"I'm alright Jack"

[Eamonn 61]

I really enjoy working with the Scouts and the adults in our Ship.

If someone needs a hand, I'll do what I can to be a good Scout and help.

I do believe in God.

I'm not gay.

I'm more concerned about trying to raise money for the Ship than what a SE earns.

I've never been to Chicago, been to Disney in Florida and don't have any real desire to go back. That might change when I get grandkids? I have used Delta Airlines and Atlanta Airport, but that's about all I've seen of Atlanta.

Sure there are things I'd like to see changed and I hope that they do get changed.

Yes I know that this may sound like I'm sticking my head in the sand, but right now I'm alright Jack and I'm having a good time -Thanks for asking.

Eamonn.

[jkhny 10]

You're not sticking your head in the sand if you're wondering how Council costs come out to $239 a kid......

 

Seems like more than a few people wonder about just what the paid staff really do to support Scouting and volunteers.....

 

Many of those with questions in the back of their heads are just lucky enough not to have gotten in a SE who throws their weight aroung and treats the volunteers like serfs..... If it happens to you, you may be wondering about alot more than what Council money gets spent on.

 

Here Camping and activities revenue more than covers Camping and activities costs. I expect that's typical. Other expenses aren't all that high. Salaries, benefits, travel expenses and expenses directly related to staff are more than half the budget. Many volunteers DO believe that the only thing professionals do is raise money to pay their own salaries. That is the only time you're likely to see a DE around here.

 

But look beyond your local Council. BSA National is sitting on half a billion dollars. That's only in the National Council. GO look at other filings under BSA Disability Trust Fund, BSA Foundation and Learning for Life.

 

Look at the salaries paid at the National level - and benefits. Sorry but nobody can justify what National pays out in salaries. Even the non-profit world is raising questions about excessive compensation - and Williams package was over $900,000 in 2004?!?!

That makes him one of the best paid Non-profit CEO'S in the country - and he's done what? As another pointed out - any CEO in an organization that's had the failures and scandals BSA has had in the past few years would have been fired a long time ago.

 

So, what DOES National do? Seriously, how often has the basic program been revised? It's sad how old some of the stuff is. Just what does National do to justify its expense? There are more than enough references to how well paid staff live in Texas. Comments about new cars given as retirement gifts. Pretty good gig working for BSA National.

 

Meanwhile, "front-line" DE's are poorly paid - though they spend little time actually helping units. Office staff could use real help given the state of most records and accounts.

 

And what DO SE's really spend their time on? They are pretty well paid. In some Councils the SE is a third of the salary budget making more than double the next highest paid employee. I don't know too many other organizations with that kind of salary structure. Some are outrageously well paid - far more than any volunteer leaders. And every leader I know is laying out some serious $ from their own pocket supporting Scouting.

 

The paid staff are supposed to serve the volunteers but just try asking what your SE makes at an open meeting and see the reaction. The current culture among the paid staff views volunteers as employees - cheap labor that's readily replaced. Except they're not. TRY and find good volunteer leaders ......it's not easy.

[Kahuna 172]

Again, I think you are right on, Eamonn. While it doesn't hurt to be aware of what's going on nationally in the BSA, it all comes down to what you do in your unit. If you train your youth and guide them to have a good program, you have done your bit in the world.

 

There will always be plenty of folks who will be watching National or Chicago or Atlanta and I am sorry for the volunteers who have had to fight the battles, but for the most part there isn't much I can do about it. I can do something about Sea Scouting in Hawai'i.

 

BTW, sorry you didn't like Disney. It's one of my favorite places.

[BrentAllen 10]

Hey jkh - would you like some cheese with that whine?

 

If you don't know what your SE and DE is doing, then you have no right to complain about what they are making! I am on the phone with my DE at least once a week. The list of things he helps me and our units with is too long to list. He is at every Roundtable, attends our Cub Aquatics and Day Camp. Helps plan the programs, set up schedules, etc... I can't imagine trying to run our programs without him. Maybe I'm just lucky with the staff we have. He is Wood Badge trained - we attended the same course.

 

jkh - what have you asked your DE to do? How has he/she let you down? What requests have you made of the staff that has been neglected? I won't hold my breath waiting for an answer, since you can never answer a direct question.

 

If you go into any business or organization meeting and start asking people what they make, in front of others, you are going to get a cold shoulder from all of them.

There are some really good things happening in Scouting. Come on out in the sunshine - you might like it.

[jkhny 10]

Have been involved for 10 years. Brought a unit back from the dead with no help from paid staff who - literally - showed up only to do FOS. Our current SM will say the same. We use Council for patches.

Council never returns calls, lots of luck trying to get the simplest corrections to records. Even paying for summer camp is - quoting the leader who went up to Council to do so - "a pain.... it's like they don't want to take your money." I'm one of the best known Scout Leaders in my community - and was pretty involved in District. like many others, I'm no longer involved outside my own unit. Have written some pretty hefty checks to Scouting - now they go only to local units where I know they directly benefit boys.

 

All Council cares about is signing up as many kids as you can and selling popcorn. Not what Scouting is about to me.

 

I've seen a rich Council looted of assets - used to fund operating expenses - mainly salaries for paid staff that we never see. Too many questionable things - properties selling for half the original price to someone connected to someone - and subsequently resold for far more. We have two places left - one hours away. The othere operating under a conservation easement for swampland. Rocks, swamps and stagnant lakes are all that's left. You'd be furious too if you saw what we once had.

 

Paid staff and hand-picked "leaders" at the Council level have squandered the resources of a once strong Council, alienated volunteer leaders and the support base for Scouting and presided over a continual decline in Boy Scouting. GSA has more than twice our membership - their head makes 2/3's of what our SE is paid.

 

Council leadership would rather boost "total served" counts with bribes to sign up kids who don't stay and sell off all they can and fund operations trhough trust fund income...... but since they've alineated so many, fundraising has tanked..... no amount of popcorn can make up for a 35% drop in donations in 2 years. FOS is budgeted at 20% less than last year - a tacit admission that people refuse to donate. Over 400 adults have walked away. No enrollment numbers have been released for 8 months - after the Board was challenged on enrollment claims. Scouting isn't serving "over 10,000 youth" - we showed less than 7,000 in an internal report. Paid staff has turned over almost completely - even they're fed up. In his previous Council DE's simply quit BSA completely to get away.

 

All clear warning signs things are very wrong. They tried to organize COR's to oust leadership..... lot's of luck. There's a reason BSA structures things this way. Many believe the damage is deliberate - a prelude to merging us out of existence. Force out all the old volunteers who'd object.

 

We've already lost too many of our best leaders. They've gotten fed up and left. Tired of fighting an "unwinnable" fight. Speak out and get thrown out - it's happened here too. Why SHOULD anyone stay around?

[sst3rd 129]

Eamonn,

 

The unit is where the action is. That's where the Scouts benefit. That's where my efforts go.

 

 

jkhny,

 

You are bitter. Spin all you want. Use your resources up complaining and whining. I'm not saying you're not right. You don't like the way things are, but obviously can't do anything about it. You are spinning your wheels. If this is how you want to spend your energy, have at it. Our Council is doing okay. It's not perfect, but we get the support across the board that we unit leaders need. That's it. Our units are doing well.

 

WWW

 

sst3rd

[packsaddle 753]

Eamonn, I agree with what sst3rd says regarding the unit. As far as Disney World goes, Sea World is far better. As for Atlanta, the airport is big but efficient and I like it. The city? They have a decent aquarium, just opened, and a so-so amusement park off I20. And the Fox Theatre is nice. And it is the only city I know where you can drive right through the middle at 100mph and get passed. But the rest of the place is a monument to unplanned sprawl. No redeeming value whatsoever. Especially that stadium where they lose games all summer.

Oh yeah, a really big rock out near Stone Mountain, GA.

[BrentAllen 10]

Come on, PS, be fair. "decent aquarium?" It's only the largest aquarium in the world! Very cool! The best I've seen, and I've seen a few around the world.

You didn't mention Fernbank Museum, with the IMAX theater. The zoo isn't the greatest, but the Cyclorama is one of a kind!

And the Braves don't lose all summer - they win then, but find a way to lose in September/October, when it really counts.

You need to come visit Dunwoody, and see what can happen when you have a very strong Homeowners Association. All you need is strong leaders with a vision - gee, where have I heard that before?

[packsaddle 753]

Heh, heh, Brent I would have been disappointed if you hadn't ridden to the rescue. Yes, Fernbank is very nice and the aquarium is indeed the finest on earth. And I didn't mention some good schools in the area. And you're right about the Braves losing when it's important, but then, I also root for the Mets (my entire team sucks).

I remember going to the Omni back when you could smell Maravich socks across the court. Those were the days.

But you know I'm right about the uban planning, ahem, or lack thereof. The place is like a fungus spreading across the landscape.

[Rooster7 11]

Since we are discussing Atlanta, perhaps kudzu would be a better analogy than fungus ;-)

[packsaddle 753]

Kudzu? I'm just sorry I didn't think of it first!

[seabear 10]

It's a Pirates Life for Me!

Most of my ship mates are there.

Yes , it is the youth that we serve where our efforts should be placed, for what is scouting...

If tommorrow BSA disappeares, the concept of scouting will still be here , the principles and the practices, the skills and lore. There will still be boys wanting to explore, to learn to grow; there will still be adults that would give up their time and efforts to help out these youth.

As for me, I still enjoy watching the boys grow into men, love the smell of woodsmoke in the mornin

a spot of tea while watching the sun set.

I sometime still bang my head against the wall sometimes, but it only gives me a headache. My concern is for the kids, what else is needed to be said.