Liz 101 Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 I've got a question, as a parent of an OA member, not particularly as a Scouter, and I'm not an OA member myself. Here's the situation: My sons are both in the OA. Our local OA group has a North American Culture and Ceremonies Seminar coming up in a few weeks. My kids both said initially that they didn't want to go. Then I found out they just didn't want to pay for it, because they're saving up for something else (and only one other boy in their troop is attending, and he'll be working at the event so not much time to hang out together). While I honor their fiscal choices, I feel it would be a valuable opportunity for them, so I decided to offer to pay for it *just this year*. If they love it, I figure, they'll prioritize it next year in their budget; if they don't, then they don't need to go again. My younger son jumped at the opportunity and said he'd go. He's very excited about it. My older son, on the other hand, said he still doesn't want to go. And... he can't seem to say why. Now, normally I'd just leave it at that. He doesn't have to go if he doesn't want to. But my older son has OCD that seems to be getting worse as he progresses through adolescence. He would deny this, but my observation is that he never wants to do anything he hasn't done before. When he got back from Conclave this fall, he told me he HAD to start putting together a set of Regalia (I know... we still call it that around here). Now he has the opportunity to get started on his Regalia at this conference, paid for by Mom, no less, and for no other reason than "I just want to stay home" he doesn't want to go. I can't figure out any good reason why he wouldn't want to go. He normally jumps at every OA thing that comes along, from camping to service projects to... everything. There was a time when he was ready to drop out of BSA, but didn't because of the OA. But most of the things are things he started doing before the OCD set in -- they're not "new" things, they're things he's done before and knows he enjoys. This falls in the "new" category, so he (predictably) isn't interested. Now... I am considering just telling him he HAS to go. With other, similar situations, this has worked out pretty well and usually he ends up signing up again at the next opportunity. My son is now home-schooled (the OCD was interfering with school), so I told him that if he didn't go voluntarily I might just make it an assignment and then he'd have to write a paper about it. He is trying to decide now whether I was just bluffing or not. And... so am I. I don't know... what do you think? Should I make him go? His personality is such that he should be just fine even if he doesn't really enjoy it... he's well-behaved and not a defiant kid. So I don't think he'll make anybody miserable (except maybe his brother) by being forced to go... and I'm fairly sure that he'll enjoy it. -Liz Link to post Share on other sites
Eagle92 110 Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 I have mixed emotions on this. i don't like forcing anything on anyone, but knowing what fears that OCD can cause, it may be a good idea. These seminars are excellent, especially if they are some of the bigger ones where folks from all over come and teach at. If it's Carolina Indian Seminar, I can pretty much guarantee he will have a great time. I went 2 years ago and want to go again. Being on baby watch last year prevented me from going, and this year is our district banquet. Link to post Share on other sites
Liz 101 Posted January 14, 2009 Author Share Posted January 14, 2009 It's actually in Oregon, but I suspect it's going to be very good. If it weren't for the OCD and what I call anxiety (although he would rather die than admit he's anxious about ANYTHING), I wouldn't even consider forcing him to go. It's just that I'm pretty much convinced that he's being "forced" NOT to do it by his neurological condition. It almost makes me wish to be an OA member myself, so I could just go along with him. He's not a "mamma's boy" by any means, and once we got there I'd probably not even see him again until it was time to go home... but he's generally a lot more open to doing new things when I'm sorta "there" (maybe knowing he will have a ride home if he really really needs it is what makes the difference). Having his brother going helps, too, but apparently not enough this time. If he had more friends from the troop going, I'm sure he'd have very little hesitation. I assume you have to be an OA member to attend these things? It would be so much fun. I'd love to learn to do the crafts and costumes. -Liz Link to post Share on other sites
scoutldr 726 Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 Any Scouting event, including OA, is open to any parent who wants to observe. That is BSA policy. There are no closed meetings or ceremonies (to parents, that is). Link to post Share on other sites
Eagle92 110 Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 SctLedr is correct. Also some of these seminars are open to anyone. I've been to the Carolina Indinan Seminar and the Tiak Lodge Seminar. While the majority of folks were OA, some were not. Heck a lot of the instructors are not active in scouting, let alone the OA. But they have alot of knowledge, especially the dance instructors. I believe one lodge's danceteam has an affiliated Venturing crew as they had a lto of young ladies dancing. Link to post Share on other sites
Liz 101 Posted January 15, 2009 Author Share Posted January 15, 2009 Hmmm. I knew parents were allowed to observe, but I just never thought of exercising that right for something like this. I think I'll talk it over with the boys and see how they'd feel about it. I really hate doing anything that might be construed as being a helicopter parent. On the other hand, I'm honestly very interested in the material for this event, and I also really want my son to go -- voluntarily, if possible. If my attendance means he is more comfortable going, and he would either not go or have to be forced to go if I don't, then it seems like a small price to pay. Shucky-Darn. Looks like I might have to spend a weekend at the beach. -Liz Link to post Share on other sites
Liz 101 Posted January 15, 2009 Author Share Posted January 15, 2009 Well, I finally got: "I guess I'll go if you REALLY want me to go." And, yes, I REALLY want him to go. LOL! I am jealous, though. I might have to tag along if it won't bother him too much. It seems like so much fun! -Liz Link to post Share on other sites
Eagle92 110 Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 Hey, are you an Indian Lore MBC? great excuse to go if your are? Link to post Share on other sites
Liz 101 Posted January 15, 2009 Author Share Posted January 15, 2009 LOL! No, but maybe I'd like to learn something so I could become one? I know almost nothing about Indian Lore... but I probably SHOULD, right? Actually, as a Literature geek I really do feel like Native American story and mythology are a huge gaping hole in my education. Would "Aspiring Indian Lore MBC" count for anything? :-) -Liz Link to post Share on other sites
SR540Beaver 116 Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 Boy, I hate to appear ignorant as an active OA member, but I've never heard of a North American Culture and Ceremonies Seminar. If this is put on by a Native American Tribe/Nation, it isn't really an OA event, but something that OA Lodges utilize for educational purposes. If that is the case, there would be no reason why you couldn't attend as it isn't OA ceremony specific. I live in Oklahoma where we have a large number of Native Americans and I've never been aware of an NACCS. Our Lodge certainly hasn't promoted anything along those lines. I wish they did as my son is a Chapter officer and part of the Chapter ceremonial team. One more question. We use the term "regalia" all the time. Where is it written that we are not supposed to? Link to post Share on other sites
Eagle92 110 Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 SR, Some lodges will put on seminars on Native American culture, i.e dance, singing, as well as OA ceremonies. The biggest being the Indian Summer that was put on by national during one of the recent off years due to NOAC and jambo being moved aroound for the BSA's centenial. Na d they go by different names. can't speak for most of them, but at both the Tiak Lodge Indian Seminar amd Carolina Indian Seminars I've been to, the instructors are top notch. Some are native, some are society member, usually Hethuska and the various Goard Dance societies. Also have with the singers, several have "family" up your way, and they do perform on the powwow circuit. Again good folks. Link to post Share on other sites
NWScouter 9 Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 I thought costume was the no-no. Link to post Share on other sites
Eagle92 110 Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 Costume is the NO NO. Outfits is acceptable, and regalia is the preferred term. "Costumes are what you wear for Holloween." Link to post Share on other sites
Liz 101 Posted January 15, 2009 Author Share Posted January 15, 2009 This event is put on by the OA. There will be workshops on making both Northwest style and Plains style regalia. I think maybe I'll email the guy in charge and just ask whether it would be ok for me to participate. Even if all I'm doing is running transportation, I'd rather not have to make two trips! It's about 2-3 hours away. Regarding the term "regalia," I keep hearing different things from different people about what it's "supposed" to be called. For example, this thread from about a year ago: http://www.scouter.com/forums/viewThread.asp?threadID=184500 "By the way we are no longer allowed per Edict by National to refer to the costumes as 'Regalia'. Do not ask me why. Makes no sense to me." (Crossramwedge) I've heard this here and there in other places, too. Maybe it's an urban scout legend? I don't know. -Liz Link to post Share on other sites
shortridge 184 Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 If National had delivered such an edict, one would think that it would be included on the national Web site, to help get the word out. A search of oa-bsa.org turns up many uses of the word "regalia," so I don't think that what some have heard is true. Link to post Share on other sites
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