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What is Morally Straight?

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Pagan means to worship more than one god, yes there are other meanings but this is the one first listed in the dictionary. Wiccans and other pagans do not worship the devil, in fact they don't believe in the devil. Satan is a Judeo-Christian "character" (for lack of a better word).


Wiccans or witches, first rule is to do no harm. Pagans also say prayers. Native American religions are "pagan". Native Americans say prayers, they believe in a Great Spirit. Pagans are not out to convert anyone to their religion. Wiccans are not happy about the Harry Potter books, despite what you hear in the news. It doesn't represent the values they believe in either. They also believe in honesty, integrity, not harming others, and being true to one's self.


I'm no expert, but I thought Baden-Powell believed that everyone needs to have a spiritual belief system and a higher power to believe in. I believe atheists do not believe in a higher power. In some recent readings, I found out more of how our country's founding fathers recognized and respected the faith of others, including Buddhist and Muslims.


What little I know about Wicca, I doubt they would ever want a religious award. :)



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Of course it was tongue in cheek. I do note however that some midwestern state, I think Minnesota or Wisconsin, has hired its first Wiccan chaplain for its prison system. Somebody here in California was asleep at the switch on that one. We are supposed to be in the lead on these things.




I don't really think that scouting is relativistic in all matters. All I was trying to point out is the tension that arises from neutrality on some matters coupled with a declaration of dedication to moral conduct. My sense is that Baden Powell, and the Americans who organized scouting in this country, all recognized that, aside from very particular practices, all religions tend to point in the same direction as far as basic conduct towards others is concerned, and that this should be encouraged.


To answer some of OGE's original questions, past conduct (sins if you prefer) should not automatically preclude anyone from participating. I think we automatically grant a presumption of good intentions and a willingness to adhere to the standards and specific rules of scouting to all comers, until they prove otherwise. The level of trust does have its limits however, with respect to convicted felons, and "avowed homosexuals."


But even in the case of convicted felons there may be positive examples. Supppose you as a scoutmaster were approached by a father who had spent some years in the big house, had found God through a program such as Charles Colson's program, and was bringing his son to join your troop. Suppose further that he had lived an exemplary life subsequent to his incarceration and asked to participate as a volunteer. Would you automatically turn this person down? I think few would answer this question affirmatively.

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The Scout Law is our moral code.


Morally straight means living your life according to the Scout Law.


Eleven year olds grasp this concept at their first Scout meeting yet we Adults argue the point ad nauseum. (as FScouter pointed out in the first response to the origional question)



1. Ask your children what it means and listen to them.

2. Report it here.

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Hi eisely.


Debate and discussion with the intent to solve a problem or make things better than they are is always welcome.


Arguement for the sake of arguement usually proves to do nothing more than increase the concentation of greenhouse gasses in the immediate atmosphere.


Especially methane.

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No! Please not the camo pants issue again!


I'm back to apologize for stepping a little over the line in response to a few of earlier posts in this thread. While I still believe some of the commentary to be ridiculous in nature, there's better ways for me to respond to it.


Actually, I've read with interest the issue at hand of the multitudes of meanings of "morally straight". I truly believe that we're all within the same "ballpark" as far as our own meaning. Yes, morality is defined by us as individuals and by our religious beliefs and upbringing, but we all have certain responsibilities to be good citizens and follow basic written (and unwritten) laws of the land as pertaining to conduct.


I don't believe any of us truly believe that the words "morally straight" were included in the Scout Oath to mean "not homosexual".


When one examines the Twelve Points of the Scout Law, a person who lives his or her life following those points SHOULD be a morally straight person, regardless of religious belief, etc. That person should be able to be trusted, should be obedient, helpful and courteous to others, he or she should be a loyal friend, helpful, courteous, kind, and cheerful in their demeanor, be a brave and thrifty person and practice their religion.


Having good morals means you DON'T do lots of things to which were alluded in this forum, but IMHO, it all goes back to following the Scout Law and being a good, supportive person to your family and your community.

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Yes, morality is defined by us as individuals and by our religious beliefsDear Abby,

Given my upbringing, my morality system says I should hook up with my mother on my eighteenth birthday and yet my god, Isis, advocates that my older sister would be a better choice. Which is more morally straight? Sincerely, Disguised Trousers



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Regarding your comment, "UmmThat would be the Supreme Court."... what?


The Supreme Court ruled that the BSA could set it's own membership standards and, in the case of Dale, ban avowed homosexual Scout leaders (or Scouts) from membership. While that ruling may very well be a result of the definition, "morally straight" certainly wasn't inserted into the Scout Oath to mean "not gay". Way back when it was written, everyone was encouraged to be a gay Scout leader. It simply meant you were happy and cheerful.


Now days, gay Scout leaders are everywhere. My guess is most of us are. But with the dual meaning of the word in today's world, we choose to refer to ourselves as friendly and full of cheer, important ingredients to being morally straight.





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You know what, Dedicated Dad? Your last posting is exactly what I was talking about in one of my posts way back near the beginning of this thread. Commentary like that seems so un-Scout like that I find it hard to believe you would make it in a public forum with other Scouters.


The simple fact you would suggest such a thing is enough to make one pause and wonder about your intentions. I don't believe there is anything in my postings that should lead anyone to say such putrid things here.

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Morally straight - by itself can be interpreted in many different ways. By interpreting the Scout Oath in it's entirity morally straight has a single meaning as defined by God.


"On my honor, I will do my best to do my duty to God and my country."


Ed Mori


Troop 1

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While that ruling may very well be a result of the definition, "morally straight" certainly wasn't inserted into the Scout Oath to mean "not gay". First you said not homosexual and but you meant not glad and happy? I would agree that part of the being morally straight means being cheerful, but I think thats not your what you are trying to convey.

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The simple fact you would suggest such a thing is enough to make one pause and wonder about your intentions. Im glad it got your attention and I apologize to you or anyone who is offended, but I am seeking to demonstrate a greater point about independent or self defined morality, a point you and others have proffered without much objection. One can justify incest, sexual behavior and/or idolatry in terms of being right or wrong no differently than homosexuality, they are all morally equivalent if one has his/her own morality system. If you find incest to be putrid, then you must find homosexuality to be equally as putrid because they are one in the same morally. I would suggest that you, and others, have tolerance for one and not the other and it is this underlying message that radiates from your postings. You questioned my intentions and here they are, in this particular matter, I intend to expose the fallacy that tolerance of homosexuality in the Scouts is compatible with the Oath and Laws, I intend to debate the issue openly and honestly because it should be seen for the depravity that it is, and it is my hope that those on the fence may realize the consequences of their silence and ambivalence should this iniquity take root in our beloved organization.


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