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Skipping the B&G

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I am considering skipping the Packs Blue and Gold Banquet this year


Why? 2 reasons


1) I just found out that the organizer has gotten the Blue and Gold Banquet down to 4-1/2 hours, not including setup, tear down or the 45 min pre-gathering. She has been asked a couple of times to shorten it (the first schedule was almost 6 hours) and insists that this is as short as she can make it. The CM and CC (or the other leaders) dont seem to think the length is a problem and seem to be giving her free run. My 6 year old Tiger Cub is just not going to sit through something this long.


2) As with most Packs in this area, all the Dens are supposed to have their rank completed and awarded at the Blue and Gold. WEBLOS 2 do their cross over at this also. Well it doesnt look like my sons Tiger Den is going to be done. We havent had a tiger Den meeting since the beginning of November and we have had only 3 Den meeting total. The DL has canceled the last three Den meetings at the last minute (the day of the meeting) with little or no explanation. As of right now there are no den meeting scheduled and with only 4 den meetings nights left before the B&G I dont think we will get everything done. I have completed everything that I can with my son but we just have most of the requirements that need to be done with the Den to complete.


(This is a whole other matter. I have discussed this with the CC and CM they say they are on it but not sure what is happening. My wife and I have talked about offering to take over the den as if we dont do something quick my son wont stay with Cubs.)


I knwo there will be other kids getting awards but I cant see my son sitting around for that lenght of time and then not recieving an award on top of it is just not going to work.


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Down to Four and a half hours?!?!?

I'd be looking for a new PACK!!!!!

What do you have, a parade, carnival, magic show, wrestling match, 2 meals and a movie presentation? I've seen complete Shakespear productions which weren't that long!

We have shortened ours to about 1 1/2 hours including the meal, FOS and award presentations. We start at 6:00 pm and wrap up by 7:30. All that and we have a very elaborate slide show. The families have a great time. But the Tigers can barely sit still for that long. Someone is really missing the point here.

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I agree, 4 1/2 hours is nuts. I think it is time to politely lay the cards on the table and let the CM and CC know that you don't intend to participate in a marathon B&G. Either they can kindly schedule your tigers first and not be upset when the den (such as it is, using the word loosely) all leaves upon finishing their part, or they can figure out a better way to do this.


Help them out a bit. Go online and find some examples of B&G schedules in the 1 1/2-2 hour range and offer to share them with the organizers. But nope, a 4 1/2 hour B&G should not happen.


I'm curious though. What does she have planned for that whole time??

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What is with the big deal to have all the advancement in one meeting. Cubs advance when they are ready. Cross over at the Blue and Gold, that is a special time for the Webelos why mix it into a celebration of the birthday of Scouting give them their own special night. Cubbing is to be for young boys with short attention span, plus many Cubs have even younger siblings. Get some reality into the meeting planning,

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Sadly to say back when I was a Key 3 member I did sit through a few of these very long and at times very boring B&G.

I really do think that the people who are in charge of these events forget that the event is for the Cub Scouts not about putting the person in charge in the spotlight.

The idea of a B&G is that it is a Birthday Celebration.


I don't see any real reason why all advancement needs to be done and in the bag by Feb?

Most packs try to have it done just before the end of the school year.

Tiger Den meetings are hard to hold during the holidays.

But with the right planning and good communication many of the events that most families have can still be done as a Den. I'm thinking that in our area most of the small towns have a Christmas Parade, we have a few places that have wonderful spectacular displays of Christmas lights.

Even the local Mall invites Cub Scouts to walk in their parade.

It might be an idea to put together a list o these kind of things in your area and pass it on to next years Tiger Den Leader.


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good grief, I wouldn't make it thru 4 1/2 hours, never mind the boys!


Re: the tigers: if you can, step up and take over the den NOW. maybe a phone call to the official leader and ask if she needs help, or ask if she wants to "let you know" next time she can't make a meeting, and you will run it, or point blank ask her if you can take over.


Do you know if the other Tiger parents are planning on attending the b-n-g? if none of them have older siblings and HAVE to go,maybe it wold be better to just skip it? I can't imagine making 6 year olds sit there for that long (jeez, they don't sit for that long in one shot at school!!!), let alone having them sit while everyone else gets awards and they don't! If you step up ASAP, then you will be able to have a special ceremony at a pack meeting when they are ready.


Just my opinion!

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our pack's B&G (and our Girl Scout family potluck) is kept at about 2 hours (2 1/2 for those helping with setup)


welcome, flags, prayer, eat...

awards, skits/songs,

final announcements (which includes where the chairs and tables go and that if any thing is left at the end it will be donated to the church kitchen we're using - and that's only because someone will forget to bring a serving spoon and we have to borrow one of the churches)

and closing flags


the most difficult part of the setup and tear down is that the stage there is one that you have to put up and take down after and they are quite heavy.

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I agree that there is no real reason to have everyone crossover in Feb. In our pack, only the Webelos II crossover at the B&G and everyone is invited. Then in May we have a crossover ceremony for all the other scouts and honor them then. It is difficult to complete all the requirements by Feb when there are sports and holidays to compete with.

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There is a big difference between "crossing over" and receiving awards that have been earned.


Webelos transferring to a Boy Scout Troop are the only Cub Scouts who really "cross over".


Cub Scouts do not move to the next level of Cub Scout when they receive their Rank Award. Tiger/Wolf/Bear Scouts stay in their current level, and work in their Tiger/Wolf/Bear program, until the end of May, beginning of June, even if they earned their Tiger/Wolf/Bear Rank Award way back in February. Cub Scouts "graduate" to their next level at the end of the school year (BSA updates Cub records as of June 1st), regardless of weather they have earned their current Rank Award or not.


Awards should be presented to Scouts as soon as possible after they have earned them. If you have Cub Scouts who have earned their Rank Award by February's B&G, they should most definitely receive it then, and not be forced to wait another month or three.


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CNYScouter and Fellow Scouters,





Skipping might be a good choice for a 4:30 ceremony. Other alternative choices could be an early departure for the Den or a late arrive for the Den.


But yes, 4 1/2 hours is too long for many boys (and even adults).



Here is my story....


When I was Cubmaster with my oldest son, I discussed and negotiated with my Den Leaders and assistants. We had celebrations, door prizes, gag gifts, take aways, and a brief guest speaker. There was something for everyone that came. But we did not have advancements that month.


Back then.. I would have the Den Leaders target rank advancement between November thru January, with arrowpoint, and compass points awarded January, March and April. I'd target March for Webelos Crossover, so they could register for Summer camp and get to know the troop, and we would target den "graduation" in May. Sure.. my plan never went exactly as I desired, and we always had a Cub receiving his rank before/after his fellow Cubs. But my fellow Cub Scouters listened to my annual schedule and concurred that it moved the recognition Pack Meetings along much smoother.


During regular Pack meetings. I negotiated with a fellow Scouter and friend. My fellow Scouter thought every boy should have their one full minute of fame. I somewhat agreed, but felt every boy should have 15 seconds of fame. Recognize them, high five them, cheer the den, and move 'em out. I also felt it was important for Den Leaders to hand out Awards, while I (as Cubmaster) handed out Ranks.


Having a scripted Pack Meeting and distributing the scripted agenda to my leaders, we kept the pack meeting just below an hour.


Then fast forward a few years, to when my youngest was in the Pack. I was Assistant Cubmaster then, and working for another Cubmaster. He was the emcee and ran the show. So I shared my concerns, but bowed out to his style.


Recently.. I spoke to a friend that is conducting a district wide event. I told him, there are many ppl (Scouters and parents) that have their opinion and ideas of how to run an event, but he is giving his time to run it. So, everyone should be thankful that he has it taken it on. Most all the participating Scouts and families will have the own opinion, but the Scouters will be (at least should be) thankful they didn't have to host an event.


All that to say....


Hopefully, negotiating a shorter agenda, or negotiating a dens arrival/departure time during the event, may still allow some of your Scouts to participate, without exhausting them thru a long drawn out evening. Also, it may be too late for this year, but possibly your pack leaders may negotiate a more reasonable rank advancement month. So the dens aren't pressured for the Blue and Gold ceremony.


Good Luck and Happy Scouting Birthday!


Scouting Forever and Venture On!

Crew21 Adv

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The last time I sat through a banquet that long I threatened to stab someone with my fork. My Tiger would leave, loudly inquiring as to where the exits were.


I don't get why the B&G has evolved into this excruciating experience. Can anyone tell us when this happened?

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Skip it. That's nuts.


You can always do a more meaningful recognition ceremony on the den level for your Tigers when they finish up. Invite parents and siblings for a family night-style meeting-slash-show.


The organizer is out of her mind.

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