Give and Inch; Take a Mile

[hops_scout 9]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080304/ap_on_re_us/harvard_women_s_hours

 

By MARK PRATT, Associated Press Writer

Tue Mar 4, 6:40 PM ET

 

 

 

BOSTON - In a test of Harvard's famed open-mindedness, the university has banned men from one of its gyms for a few hours a week to accommodate Muslim women who say it offends their sense of modesty to exercise in front of the opposite sex.

 

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The policy is already unpopular with many on campus, including some women who consider it sexist.

 

"I think that it's incorrect in a college setting to institute a policy in which half of the campus gets wronged or denied a resource that's supposed to be for everyone," said student Lucy Caldwell, who also wrote a column in The Harvard Crimson newspaper critical of the new hours.

 

Student Ola Aljawhary, who is Muslim and works out elsewhere on campus but is not one of the women who requested the change, rejected that argument.

 

"The majority should be willing to compromise," she said. "I think that's just basic courtesy. We must show tolerance and respect for all others."

 

The trial policy went into effect Feb. 4, about a month after a group of six Muslim women, with the support of the Harvard College Women's Center, asked the university for the special hours, spokesman Robert Mitchell said.

 

"We get special requests from religious groups all the time and we try to honor them whenever possible," he said, noting that the school has designated spaces for Muslim and Hindu students to pray.

 

No men are allowed in the gym between 3 p.m. and 5 p.m. on Mondays, and between 8 a.m. and 10 a.m on Tuesdays and Thursdays. Even the staff during those times is all women.

 

The special hours allow the Muslim women, who adhere to traditional dress codes by covering their hair and most of their skin while in public, to dress more appropriately for exercising, said Susan Marine, director of the women's center.

 

"It's a pretty big breach of their moral and religious code for a man to see them with their hair uncovered and it's just not possible for them to be in a mixed environment," she said.

 

When student Kareem Shuman showed up to work out at the gym on Monday, he was turned away but didn't mind.

 

"Knowing it was requested by women of my faith it's very understandable to me," said Shuman, 21, who figured he'd just come back later for his workout.

 

Other men find the new hours inconvenient. Nick Wells, a junior who wrote an opinion piece in the Crimson criticizing the policy, suggested setting aside one room for women.

 

"It's not that I am opposed to the idea of helping people in religious groups or women in general, but I just think Harvard is not being fair to people like me who live (near the gym)," Wells said in an interview.

 

The policy only applies to one gym, a facility mainly used for intramurals. Because of its location at the edge of campus, it is the university's least used gym, Mitchell said.

 

The women-only hours are of minimal inconvenience because they are just six out of the 70 hours a week the gym is open, Marine said.

 

"Harvard has a moral and ethical responsibility to make sure our students can stay healthy," she said.

 

An Associated Press reporter who went to the gym Monday did not see any Muslim women entering. Efforts to reach some of the women who requested the policy through the Women's Center were unsuccessful.

 

The policy will be reviewed at the end of the semester, Mitchell said.

 

Kent Blumenthal, executive director of the National Intramural-Recreational Sports Association, which has 660 member colleges and universities nationwide, said he could not think of any other institution with a similar policy.

 

"It seems in some ways contrary to the purpose of campus recreational programs, which is all about access," he said.

 

Harvard's policy is no different from commercial gyms that cater partially or even exclusively to women, said Ibrahim Hooper, a spokesman for the Washington-based Council on American-Islamic Relations.

 

"The Muslim bashers portray it as the world coming to end, but if women have a couple hours a week to work out in private, I don't see it as a major issue," he said.

[Gunny2862 11]

I really think it's interesting that the Male Muslims don't request a similar "male-only" time so they aren't distracted by all of the Non-Muslim women working out in their "immodest" apparel.

 

 

 

And, that now that they've got the time slot approved,(from the article) that an observer has noted that it's not being used during the time it is reserved.

"An Associated Press reporter who went to the gym Monday did not see any Muslim women entering. Efforts to reach some of the women who requested the policy through the Women's Center were unsuccessful."

 

Of course the question could be asked "Did he see any women entering the gym, and if so how could he know if they were Muslim or not? Just because they don't wear the hijab doesn't mean they aren't Muslim and might still want to work out in less clothing than they would wear in front of men.

Or, "Was there a Muslim holy day that precluded their work out that day?" It wouldn't be Ramadan, that's not until September-October this year.

[evmori 11]

Are Muslim women allowed to do this type of activity?

 

It strikes me that when Americans go to other countries we are supposed to fit into their society but when people from other countries come to America, they don't.

 

Ed Mori

1 Peter 4:10

[scoutldr 726]

We are expected (nay, required) to "value diversity". The rest of the world doesn't.

[Merlyn_LeRoy 72]

No, you aren't "required" to value diversity; have you already forgotten that the BSA kicks out gays and atheists?

[Gunny2862 11]

True, BSA does exclude some.

 

My question is whether Muslims are likewise excluded? I don't think so.

I thought they were starting Muslim Troops in Baghdad.

 

And if they actually buy into the Scout Oath and Law, how can that be bad?

[Merlyn_LeRoy 72]

If Iraqi scouting takes a page from the BSA and interprets their oath & law to necessarily exclude Jews (in the same way the BSA insists they must exclude gays and atheists), I don't think that would be an improvement, nor would the BSA be in any morally superior position to criticize them for it. After all, if the BSA gets to interpret their oath & law to exclude gays and atheists, Iraqi scouting could interpret their oath & law to exclude Jews, or Sunni Muslims, or Shiite Muslims, or pretty much anyone else. And still advertise themselves as open to "all boys," like the BSA.

[scoutldr 726]

Let me clarify...I am a federal government employee. I am "required" to value diversity. I am required to take annual training on diversity. My job performance is graded on it. I am required to take part in Black History Month, Pacific Islander History Month, Women's History Month, etc. I am required to justify not hiring minorities, even though I am in a highly-specialized scientific field and no minorities ever make the "qualified" list from which I must choose.

 

I'm still wondering why the minority groups are not required to celebrate "German-American History Month".

[scoutingagain 20]

Actually Muslim units are among the fastest growing BSA units here in the USA, at least in this area.

 

As far as the article goes, I would assume that everyone that supports BSA's right to free association based on religious and moral beliefs would support Muslim women in their desire to enjoy the same right.

 

SA

[CalicoPenn 729]

I don't get the point of this thread. It seems like it's just tossed out there for folks to pounce on with their mysogynistic and anti-Muslim views like a pack of ravenous hyenas.

 

Calico

[hops_scout 9]

Why are the Muslims considered "special" in this country? We seem to give them whatever they want. We don't do that for other religions.

[evmori 11]

So if the gym is reserved & those who it is reserved for aren't using it, why is it reserved?

[Gunny2862 11]

Merlyn, Straw-man, I expect better from you.

 

Scoutldr, feel your pain. But not a Scoutlike sentiment, but this is issues and politics.

 

Calico-Penn, other than a portion of one of mine(if you take it other than how I meant it), where are you getting misogyny? And how is anything I've said anti-Islam? One point of possible incongruity/sexisim but not anti-/Islam.

 

 

[Merlyn_LeRoy 72]

I agree, Calico. As for my opinion on carving out exceptions based on religion, I think it would be far better to just allow ANY group to reserve a gym for a period of time. Scoutldr, as a federal employee, nondiscrimination is part of your job description. And how are you required to "take part" in, say, black history month?

[Merlyn_LeRoy 72]

Gunny, it isn't a straw man, because I'm not saying the Iraqi scouting association is actually doing that. I'm just pointing out they could, using the same reasoning the BSA uses to kick out gays and atheists.