True Religion

[Jason OK 10]

Just a Holy Man in an unholy land! Or you could say I fell like a sheep among wolves.

 

Saddlepack,

 

listen....your web link saying Christians are skin heads & nazis is wrong.

 

ScouterPaul,

As far as the abortion bombings....I can count those people on one hand. They will be judged before God for what they did. And I think what they did was wrong. But abortion has already killed millions of children. Anyone see the new 3D technology on the news last night? They can see the baby (12 weeks) yawning, making facial expressions..... Abortion is MURDER.

(This message has been edited by Jason OK)

[Jason OK 10]

MUSLIM ON-GOING CONFLICTS IN THE WORLD

 

AFGHANISTAN: The war in Afghanistan is ongoing. Since Soviet troops withdrew, various Afghan groups have tried to eliminate their rivals. Although the Taliban strengthened their position in 1998 they have not achieved their final objective. Afghanistan harbours Osama bin Ladin, a wealthy Saudi Arabia dissident responsible for terrorist acts around the world. On 11 September 2001 members from bin Ladin's el Qaeda group highjacked 4 passenger jets in the USA, crashing one into the Pentagon and 2 into the World Trade Center, killing more than 2,000 citizens. The USA and its allies declared war on terrorism and counter-attacked, removing the Taliban from power. The war on terrorism and the el Qaeda continues.

 

 

ALGERIA: Armed Islamic groups formed and since 1992 have carried out attacks on key economic points, security forces, officials and foreigners. In 1995 Algeria's first multiparty presidential elections were held and the incumbent president Liamine Zeroual won 60% of the votes in a poll with a 75% turnout. The first multiparty legislative elections were held in June 1997 which were won by the National Democratic Rally, which holds the majority of seats along with the FLN. Although the armed wing of the FIS declared a ceasefire in October 1997, an extremist splinter group, the Islamic Armed Group (GIA), continued attacks. There is also evidence that many attacks are carried out by militias backed by the Algerian security forces. After years of civil strife, Amnesty International estimates that around 80,000 people have died

The Caucasus and Russia: The Central Asian republics have a long history of conflicts. Fighting breaks out regularly between warlords and religious groups calling for the establishment of Islamic states outside the Russian Federation. Russia is trying to hold on to the federation because the Caucasus is a vital supply route for the oil riches of the Caspian and Black Sea. With the break-up of the Soviet Union various groups fought for control in the republics. Conflicts from one republic spills over to the other and they continually blame each other for attacks. Chechnya, still part of Russia, was flung in an almost full-scale war in 1994-96 and, after a disastrous campaign, Russia was forced to re-evaluate its involvement in the area. In August 1999 Russia stepped up security in the Caucasus region as rebels from within Dagestan - a small republic where more than 100 languages are spoken - went on the attack in support of Chechnyan Muslim groups who claim independence from Russia. In September 1999 Russia launched a ground invasion into the area to cut rebels off from Central Asian supply routes. By January 2000 Russia was once again involved in a full scale conflict in Chechnya. The Caucasus issue is complicated by the more than 50 different ethnic groups each insisting to proclaim their religious convictions on the area. The situation holds serious danger for neighbouring countries, Kazakhstan, Georgia and Russia itself.

 

 

EYGPT: Fundamentalist Muslim rebels seek to topple the secular Egyptian government. At least 1,200 people have perished since the beginning of the rebellion. The conflict was primarily waged as an urban guerrilla/terrorist war. The opposition Muslim Brotherhood took part in elections in 2000, indicating that they felt armed force would not work.

 

 

INDONESIA: The struggle on the Indonesia islands is complicated by leaders of pro- and anti-independence movements, and by religious conflicts. More than 500 churches have been burned down or damaged by Muslims over the past six years. Both the Christians and Muslims blame each other for the violence and attempts at reconciliation made little progress. After a bloody struggle East Timor gained independence in 1999. The hostilities on other islands continue to claim dozens of lives, to such an extent that the break-up of Indonesia seem imminent.

 

 

INDIA/PAKISTAN: Muslim separatists in the Indian section declared a holy war against the mostly-Hindu India and started attacks in 1989, mainly from Pakistan-occupied section of Kashmir, and from Pakistan and Afghanistan. The conflict continues, with Pakistan also crushing rebellions with brute force in their section.

 

 

IRAQ: Supports Islamic terrorist acts around the world. Differing culture and religious groups within Iraq continues to clash with Shiite Muslims.

 

 

ISRAEL: Within its own borders, Israel continues to battle various Muslim organizations that seek independence for a Palestine state, areas made up of the Gaza strip, West.Bank, and part of Jerusalem. There is heavy international pressure on Israel to recognise a Palestinian state. The area of what today is Palestine was settled by Semitic tribes at a very early date. It was then called Canaan, and controlled by Canaanite tribes for more than 1,000 years. In about 1500 BC Hebrew, or Jewish, tribes began to enter the area. They later came into conflict with a people of Greek origin known as the Philistines. It is from them that the term Palestine is derived.

 

 

IRAN: After the Iranian Revolution in 1979 toppled the government of the Shah, the Mujahadeen Khalq soon began a bloody guerrilla war against the new Islamic government. The Mujahadeen are currently based in Iraq and conduct cross-border raids into Iran, as well as conducting urban guerrilla operations in the cities and conducting political assassinations. Iran occasionally launches raids against Khalq bases in Iraq.

 

 

KOSOVO: The ethnic Albanian KLA (Kosovo Liberation Army) in this Serbian province fought a guerilla war against Serbia to claim the region. Beginning in February 1999, Albanians were forced out of the province, prompting NATO to attack Serbia. By July 1999 Serb troops were forced out of Kosovo, only to open an avenue for Albanian Kosovars to attack Serb Kosovars. The Albanian Muslims have since burned down dozens of centuries-old Christian churches. In an effort to establish a Greater Albania, Albanian Muslim rebels also launched attacks in Macedonia.

 

 

NIGERIA: There are violent religious clashes in the city of Kaduna in northern Nigeria beginning February 21 2004 and have continued. Kaduna is the second largest city in the north. The clashes followed a march by tens of thousands of Christians to protest the proposal to introduce Muslim sharia law as the criminal code throughout Kaduna state. Reports speak of rival armed gangs of Christians and Muslims roving the streets. Churches and mosques have been put to the torch. Corpses were seen lying in the streets and people's bodies hanging out of cars and buses, apparently killed while attempting to flee the violence. Local human rights workers said that more than 400 had been killed as a result of the clashes.

 

 

SUDAN: The largest country in Africa, has been plagued by a succession of unstable civilian and military governments since it gained independence in 1956 from an Anglo-Egyptian condominium. The long-running conflict continues between the Arab Muslim northerners of Sudan, (the base of the government), and the African Christians of the south. In the mid-90s Sudan was home to Osama bin Ladin, the international terrorist responsible for the World Trade Center attack. It is estimated that more than 1,2 million people have been killed in the Sudan war, brining devastation to the Sudanese economy.

 

 

UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: At war with terrorism.

 

 

PHILIPPINES: The Phillipines armed forces, with assistance of US troops, are fighting Moslem rebels - they have been linked to Osama bin Laden's el Qaeda terrorist group - on the southern islands of the country. Muslim rebel groups seek autonomy/independence from the mostly Christian Philippines. One rebel group, the Abu Sayaf Group, is believed linked to Osama bin-Laden's Al-Qaida. This connection, plus their tactic of kidnapping and beheading Americans, led the United States to send Special Forces to aid the Philippine Army.

 

[Hunt 11]

To try to summarize...BSA's concept seems to be that all people who believe in a supreme being (or beings) have something important in common--something that helps them be the best kind of citizens, appreciate nature better, etc. As evidenced by some of the posts in this thread, this can be difficult to grasp by some people with strong views of the truth of their own religion and the utter depravity of all other relgions. So maybe scouting can help people learn how it is possible to respect other people and their right to their beliefs, while still maintaining our own convictions.

[packsaddle 753]

NJCubScouter, About the Wheeler thing...h'mmm, interesting thought.

 

Jason OK, That last post was unusually lucid and well-written. What was the source for your plagiarism?

 

Edited part, responding to Hunt: I share your sense of fairness in this. However, I am not sure how the BSA program would achieve the goal you articulate, given the highly variable views displayed in the volunteers who would actually bring the program to the boys.(This message has been edited by packsaddle)

[Jason OK 10]

Hunt,

 

I agree. That is the more Scouting way.

 

 

[packsaddle 753]

Nevermind, found it. You can save space in the future by merely posting the link:

http://www.homestead.com/prosites-prs/14muslimconflicts.html

[firstpusk 10]

 

packsaddle: "Jason OK, That last post was unusually lucid and well-written. What was the source for your plagiarism?"

 

MUSLIM ON-GOING CONFLICTS IN THE WORLD

COMPILED BY MICHAELSAVAGE.COM

http://www.homestead.com/prosites-prs/14muslimconflicts.html

 

pack, I am not sure I would call much of anything Michael Savage says is lucid beyond, "Good morning, my name is Michael Savage."

 

Jason OK, very bad form. If you take text verbatim from a source, it should be cited. If it is an entire internet page, the URL should be listed. To do any less than that is considered dishonest.

 

Beyond the fact that there is a lot fighting going on in the world, your point was what?

[acco40 95]

Forum quiz: What do you find more boorish?

 

a) A "born again" Christian spouting off about his new found enlightenment.

 

b) A former smoker lecturing about the evils of smoking.

 

c) A former (recovering?) alcoholic blathering on about John Barleycorn?(This message has been edited by acco40)

[firstpusk 10]

You forgot to put d)all of the above...;^)

[packsaddle 753]

As I responded to the drop-dead-beautiful woman at the Atlanta airport who asked me if I was comfortable being searched by a woman,

"Is this a trick question?"

[Rooster7 11]

Hunt and Packsaddle,

 

I dont know about you, but I can keep my commitment to the BSA as a leader and maintain my passion for truth. The two are not necessarily mutually exclusive.

 

[ScouterPaul 11]

I am sorry to say that I have failed to act in a scout-like fashion by allowing myself to be drawn into a mudslinging debate. I would like to apologize to any and all if I have offended them.

 

I would especially like to apologize for my feeble attempt at humor in the posting that was referenced by Jason OK.

 

YIS

 

Paul

[Jason OK 10]

If you are sponsored or chartered by a church maybe you should think about your belief system and reflect if that honors that organizations charity towards you.

 

I have tried to defend my beliefs. You have compared me to people that kill. I have never wanted to harm anyone. This is why I chose to defend my religion by this comparison. Remember the only man that never sinned was Jesus. Go ahead and bash me for talking about my new found faith. Are you better because your faith is old? Or are you better because you think my faith is wrong. My argument is this. If you believe in Christ.....and you choose to pick out parts of the bible to make your life more livable......I understand I did that for almost 10 years. Depeche Mode wrote the song "Strange Love" And I used to chuckle when I heard (I give in to sin because I have to make this life livable) It doesn't mean that your right. Yes I have only been saved truly for the past year.....but it is not a new found faith. I just started to truly live my life for Christ. Just being reverent and going to church does not mean you're OK with God. I can respect those who choose differently. When Christians world wide start killing people on the offense I will change my mind.

 

I am beginning to think the hate being shown against me is the same as the Democrats show towards Republicans. I have not done any Democrat bashing yet. And I rather Not. So if your misguided anger is directed at me because we are not a MOB RULE DEMOCRACY.....please reflect upon yourself. FACE IT PEOPLE. We are a Republic and democracy only truly exists on the very local level. YES Bush did win the election so deal with your anger in your vote not at other republicans.

 

As far as Michael Savage goes.....are you telling me none of that has ever been on TV, in the news paper.....so on and so on. And concerning Feminazi....Rush never coined the phrase. You guys are bashing me because I present facts that can be verified in more than one news article? If you like I will be more than happy to research and verify everything I posted concerning the HOLY WAR Muslims are waging. I respect Muslims that choose not to kill. But when most of the Muslim population though out the world rather see us dead....well. Must I say more....because brother whether you worship Christ or NOT they do NOT care! You are as dead as I would be in their eyes. Aren't you glad we live in a nation were we can disagree like this? Where no one will behead us for this?

 

[Jason OK 10]

I am reposting this.

 

Saddlepack,

 

listen....your web link saying Christians are skin heads & nazis is wrong.

 

ScouterPaul,

As far as the abortion bombings....I can count those people on one hand. They will be judged before God for what they did. And I think what they did was wrong. But abortion has already killed millions of children. Anyone see the new 3D technology on the news last night? They can see the baby (12 weeks) yawning, making facial expressions..... Abortion is MURDER.

 

[Guest OldGreyEagle]

So, what is the implication? That Islam isn't a true religion because some of its members make war? I lost the train of thought amidst the trash talking