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Ok. Let me tell you I am a member of a few organizationss that have secrets. Thy are not "Secret Organizations". They organizationss with ssecrets (ie Master Mason, 32 Scottish Rite, York Rite, Grotto, Shrine, Eastern Star, Royal Order of Scottland and The Order of DeMolay). They all have secrets BUT they are not secret orders. Reason being they all have buildings with signs telling who we are and when we meet. Now the Secrets are the same type that OA has (ie signs words and modes of reconigtion) thats all the secrets that the organizations I mentioned have. I am also a very proud member of the OA.


The main reason for secrets in ALL orders are for Bounding you to that order.

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Ok.To say the Masonic Fraternity has NO purpose is Crazy, Feemasonry spend $3.5 millon a day on their charities. Let me say that again. Freemasonry spends $3.5 million a day on their charities. The Shrine of North America has 22 ortopedic and burn hospitals in North America. When they get a child there it costs the Families of the child NOTHING for the child to stay there the family pays NOTHING for the exlant care they recieve. The Masonic Frternity has a great purpose, as does the Scouting movement. I am a Eagle Scout an very proud member of OA and a 32 degree Master Mason. And a Past Master of my Masonic Lodge.


I am just getting back active with BSA since my son is 7 and now a Tiger Cub. I am loving it.

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if you are not satisfied with your lodge's program stop whining and do something to change it. That's what I'm doing.


I returned to Scouting and the Order a little over 2 years ago after an absence of a decade and a half and wasn't all that pleased at what I saw at my first conclave back. It certainly didn't resemble the conclaves I remembered from my youth. So, when I was offered the position of associate lodge advisor last year, I jumped at the chance to help rejuvenate and improve our lodge. And, through the efforts of alot of good advisors and youth leaders we've taken several bigs steps in the right direction. Things still aren't perfect, but I have high hopes for the coming year.


Roll up your sleeves and help make things better.

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You missed the point.

If QA had a exciting program they would not have to rely on secerts to get people excited about joining.



Where was it said that Masonic Fraternity has NO purpose? WOW!

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Read OldGreyEagles post about 4 post up.


The Order of the Arrow does not rely on secrets to spark interest. It has secrets to alow members to reconize other members when among non members. The secrets are merely symbolic. The OA sole purpose is service.


The bottom line is OA was started to keep the older Scouts Active after they got infected with the "Fumes".



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"The bottom line is OA was started to keep the older Scouts Active after they got infected with the "Fumes". "


Sorry, Champ but that is not even close. First off the OA was started in 1915. The Model T was barely 7 years old. It would be a long time before driving and older scouts would collide.


Read pages 15 through 17 of the OA Handbook for the real history and purpose that started the OA.





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I truly know why the order was established. I also believe there should be a age requirment of 14 yrs to tapped out. I say that for the reason that a young man gets in scouts at 11 yrs old gung ho and quickly attains the rank of 1st lets say in a year. Meets the minimum requirements for nights spent under the stars. Is he a "Honored Camper" because he has fulfilled the requirements?


I have the same opinion of a young man getting his eagle before he is 15.

I was 16 when I recieved mine. I believed that it helped me to be that age. I could have gotten at probably 14 1/2 but my father slowed my progress up so I would not lose interest.

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Order of the Arrow program, hmmm, let's see.


Lodge conclaves, section conclaves, leadership possibilities from the chapter to the national level, important roles at summer camp (at least in my lodge), ceremony teams, multiple lodge and chapter committees, camp promotions, training of all kinds, National Order of the Arrow Conference, National Leadership Seminar, special high adventure opporunities at Philmont and the other high adventure bases, Indian Summer, OA Service Corps at national jamborees, fellowship with other Arrowmen, a myriad of service opportunities.


Wow, there really ISN'T anything to the OA program.

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Sorry Champ but you also truly believed that it was started to keep older boys in scouting, and it wasn't.


It takes more than camping and rank, it takes character and the approval of your Scoutmaster and peers. If a person meets those requirements What difference does it make if he is 13 or 14?


Why 14 what change takes place in that age group that would suddenly make a difference?





Clearify something for me please.


Here are two quotes from you. Which is correct.


"My Father Pushed and Pushed and Pushed me until I got my Eagle."


" I could have gotten at probably 14 1/2 but my father slowed my progress up so I would not lose interest.


Were you pushed or held back?

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My father pushed me and when he needed to let up he did. He pushed me to do something that he was 3 merit badges away from completing. I was very entergetic and could have finished it alot earlier than I did. He and my mother wanted to get all I could out of scouting. I am now giving back to scouting what I recieved from it. I kick myself everytime I think about getting inactive but when my 7 year old came home and dad I want to join Cub Scouts I renewed a old love that is 18 years removed.


What changes at 14 that are not there at 12 is tenure and maturity. I was tapped out when I was 15 one of the greatest things that happened to me in scouting. I know from experiance with another youth organization that I am envolved in that the difference in maturity, when you are 12 and 14 is light years. I also know that because I have a 15 year old daughter that will be Worthy Advisor of her Rainbow assembly in January. To think about her being in that position 2 1/2 years ago she would have been over her head.


I had wanted to be a Dancer since the time I witness the dancers when I was 8 yrs old at a Scout Show.


The one advantage my son will have is that his father will teach and let him dance with the OA dance team and a Indian Assoc. that we belong to. My father did not get in OA until I tapped him and my brother out on the same night and placed the sash around their shoulders the night of their Ordeal.


Now my father pushed me but he knew when to let up. I say this about the age because I have a Nephew that was ready to recieve his Eagle at 13 and now he is 17 and he has not yet recieved it because of a argument he got into with his Scout Master. I have tried and tried and tried to get my brother to push him but he won't. Now he is a Freshmen in College (graduated early) and very active in Drama at the Univ. Of Memphis and lost interest in BS.

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But Champ OA is not a leadership position. It is a service opportunity and a recognition of scouting ideals.


Is it your opinion that a 14 year old can represent the Oath and Law but a 13 year old cannot? Can a 14 year old give selfless service but a 13 year old cannot? What does an arbitrary age limit have to do with the purpose of the OA.



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