New Philmont adult square not effective June 1, 2008

[GNX Guy 10]

Yup, a new "Philmont Knot" Attend PTC after 1 June 2008, recruit 3 others to attend PTC promote the PTC and attend a 2nd time yourself. Prior attendance at PTC DOES NOT COUNT. Program starts 1 June 2008

 

Don't have the specific wording of the requirements in hand right now.

[OldGreyEagle 5]

Great, another knot for the well heeled scouter to have and gloat with. "Look what I got for having the money to go to Philmont twice and roping a few cronies in to go as well".

 

I had thought knots were honors bestowed on scouters, not something they earned. (well with rare exception, such as the Eagle, Arrow of Light, and religious award as a youth)

Wearing a knot was supposed to mean the wearer did something extrordinary for the program, not that they have the resources to buy ornaments

[SSScout 1615]

Lessee now... we need a patch for

*Archery Range Safety Ossifer

*BBRSO

* CSDC Director

*CSDC FAEE

* Camporee Planning Chair

*Wrist Rocket RSO

* Pop Corn Wrangler

* District Training Chair

* "UC without portfolio"

* "the go to guy"

* Canoeing/camping/cinematocrafy(?)/citizenship/swimming/ fillinblank/ MB Counselor

 

Not a few years ago, our R/T Chair gave out beads for R/T attendance. If you attended every month for a year, you received a leather totem to string on your bead string. Seemed to work, we always had good attendance. Then too, his programs were always fun and informative.

 

I'm gonna make up and sell some bumper stickers that will have the Scout fleur de lis in the corner and read: "WILL WORK FOR COLORFUL SCRAPS OF CLOTH". Really I am.

 

Are there any other Scout activities/jobs we can recognize (("There goes one now!")) ??

 

KiS MiF YiS

 

 

[Gold Winger 9]

"I had thought knots were honors bestowed on scouters, not something they earned."

 

I guess you haven't seen the "training knots."

 

I don't see the need for this knot, you have the patch for PTC. You can earn the knot for your position and, if memory serves, you need to attend advanced training for that.

 

 

[John-in-KC 311]

I'll gladly recruit for PTC.

 

I'll gladly attend courses at PTC. Even taking training, it's a tremendous break from the day job.

 

There is NWIH I will wear a PTC knot. It comes in the same group of "bribery" incentives that the 3d bead for NYLT staff and NESA Life Member knots do!

 

Who is on drugs at the National Office?

[emb021 16]

"I don't see the need for this knot, you have the patch for PTC. You can earn the knot for your position and, if memory serves, you need to attend advanced training for that."

 

Have to agree.

 

I'm all for recognizing people for the work they do. And in certain situations, I would agree for a knot.

 

I do not see the value of this PTC knot.

 

I do not see the value of the NESA Life Member knot.

 

I do not see the value of the Doctor of Commissioner Science knot (doesn't the Distinguished Commissioner Award cover much of the same ground???)

 

I do not see the value of knots people are demanding for staffing NYLT and the like. (you don't get knots for staffing courses, sorry. while I agree with recognition for such, there are more appropriate ways then with knots).

 

The last new knot I saw a value for is the Venturing Leadership Award knot, which is actually are 3 awards, but there is only one knot (you use pins to indicate with level you got the award).

 

 

 

[SR540Beaver 116]

I tend to agree with everyone else that enough is enough. But lets be honest guys, there really should be a dutch oven master knot. I mean come on?!

[John-in-KC 311]

That's one of two I could live with. (I have a friend who does have a "fun" grubmaster knot on his District Committee uniform).

 

The other one would be LNT Master Trainer.

 

BTW, I do not hold either of those certifications. I'm lucky to get a dump cake out of a Dutch unburnt 3 times out of 4, and LNT is far down the trail of trainings I want to take (and frankly, doing the work I do, I'd rather become a master of frontcountry LNT than backcountry LNT).(This message has been edited by John-in-KC)

[SR540Beaver 116]

Did you ever notice how many Cub knots there are as opposed to Boy Scout knots? There is a knot for Tiger DL, DL, Webelos DL, Cubmaster, Pack Trainer and the Cub Scouter award. In Boy Scouts you have the Scouters Key which goes only to SM's and the Scouters Training Award for everyone else.

[Gold Winger 9]

That is interesting. Since they are all training awards and there is different training for each position in Cub Scouting that there are different awards for each position. In Boy Scouts you only have SM and MC training.

[firequenchers 10]

Since I do not wear any knots, since I never got my Eagle back in Kansas City before moving to Arkanasas. I think the only knot I would wear is the Scoutmaster Knot, since it requires the PLC to write a letter saying how you EARNED it, as well as the Committee Chair.

 

Just my humble toughts

 

YIS,

Jeff

[click23 66]

I was at the training center last week, and received the actual requirements. I will post them when I get home tonight.

[click23 66]

This is a three track program.

 

First track-

 

Attend PTC as a participant.

 

Second track-

 

Take an additional Course at PTC.

and

Recruit 3 people to attend a PTC course.

and

Teach a BSA course in your district, council, area or region. Course and particiapation in the couse must be approved by the council or area chair prior to the course.

 

Completting the the first and second track, you would earn the square knot. It is going to be yellow and red, the colors of New Mexicos flag.

 

 

Track three-

 

Serve as a faculty member at PTC or attend a third time as a participant.

and

Recruit 3 people to attend a PTC course.

and one of the following

 

Coordinate a council, area or regional cluster approved training event and coordinate and staff a promotional booth for the PTC at a council event.

 

Conduct a council "Philmont Family Meeting" to share PTC information and encourage family participation.

 

Teach a training course in a foreign county- Coordinated and approved by the BSA international division.

 

 

 

By completing thing third track you would earn a PTC square knot device. I have no description on the knot device.

[fgoodwin 23]

I've been to PTC twice, and fully intend to go again, schedule and finances permitting.

 

I've actively encouraged others to go -- but I'm with everyone else -- enough is enough! The whole knot thing is getting ridiculous. I thought we were supposed to be in this for the boys?

 

Not so I can have a uniform chest that makes me look like a Latin American dictator!

[Bob White 20]

Let's remember that there are lots of other volunteers that do not work at the unit level. The new knots purpose is to recognize all leaders who take the time out to sharpen their tools as well as those volunteers who attend PTC to help facilitate the many conferences that take place there each year.

 

We have other knots to recognize the time volunteers take to attend basic training. Why not a knot that recognizes scouters who go beyond that level to take more specialized supplemental training.

 

If the work involved in this recognition results in more trained leaders and better trained leaders then it is a service to all scouts in the program and worth recognizing.

 

Besides that it is the BSA's program and they develop whatever recognition they want if it will help to strengthen and deliver their mission.(This message has been edited by Bob White)