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I have several comments, and I am going to stay within the Scout Law....

 

ASM1,

Have you ever heard of linking articles instead of just adding them to scouter.com??? This is a free service, help them a little before they get rid of the site. Also, use a little common sense and abide by the Scout Law here please. Which means no name calling!!!

 

Zahnada

You mention we spend soooo much on our military...

I wonder why?? Only because we are free and so many countries are not. Therefore, we are the best military force in the world, no doubt.

 

Rangers Lead the Way

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hops_scout, I guess you were one of the ones who chose not to read the articles. The links in this article are plain to a blind man. The original link of the souce is www.copvcia.com. But if you took the time to read it before you spoke on it uninformed, you would have known that.

 

ASM1

 

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I dont care what is in those articles, thank you. Some people dont care what the press thinks about how our great (not kidding) president so why should be have to scan through it and scroll past it to get to the bottom? He is the best president we have had since I was born. Of course we have only had three, and I dont remember the first one. So that leaves Clinton and George W. Bush.

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"... And a Child Shall Lead Them..."

 

ASM1, if you can take a moment from your cutting and pasting campaign, you may want to check out previous posts from Hops_Scout. You will find that Hops is either 12 or 13 years old (Sorry if I got that wrong Hops, but I know you are a "younger" scout, then again my son is 17, age is relative)

 

You can insult and pretty much antagonize any adult poster on the internet with your political views, which is your First Amendment right, but when you start to attack a youth, I have to step in and say back off.

 

Perhaps you didnt realize Hops's age, I can understand that, but if you choose this forum to vent, (which again is your first amendment right)it is you who may wish to stay informed as to who your audience is.

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OGE, thanks for that clarification. It explains a lot. ASM1 is obviously passionate about this topic and I sympathize with his passion (I tend to agree with the links idea, though). I suspect most of us are on edge about this and if ASM1 wants to continue to C&P his posts, I'm ok with that too. HopScout is young and will have a lot of time to think and rethink his positions before he is old enough to put it on the line and join up for a trip to Iraq or some other conflict. Unless the verbal exchange gets out of hand, though, I think it is good for everyone to know that honest persons can have sincere, different views. And we all should respect those. In the meantime, I think everyone can share in a hope that this conflict will end sooner than later, our boys will come home safely, and that few lives will be taken on either side.

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Yeah OGE I'm actually 14, but close enough. It doesnt bother me what other people think (that's their right and progative) but it really isnt the right thing to do especially at a scout-oriented website. Everybody, except for maybe that professor at Columbia University who wants US servicemen and women killed in Iraq, want the troops to come home soon. This includes the people who are pro-war.

 

 

Rangers Lead the Way

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When your right. your right. I am sorry. I was indeed wrong for cutting and pasting that article. From now on, I will just include a link. And hops_scout, I commend your intellegence and interest in the topic. My 14 year old just thinks about Magic cards. I doub't he even knows where Iraq is. Keep up the good work.

 

Again, I am sorry guys.

 

ASM1

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I am very interested in this kind of thing because I want to serve my great country in any way possible. Also, the fad that I have gotten into would be making websites about 2 and a half years ago. This I am glad about.

 

 

Rangers Lead the Way

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ASM1:

 

I didn't know until I read your post in another thread that your son is currently deployed in support of OIF. I pray for his quick, safe return, and that of all my friends and co-workers who are there, too. Nobody who's wearing or has worn a uniform is "pro-war" in my experience -- as my aviator buds say, we're the first to arrive at the scene of the accident...colors your perspective.

 

There's been dissent concerning every conflict we've ever been in; this one's no exception. In most cases, only time can put events in their proper perspective. How about letting history judge motives, and we spend our energies now backing our troops and their efforts with a single unified voice?

 

KS

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hops_scout,

 

I felt I owed you a reply.

"You mention we spend soooo much on our military...

I wonder why?? Only because we are free and so many countries are not. Therefore, we are the best military force in the world, no doubt."

 

Actually the United States does not spend "soooo much" on our military. It really only accounts for 3.2% of our GDP. Compare that with Israel at 8.25% or North Korean at over 30%. The real issue is: The US has tons of money. Is humanitarian aide the better use of it or is military support? It can be argued that our military budget keeps other people free (as we attempt to do with the people of Iraq). It enters us into a paradox. Does preparing for war help peace? But it is clear that the cost of one nuclear submarine can have huge impacts on the quality of life in many places. Anyway, it's just a thought.

 

I'm not sure if I understand your logic about why our freedom creates the best military. Maybe I misunderstand.

 

But in any case, this war will be good if it is followed by massive humanitarian aide to the people of Iraq. If this war just reduces the price of American gas, then it loses my support.

 

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Interesting thought Zahnada, what would the world view of the United States be if we funded the Peace Corps with the same gusto we do our military. Now, I am not saying we disarm so please everyone catch your breath.

 

But being from the Woodstock generation, I have to wonder where we would be if we would have stayed in Afghanistan after the Russians pulled out in 1988/89 and helped the Afghans rebuild their country as we are doing now, what a different world we would have.

 

I think it was from a link in this forum I read a UN report (ok, no comments please) from a few years ago where they estimated what it would cost to provide every human on the planet clean water and basic sanitation. The cost then was estimated at $100-120 billion, I think. So outrageously expensive that no one took it any further, just what will this war cost us?

 

I agree with the war, we have to stop those who support terrorism in its tracks. After this is over though, I would like to see the US wage peace with the same vigor we prosecute war

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Interesting thought Zahnada, what would the world view of the United States be if we funded the Peace Corps with the same gusto we do our military. Now, I am not saying we disarm so please everyone catch your breath.

 

But being from the Woodstock generation, I have to wonder where we would be if we would have stayed in Afghanistan after the Russians pulled out in 1988/89 and helped the Afghans rebuild their country as we are doing now, what a different world we would have.

 

I think it was from a link in this forum I read a UN report (ok, no comments please) from a few years ago where they estimated what it would cost to provide every human on the planet clean water and basic sanitation. The cost then was estimated at $100-120 billion, I think. So outrageously expensive that no one took it any further, just what will this war cost us?

 

I agree with the war, we have to stop those who support terrorism in its tracks. After this is over though, I would like to see the US wage peace with the same vigor we prosecute war

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Zahnada,

I wasnt clear about that...

We have a great military, the best in the world by far, because we all like are Constitution and Bill of Rights and so forth therefore we must be ready to defend our freedoms. This became inimint last year with 9/11 and I think we have so far succeeded in Afghanistan.

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OGE, I was well into the second message when I thought, "what the..?" and then I noticed the date. Good one, you got me. I took the first one seriously though. I agree with KS and his words regarding ASM1's son. I think it would be tough for anyone who does not have a son or daughter (there are women over there too) to understand how strongly a father could feel in this situation. For those who are still too young, you should understand that your father would probably feel the same concern about you.

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The biggest expenditure in local and state government is Education and Public Welfare combined- a whopping 59%!!! Civilian safety is 10%,

 

The biggest expenditure for federal government is income security (social security, welfare, humanitarian aid within the US) at a whopping 50%, 19% for National Defense, 14% for "other" and 13% for interest, the last 4% going to health and education.

 

At 50% of the U.S. expense and 59% of the state and local expenses, I think the US spends more on public aid than any other country, short of a pure socialist economy. Our economy is defined as WELFARE CAPITALISM! So what does that tell you? Of course there are some parts of the U.S. economy that have socialist traits, too. And, besides that we aren't operating in a "democracy" either, this is a REPUBLIC government system.

 

Sorry, it's my economist side coming out!

 

As far as the war with Iraq is concerned.... well.... is it really worth it to sit around and argue about it? Congress passed it, and the Senate passed the budget for it, end of story. Anyone who thinks we are in an "unjust war" because of the hypocracy in the UN must be joking. The UN never has and never will govern ANY country in it's membership. Just like NAFTA, WTO and the former GATT, the UN members hold voluntary membership and except for the WTO has no governing policies that hold the U.S. or any other country in it's jurisdiction!

 

And I will take my FREEDOM toast with a side of FREEDOM fries, thank you very much! =)~

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