to agree to disagree and move on.

 

I went and looked at the onmyhonor website as they had a "major" announcement today. Well, the announcement was a bust but I did look at their forums. Besides arguing over dumb stuff like what to call the equivalent to Eagle, there is a thread on membership requirements. Turns out I wouldn't be allowed to be a scoutmaster there, even though they do want to make it non-denominational. I guess we have different definitions. But I did notice an argument as to who would be allowed. One guy said Jews and Christians should be allowed but not Muslims or Buddhists. That started a fight. They've just shifted the line but they sound just the same. The point being, there will always be people that disagree and we should learn to be civil. We're all volunteers and we're all trying.

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Skeptic and TJ and packsaddle all have good points. Discussion and disagreement is good, but we also have to agree to disagree and move on.

 

I went and looked at the onmyhonor website as they had a "major" announcement today. Well, the announcement was a bust but I did look at their forums. Besides arguing over dumb stuff like what to call the equivalent to Eagle, there is a thread on membership requirements. Turns out I wouldn't be allowed to be a scoutmaster there, even though they do want to make it non-denominational. I guess we have different definitions. But I did notice an argument as to who would be allowed. One guy said Jews and Christians should be allowed but not Muslims or Buddhists. That started a fight. They've just shifted the line but they sound just the same. The point being, there will always be people that disagree and we should learn to be civil. We're all volunteers and we're all trying.

I went over to the onmyhonor website due to curiosity that you brought up. Seems like they are a little high strung. I sympathize with their views, but I'm not going to throw the baby out with the bathwater and give up the BSA because of disagreements on a few things (some G2SS things and the new membership rules). I note that onmyhonor has pretty heavy-handed secret moderation. They've already deleted one of my posts, and I think I will soon be kicked out of the site.

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I learned a few years ago to do my best to avoid the garbage that comes from our local council all the way up to National. I feel if we bring that stuff to the troop level, we are doing a dis-service to those we serve. I know we aren't liked very much by those that get paid to do this but no one can argue our success. We don't have kids quitting and a very high percentage EARN their Eagle rank. We are an out of the box troop but are pretty tight when it comes to the aims of scouting. Regarding the whole "I don't want to tent with....." Almost all our boys solo tent so it's never an issue except at summer camp and then some boys bring their own tents and/or hammocks. Each unit needs to do what works for them and their boys and that is always changing depending on the type of boys you have.

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Skeptic and TJ and packsaddle all have good points. Discussion and disagreement is good, but we also have to agree to disagree and move on.

 

I went and looked at the onmyhonor website as they had a "major" announcement today. Well, the announcement was a bust but I did look at their forums. Besides arguing over dumb stuff like what to call the equivalent to Eagle, there is a thread on membership requirements. Turns out I wouldn't be allowed to be a scoutmaster there, even though they do want to make it non-denominational. I guess we have different definitions. But I did notice an argument as to who would be allowed. One guy said Jews and Christians should be allowed but not Muslims or Buddhists. That started a fight. They've just shifted the line but they sound just the same. The point being, there will always be people that disagree and we should learn to be civil. We're all volunteers and we're all trying.

NBC News has picked up the story: http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/07/09/19378560-faith-based-group-starting-alternative-to-boy-scouts-will-allow-gay-youth-adults?lite

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Skeptic and TJ and packsaddle all have good points. Discussion and disagreement is good, but we also have to agree to disagree and move on.

 

I went and looked at the onmyhonor website as they had a "major" announcement today. Well, the announcement was a bust but I did look at their forums. Besides arguing over dumb stuff like what to call the equivalent to Eagle, there is a thread on membership requirements. Turns out I wouldn't be allowed to be a scoutmaster there, even though they do want to make it non-denominational. I guess we have different definitions. But I did notice an argument as to who would be allowed. One guy said Jews and Christians should be allowed but not Muslims or Buddhists. That started a fight. They've just shifted the line but they sound just the same. The point being, there will always be people that disagree and we should learn to be civil. We're all volunteers and we're all trying.

"While the program, which doesn’t yet have a name, will allow gays, it won’t let them “flaunt†it, said John Stemberger, founder of OnMyHonor.net, a coalition opposed to the BSA’s vote in late May to change the controversial membership policy.

 

 

“We don’t think sex and politics should be in a program for kids. Those are issues for parents,â€Âsaid Stemberger, of Orlando, Fla., who left the Boy Scouts along with his two sons over the decision in May.

 

 

“If a young man has a same-sex attraction he would not be turned away in the program, but he’s not going to be allowed to kind of openly flaunt it and carry a rainbow flag,†he added, apparently referring to the participation of some BSA members in LGBT pride parades in recent weeks."

 

So, please explain to me how this is different than the current BSA position, other than they say they will allow adults too. The new resolution states that no sexual discussion of activity of any kind is allowed, nor any political activity. So, this is different? Maybe I need to go back and improve my language skills.

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If y'all want to discuss Politics and or the Membership Policy we do have a sub forum for that. The reason we have separate forums isn't so that people can avoid discussing the political/culture war issues, but rather that those issues will dominate the whole forum, and there won't be an easily identifiable way to find out other Scouting relevant information. So we have a nice separate forum for that. Lets keep it that way. If ANYBODY thinks by them preaching and pontificating on an internet forum like this one that they are making a noble contribution to the political causes they care about, and they really helping shape the real world events involving those causes, they need to get a serious reality check.

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Skeptic and TJ and packsaddle all have good points. Discussion and disagreement is good, but we also have to agree to disagree and move on.

 

I went and looked at the onmyhonor website as they had a "major" announcement today. Well, the announcement was a bust but I did look at their forums. Besides arguing over dumb stuff like what to call the equivalent to Eagle, there is a thread on membership requirements. Turns out I wouldn't be allowed to be a scoutmaster there, even though they do want to make it non-denominational. I guess we have different definitions. But I did notice an argument as to who would be allowed. One guy said Jews and Christians should be allowed but not Muslims or Buddhists. That started a fight. They've just shifted the line but they sound just the same. The point being, there will always be people that disagree and we should learn to be civil. We're all volunteers and we're all trying.

I can't wait to watch this group crash and burn. They screamed and made a ton of noise when they left, but had no exit strategy. Sounds like a bunch of adults that just wanted to start their own organization and now have an excuse to do so.

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Skeptic, I believe from what I read here that that's what we are doing. Most of us are just doing our regular Scouting gigs and hopefully not discussing the negative stuff except when it will serve a purpose. I certainly continue to support Scouting financially and by doing what I can to help out. We just need a place to vent our frustrations and hope that some of the folks at National follow these threads enough to know what we think. To me, it's kind of encouraging that this relatively small group of Scouters take their grievances here, rather than quitting to join the Honor group or just stay out of youth related activities.

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""I learned a few years ago to do my best to avoid the garbage that comes from our local council all the way up to National. I feel if we bring that stuff to the troop level, we are doing a dis-service to those we serve."" Agreed, but this has gone way way above National into the limelight of the national media and political process. Every person (youth and adults) who considers going to a scouting activitity (recruiting?) is wondering which side of the "us against them" they are on. And there will constant reminders by the media and politicians of just who side you should be on. We the people (sheep really) let the Pop Culture take our program away from us. Barry

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