How can you remove a Committee Chair?

[Kymsue 10]

I feel like the story is too long to explain, but I'll try in a nutshell.

New group took over in January. Person who stepped up for Chair works nights so can't attend den or pack meetings. We only see them at the Committee meetings.

I've been the go to person at the meetings and the one the parents searchout for answers. Problem I'm not the one anyone else communicates with on a council level. I'm taking care of books sales, collection, communication to everyone events, new registration... My approach was he can be on paper because at least he's doing some things I then won't have too, but I can never reach him, he doesn't answer email, doesn't attend Roundtable...... I'm doing it anyway and if I take over then at least I don't have to keep trying to track him down and clear things through him...... I am sooooooooooooo frustrated.

 

The parents and leaders know me and would back me up in a heart beat, but I really don't want to force him out. FYI: my hubby is the CubMaster. He took over but let everyone know that because he's emergency response his on call schedule means he's hit or miss at the meetings. So they're both no shows and I'm the one holding the bag........... grrrrrrrrrrrrrr

[Gold Winger 9]

Only the Charter Organization can remove a Committee Chair.

 

Does the CC need to attend den meetings? Not at all.

 

Does the CC need to attend pack meetings? No but they probably should from time to time.

 

Does your hubby have an assistant Cubmaster? He should, especially one who takes over when he's not there.

 

 

[Kymsue 10]

So who is supposed to get the information about Scoutorama books to everyone?

Who is at the Den Meetings to sign up new people and collect money?

Who is supposed to handle all the parent questions?

Is "Call so and so" really the best way to do thing?

 

The problem with the Pack before was communication and organization and we finally seem like we've pulled it together.

We actually had a Scout come back and his parents praise us for the difference.

Do I throw up my hands and tell the parents "call him" between 11am and 3pm?

[Kymsue 10]

Re: Assistant CubMaster

Our Weblo Den Leader is listed as Assistant PackMaster and there is a "new" Eagle that's also listed on paper.

We never see the Eagle and the Weblo leader is really busy with Weblos especially since we inherited 4 Weblos II when the leader left at Blue and Gold.

[Gold Winger 9]

"So who is supposed to get the information about Scoutorama books to everyone?

Who is at the Den Meetings to sign up new people and collect money?

Who is supposed to handle all the parent questions?

Is "Call so and so" really the best way to do thing?"

 

Back in my days of Cub Scouting, questions were directed to the person in charge of the event or activity. Pine Wood Derby questions came to me. Popcorn questions went to the Popcorn Kernel. Camping questions went to the Den Leader. New boys at a Den Meeting? That could be handled by the Den Leader.

 

It sounds like you have typical pack problems. A few people wearing too many hats. People take on jobs that they really don't want. Etc.. So on and so forth.

 

A committee chair's job is really to find qualified people to fill the committee positions and keep them on task. Different packs do it differently.

 

The solution to your problem lies with the Charter Org Rep and the Unit Commissioner. Talk to them, see what they have to say.

 

My two cents.

 

[John-in-KC 311]

Welcome to the Forums. May I ask, how much training you've completed so far? I'm writing this answer rather much in the dark, and it'll help all of us focus better if you can provide that detail.

 

GW is right. All unit serving Scouters are approved by the Chartered Organization Representative (COR). He or she oversees the interests of the Chartered Partner and ensures the unit executes program and support according to the Aims of Scouting and the Methods and Purposes of the Cub Scouting Program.

http://www.scouting.org/cubscouts/aboutcubscouts/thepack/chorr.aspx

 

May I ask: Who has taken Fast Start, New Leader Essentials, and position specific (Tiger Leader, Den Leader, Webelos Den Leader (as appropriate) or Cubmaster) training in your program and support sides?

 

To answer your questions:

So who is supposed to get the information about Scoutorama books to everyone? With a well-running Pack Committee, this should be a cross of the Pack Communications coordinator, the Cubmaster (as program officer), and the Den Leaders. Information can go out as flyers at Den meetings, in a monthly newsletter (handed out at Pack meetings), or as email.

 

Who is at the Den Meetings to sign up new people and collect money? The Den Leader. He or she is the direct contact unit leader! He/she then gets both of the above to the unit Membership coordinator/treasurer.

 

Who is supposed to handle all the parent questions? The Den Leaders. When there is a specific question they cannot answer, their resource net includes the Cubmaster, the various support side members of the Committee, and the Committee Chair.

 

Is "Call so and so" really the best way to do thing? No. Cross-communication amongst the Scouters of a unit (program and support side) so that each direct contact leader has basic answers is the first best solution. This includes a solid Pack communications program, which gets info to parents.

 

Here's a page which has a chart of the positions in a Pack and their various responsibilities:

http://www.scouting.org/CubScouts/AboutCubScouts/ThePack.aspx

 

From that:

Here's what the Committee does:

http://www.scouting.org/CubScouts/AboutCubScouts/ThePack/pcomm.aspx

 

 

Here's the Cubmaster:

http://www.scouting.org/cubscouts/aboutcubscouts/thepack/cmast.aspx

 

And here are the different den leaders

http://www.scouting.org/cubscouts/aboutcubscouts/thepack/tcden.aspx

http://www.scouting.org/cubscouts/aboutcubscouts/thepack/csden.aspx

http://www.scouting.org/cubscouts/aboutcubscouts/thepack/webdl.aspx

 

[infoscouter 11]

Ideally, your CC will wake up and realize he's not doing the unit any favors, and look for a replacement. And maybe not.

 

The Chartered Organization Representative has the power to remove a leader. If the CC's inability to attend Pack meetings (they don't need to be at den meetings), and more importantly non-communication are interfering in the pack operations, then you need to let the COR know, and ask if they would be willing to make a change.

[John-in-KC 311]

Followups:

 

GW suggested another huge resource: The Unit Commissioner. He/she's a volunteer who provides resources and program support to a Pack, Troop, Team or Crew. Won't do the work for you, but will certainly help you learn to find the answers!

 

Agree with infoscouter that the Committee Chair should attend Pack meetings. As the Cubmaster is the Program officer, helping the kids have fun and making sure each Den is moving forward, the CC has communication and coordination duties which include info sharing at Pack Events.

 

BTW, the Committee Chair and the Cubmaster have pretty much joint responsibility for planning the Pack's year!(This message has been edited by John-in-KC)

[Kymsue 10]

Boy you've touched on all the areas of frustration.

New group took over in January.

There was training available on the weekend my husband and I were going skiing.

Since then there has been no "new leader", BALOO, or specific leader training.

Sept/Oct are the next dates on calendar.

A parent of a "Den Chief" asked if we had a "Unit Commissioner".

I said I don't know I'll ask.

We did, but I've never seen that person at any of our meetings.

Now this Dad tells me he was appointed "Unit Commissioner" Council never told the CC or CubMaster.

I am YPT, CC fasttrack, Committee Fasttrack trained.

I am the Committee Chair for my son's Troop also, which is a different unit.

As for Charter Organization we only see them at Blue and Gold.

Otherwise I don't think there's much contact. We don't meet at their facility.

Our Weblo Den was the only group to set up and take positions, but we are out next year.

So there isn't anyone in charge of the different events, calendar, roster, etc.

The biggest problem the parents had before, myself included, was lack of communication and direction. We found out about events at the last minute, therefore poor participation.

I feel like I've really worked hard to get this problem solved and so many parents have praise the change, but now I'm being told "let me do my job as Committee Chair"....

So do I pull out and let the chips fall, because it's the boys and parents that will suffer.

[Gold Winger 9]

"There was training available on the weekend my husband and I were going skiing."

 

A-ha!

 

" Council never told the CC or CubMaster."

 

It would be District but in my experience, the UC tells the unit, "Congrats! You got me! "

 

Charter Org? Sometimes you have to chase them down but they do own the unit.

 

Sometimes you do have to step back and let people fail or succeed on their own.

 

BTW, it is "Webelos" it always has an "S" on the end. Singular or plural? It is neither, it is an adjective as in "Webelos Den" or "Webelos Scouts"

[John-in-KC 311]

Boy you've touched on all the areas of frustration.

New group took over in January.

There was training available on the weekend my husband and I were going skiing.

Since then there has been no "new leader", BALOO, or specific leader training.

Sept/Oct are the next dates on calendar.

 

Call your District Executive. He/she is a paid Professional. Ask for contact info for your District Commissioner. Call him her. Ask for contact info for your Unit Commissioner. Contact him/her, state specific needs!

 

A parent of a "Den Chief" asked if we had a "Unit Commissioner".

I said I don't know I'll ask.

We did, but I've never seen that person at any of our meetings.

Now this Dad tells me he was appointed "Unit Commissioner" Council never told the CC or CubMaster.

 

See the above. UC is not necessarily a trainer, but where your Pack is, you need training out of cycle.

 

BTW a Den Chief is a Boy Scout who can provide support and assistance to a Den Leader. There is a training package available for Den Chiefs, done well (and with the Den Leaders), it helps forge them into a team to work the youth.

 

I am YPT, CC fasttrack, Committee Fasttrack trained.

I am the Committee Chair for my son's Troop also, which is a different unit.

 

 

I'll be blunt. Many of the challenges you face are resolved by having more hands (to share the load), and by training those hands. There's a lot of material on the BSA website for Cubbing, folks need to read it. At the same time, you, working with your Commissioner, need to ask for out-of-cycle New Leader Essentials and position specific training.

 

BTW, you, the CM, and the DLs (really, every Scouter in your Pack) can benefit from attending your District Roundtable. It gives you a months lead in the program, and helps cross-fertilize experienced Scouters with newbies. There are many good ideas you can take as "low hanging fruit."

 

As for Charter Organization we only see them at Blue and Gold.

Otherwise I don't think there's much contact. We don't meet at their facility.

 

That phone call with your DE? I recommend you ask for a business visit with your Chartered Partner. Scouting licenses (charters) your CO to operate a unit in your area (that's you). There are expectations the Chartered Partner should meet. I hope by now you see that Scouting, on the adult side, is a team effort to help the youth learn and mature by having fun. The team doesn't work as well if one of the starters is sitting on the sidelines.

 

Our Weblo Den was the only group to set up and take positions, but we are out next year.

So there isn't anyone in charge of the different events, calendar, roster, etc.

The biggest problem the parents had before, myself included, was lack of communication and direction. We found out about events at the last minute, therefore poor participation.

I feel like I've really worked hard to get this problem solved and so many parents have praise the change, but now I'm being told "let me do my job as Committee Chair"....

So do I pull out and let the chips fall, because it's the boys and parents that will suffer.

 

What is your position again? Are you or are you not the Committee Chair? I'm confused; your last sounds like the are two chairpeople...

 

 

More in about 4 hours, I need to have time with EagleSon.

[Kymsue 10]

Weblos.... got it.

I learn everyday.

I pray daily that I can volunteer with a gracious heart and be a good model for the boys.

I'm also very aware that if a unit is unorganized and all over the place the parents get frustrated and leave.

Try this on for size...

We just returned from Camporee... none of the 4 leaders had participated before...

The Troop never contacted us offered help, training, or even visisted our campsite.

I'm not sure what's going on, frankly I don't have the energy any more.

But the next step would be to join another unit for one year... I don't like that idea.

[Kymsue 10]

I'm a Committee Chair for my older son's Troop.

I am registered as "Den Leader" for the Pack.

My hubby took over CubMaster because no one else stood up.

With his schedule I assumed I'd be his eyes and ears when he can't be there.

I didn't expect to also be the CC's eyes and ears.

The CC doesn't attend Roundtable, Den, or Pack meetings.

For parents who don't attend Committee meetings they don't even know who he is.

We have a Treasurer - I just got a Mom to volunteer for that

We have a Secretary - but she never shows up

We have a Training Coordinator - but our council doesn't have any training available

That's it....

So I coordinated Scoutorama sales at the stores, the Cake Bake Pack meeting, the Space Derby, calendar, roster...

 

[John-in-KC 311]

OK.

 

You are at risk of leader burnout. Let me be blunt about that.

 

Your husband, as the Cubmaster, is the right guy to be talking to the DE. He is the Program Officer of your pack. He can lay his concerns, including a lack of support from the support side, on the table.

 

That conversation should include that your Chartered Partner may not be filling their share of the burden. Google "Scouting" and "Charter Agreement." The license contract is out there, you need to know what the Partner is supposed to be doing.

 

He'll be repeating his conversation, with your District Commissioner. Hopefully, there is a UC for your Pack. We do talk much theory here, what happens on the ground isn't always the same.

 

From what you've told me, your Pack has three specific problems:

 

- Leader recruitment. As GW said, too few people are doing too many jobs. A distributed burden means each person carries less of the load.

 

- Leader training. Cubbing is a great program, but we work together better when we all understand the playbook.

 

- Unit planning. The way you write, I perceive much is being done "by the seat of your pants." The elephant is much easier to eat if you do it one bite at a time. Enough people to share the job is part of the solution, enough time to do things outside "NEXT CRISIS!" is another part of the solution.

 

More later.(This message has been edited by John-in-KC)

[Kymsue 10]

Well I can delegate and coordinate at the Den meetings with different people, but I'm there to ask questions.

I'm already at Roundtable for the Troop, so two birds with one stone is okay.

The parents see me at the meetings I update them all the time and solicate help.

At the Troop level, do I have to attend the boys meetings? No, but I am much better at it when I do.