Discrimination Against Me.

[Eamonn 61]

There is a lot of threads in the Issues and Politics group, that seem to be so closely related I at times was unsure which thread I was in.

Sad to say there is a lot of things that are being said that are not in keeping with:A Scout is kind.Which is a shame and would if I were a parent thinking about allowing my kid to join Scouting make me rethink the whole idea.

These forums are a place for Scouter's to discuss Scouting.

At present to be a Scouter in the BSA you have to believe in God and not be an avowed homosexual. If you don't meet these requirements you can't be a Scouter and really have no business here.

I know that I would never meet the requirements for membership into the World's Woman's Christian Temperance Union. I am not a Woman and do enjoy the odd alcoholic beverage every now and then. I suppose I could ask them to change the rules and allow me in, but somehow I think I would be wasting my time.

I could point out that Men can do as good a job as Women at raising kids, cooking, washing, nursing and being Astronauts. I might point out that some of the most gifted men that lived on the planet were complete alcoholics and I have spoken with guys who can put their hand on their heart and claim they drive better after drinking a six pack. If that failed I could point out how many people the alcoholic beverage trade employs and how much money is spent ensuring drinkers drink responsibly.

Yes this is about as daffy as I could make it.

But if you don't meet the requirements to join or remain in the BSA, please do me a big favor and leave.

Eamonn.

 

[scoutldr 732]

Do you mean leave Scouting or leave the forums? The rules you quote are those of the Boy Scouts of America, Inc. They are not the rules of this forum, which is privately owned and sponsored. We are all here by invitation of the forum owner, and remain here due to his generosity. Miss Manners will always tell you that if you are invited to a party, it is the height of rudeness to inquire who else will be there before you accept the invitation. Once there, if one finds people to whom one does not wish to be pleasant, the only proper thing to do is thank the host, excuse oneself and leave. There is no one on this forum that I would want to leave because of their beliefs or opinions, because they have caused me to re-examine my own beliefs and convictions more closely. That was valuable to me, even if I cannot agree with their opinions or adopt their lifestyle as my own. There are some I wish would leave because of their rudeness, arrogance and just plain nastiness, however. But alas, it's not my party and I am not granted the right to choose the guests.

[SemperParatus 1]

I joined only four months ago and have enjoyed my time here, helping others as best as I can and learning from the experiences of others. It has only been in the last three weeks or so that the unkindness level on this forum has been ratcheted up significantly. I will leave you to conclude why that has happened. IMO, this change is not the result of non-Scouters posting here, but rather certain Scouters.(This message has been edited by SemperParatus)

[Fuzzy Bear 12]

Eamonn,

 

You just tried to wish it all away.

 

I am not sure but I think that is a first, at least here.

 

Just as a reminder, there are better alternatives.

 

FB

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Eamonn 61]

Hi scoutldr

At the bottom of the page you will read:

This is a private community provided by SCOUTER Network

and reserved for Scouting related discussions.

If someone does not meet the requirements laid down by the BSA or the requirements laid down by the Scout Organization of the country in which they live they are not Scouter's. It kinda goes hand in hand with "Is the Pope Catholic?" You are not and can not be a Gay Scouter in the BSA, nor can you be an atheist.

I wonder what Miss Manners has to say about gatecrashers?

SCOUTER-Terry, our host posted:

Remember, when you post here you are not just participating in a discussion, but creating a searchable archive of ideas and resources that will be used for years to come. Nearly a hundred thousand people a month use this web site, and the "living archive" of content you're helping create will be here long after many members leave. How beneficial will your mark be to those who follow?

(Posted: Friday, 7/9/2004: 7:40:00 PM )

While many of us who are members of the BSA in good standing do at times use these forums to vent or let off steam, there are those who are using the forum to bash the heck out of Scouting and the BSA.

I have to admit to not reading the works of Miss Manners. What does she say about the guests who come to the party uninvited and then do nothing but complain about the party that they were never a part of in the first place?

SemperParatus

I for one have enjoyed your postings and I believe that you have indeed helped others in the time you have been here.I don't know about the past three weeks? I think the level of unkindness over the past three days has been really horrible.

If there are hundred thousand people a month looking in on this site don't we as Scouter's have a duty to be loyal to the BSA and show these hundred thousand people that we are trying to live up to the standards laid down in the Scout Oath and Law?

Eamonn

 

 

[dsteele 20]

I'm with Eamonn on this one.

 

Unc.

[Eamonn 61]

Hey Unc,

No Chives??

Eamonn.

[Bob White 20]

Would you mind if I stood with you also Eamonn?

 

BW

[Eamonn 61]

Sure Bob we will just make the circle a little wider.

Eamonn.

[Bob White 20]

Leave room for FScouter and TheScout, I am betting they will want in as well.

[KoreaScouter 13]

Hey, Eamonn, Bob, and UncleGuinea:

 

I'm left-handed -- do you guys mind scooting a little to the right on the log for me, so I don't smack you accidentally with my elbow?

 

KS

[Prairie_Scouter 10]

I thought that the Issues and Politics forum was EXACTLY the place where discussions like this were to be held. Saying I don't agree with a BSA policy doesn't mean they are being "slammed". I see people here saying things like "BSA is out of touch"; I don't see anyone calling them names or anything disrespectful. As a matter of fact, I agree with BSA National on probably 99% of their policies. Their policies on gays implies things about that group that are largely open to debate. I don't agree with that policy; that's the sort of thing I thought we were here to discuss and banter about. Yet, there are those here who aren't satisfied with just disagreeing; they have to go on to impune people's integrity. I don't mind being told I'm wrong; that's part of the debate. It's not enough to be told I'm wrong; I have to be accused of "making things up".

 

Discussions can be held while still remaining civil. I see it all the time on other forums. Maybe that's not possible here.

 

I thought we were all interested in making Scouting the best that it can be. Much of what's discussed here is theoretical because BSA is not going to easily change. But nothing will ever change if no one is willing to talk about it in a civil manner. Maybe those who dominate here have no interest in change, and so feel the need to shout down anyone who disagrees with them.

 

Is a bit of civility and politeness too much to ask?

 

For the record, In My Opinion, BSA National is a political organization espousing the agenda of a group that may not be the majority of Scouters. In My Opinion, the local units represent the real value of Scouting. I have supported that for years and will continue to do so. It is the best program for youth anywhere that I have seen. And, I do meet the requirements for membership.

[scoutldr 732]

Eammon,

 

I respect your experience and have thoroughly enjoyed your postings and musings over the years. Your charming British accent is evident even in your writing and I am happy you chose to live among us revolutionaries on this side of the pond. However, I must respectfully disagree. If the host allows a guest into the house and the moderators choose to allow him to stay, it's rude for us fellow guests to disagree. They are far from "gatecrashers". They are admitted guests, just like you and me. Like the BSA, the forum owner admits members according to his own standards, some of which may be ambiguous or contradictory to the rest of us, not unlike the BSA membership standards. Like many have been told on this forum, if we don't care for the kind of party the host is throwing, we are free to decline to attend...politely. Perhaps you've hit on the root cause of our angst...the art of manners is being lost because people choose not to care about others' feelings or opinions. That's sad.

 

Perhaps a valid BSA registration number should be required for admission?

 

I agree with Prairie. The Issues and Politics section was started for the reason of moving the heated non-scouting debates to their own section. People are free to avoid that section if they find it distasteful, but I think it is no small coincidence that it is one of the most popular forums on Scouter.com. And, my opinion is that, if this is billed as a "SCOUTER" forum, that implies adults over age 18, who can discuss adult issues in an adult manner without risk of offending tender young psyches. At least that was my assumption when I requested admission.

 

(This message has been edited by scoutldr)

[Eagledad 2779]

>>Discrimination Against Me

[Proud Eagle 13]

Hey!

 

I can bring some pointy sticks if someone else can supply the things to roast on them.