CO wants a new CM -- what to do?

[fgoodwin 23]

I guess I'm a failure as a unit commissioner.

 

One of my units is having a civil war between the CC and the CM (it also happens that they are next-door-neighbors -- yikes!). In any event, the COR has notified the DE that he wants a new CM for the Pack, otherwise they are considering dropping the charter.

 

The CC has called an emergency committee meeting for this Sunday to discuss how to proceed -- but the current CM and his wife (who is an ACM) were not invited. I don't see any good outcomes resulting from this, but the Pack Committee will have to come up with a new CM, per the wishes of the CO.

 

Has anyone ever gone through anything like this?

 

Fred Goodwin, UC

[John-in-KC 311]

Fred,

 

1) Everybody take a deep breath. Period. This is a high stress time.

 

2) Unless the root cause of the removal is criminal or YP related, the outgoing CM deserves thanks from the Committee, the other program side folk, and the Chartered Partner.

 

3) If I recall duties correctly, the CC may serve as an emergency/interim CM pending appointment of a new one.

 

4) The Chartered Partner wants the existing folk out; they need to speak up clearly and describe what right looks like for a new CM.

 

5) Folks need to be clearly and plainly reminded that the Chartered Partner is the licensee of Scouting, program officers and committee folk serve at the Partner's pleasure.

 

6) It is sad that this is a consequence of the root cause being a family feud. Since you do not indicate criminal/YP behavior on the part of the CM/ACM, see my point in 2) above. The CC may not like thanking the CM when he is in a fued, but it must be done, and done properly. Otherwise, the world will know the CC is absolutely churlish.

[fgoodwin 23]

John, thanx for your comments.

 

To respect the privacy of all the principals involved, I really can't give more details. But I'd still like to hear from anyone who might've gone through a similar episode.

 

My main concern is the impact on the boys. I think the kids (other than perhaps the sons of the protagonists) are oblivious to the conflict. But if this drags on much longer, or if there are public confrontations (e.g., during a Pack Meeting), I fear anxiety among the Cubs (and the DLs who clearly ARE aware of the conflict).

 

Thanx

[Eagledad 2779]

>>The CC has called an emergency committee meeting for this Sunday to discuss how to proceed

[Lisabob 13]

Sorry to hear this, fgoodwin. I don't think this indicates that you are "a failure as a UC" though - it isn't your job to make all the adults play nice, and be thankful too, because frankly, reality is you can't make them! Adults behaving badly seems to be a sub-theme to an awful lot of the difficulties we face in scouting.

 

Anyway, on to the problem. If the CO wants a new CM then of course they have the right to do this, but if they are going to play their power card like this, then it might be good for the DE to have a little sit-down with the COR and IH to help them understand their role in selecting leaders (not just dismissing current leaders and demanding new ones with no other input or feedback as to what's acceptable to them).

 

Then, with an ACTIVE and (hopefully) HELPFUL COR involved, the pack can start looking for a new CM. This is one of those times where the nominating process as described in cub leader training, and well articulated from time to time by Eamonn, really could help the unit overcome their current problem (despite the fact that personally, I've never known a unit that follows it!).

 

Ideally, the CO may be able to engineer a somewhat graceful exit for the current/past CM, even if the CC can't/won't, by publicly thanking him for his service and recognizing him at an upcoming pack meeting. Ideally as well, the CM will see the wisdom in graciously accepting this thanks and moving along. (This assumes that the CM and his son plan to stay with the pack after this whole mess blows over.) But if he can't manage to hold his tongue and be gracious in public, then at least the CM *might* be counseled to choose not to be in attendance at that pack meeting - so his service can be publicly acknowledged, but the fact that he's being pushed out isn't rubbed in his face.

 

Something like this from the COR or IH: "Unfortunately Mr. Smith couldn't be here tonight, but he has been the CM of pack 123 for the last XX years, and at this time he is stepping down. We appreciate all the hard work and effort he has put into the pack over the years and we'd like to ask all of you to thank him the next time you see him. (Pause, applause, whatever). And now we'd like to introduce to you Mr Smith's successor, Cubmaster Jones..."

 

Of course this all supposes that the current CM sees the writing on the wall and isn't still trying to hang on as CM, and/or that he hasn't burned the bridges totally yet by sending out nasty emails to the entire pack or slugging another parent at a pack meeting, or something equally horrendous (hey, the CM of our pack did both of those things. And then he asked to be re-instated! Ha!) If he's adamant about making a scene and venting, help him by suggesting he schedule a meeting with the IH where he can make a fool of himself without doing it in front of the boys at a pack meeting. Making sure, of course, to give the IH a head's up too.

 

Hang in there with them, fgoodwin. And here's hoping for the least-bad outcome.

 

[John-in-KC 311]

Fred,

 

Print Lisa's post and take it with you as a checklist!!!

 

I think some of your time right now is well spent visiting with the CM and his family. They also do not need to be churlish in the process, that does generate a lose/lose which the kids will see! You may want to help outplace them into a new Pack, so there is separation in space and time between the feuding grown-ups (I can see a shouting match in the parking lot, I can see gloating).

 

BTW, remember your role is to be a friend to the unit... NOT to be the sole super-savior of units. As a guy who had no UC to seek advice from during some tough times, that you are on top of the situation is a sign you're doing well as a Commish.!

 

Keep us in the loop.

[Beavah 205]

Yah, fgoodwin, been through it a bunch of times. Dealin' with adult feudin' and squabbles tryin' to tear apart units is part of da Commish's life, eh? Often times, too many egos are involved to see reason, and the conflict can only be resolved by a Decision from Authority.

 

So da CO made the decision. They endorsed the CC and removed da CM. Nuthin' you can to about that, don't let it get to you. In fact, it's probably a better resolution than letting the feud go on.

 

Now it's just being helpful managing "what's next". A nice thankyou to the CM, a brief, reassuring, professional explanation to the parents and kids, a good search for a new CM. Follow Lisabob's script. And back to program as quick as they can. Since the CC and CO seem to be on the same page in this feud, I figure you can probably let the Committee manage the CM selection as long as there's not a lot of hard feelings by other parents.

 

Havin' a DE there is fine, but not necessary unless yeh need some Authority around. Better the COR. The DE probably isn't going to know the folks that well.

 

Beavah

 

 

[eolesen 10]

Scouting would be a great activity if it weren't for the parents....

 

I'm glad this wasn't one of my units, but there's no way as a UC that you can prevent things like this from happening. Egos are still egos

 

A few of the responses imply that the CM is the reason for this, and that he's the risk.

 

With my ADC patch off, is the CM really the problem, or is it a case of the CM being ganged up on by the CM and COR?

 

When my kids were younger, and one came to me to intervene in whatever spat was underway with their brother or sister, more often than not, both of them were at fault.

 

So, perhaps there's a case to be made with the COR to suggest a fresh start by changing out both positions.

 

If not, it's likely likely there are going to a few (or even more than a few) people sympathetic to the plight of the outgoing CM, in which case this may be far from over. You may be facing another unit forming out of the rubble.

 

Finding a new CO and getting a charter approved isn't too difficult for someone who is really motivated, plus it is the DE's interest to have new units start up, even if they're being done out of revenge. So be prepared for Round Two just in case.(This message has been edited by eolesen)

[Torveaux 10]

The CM 'works' for the CO. Ultimately, contrary to many CM's opinions, the CC is the 'head' of the Pack and must follow the rules of both the BSA and the CO.

 

I agree that the CO should thank the CM for serving and help the kids through it.

 

Without knowing the details I would not begin to guess what is 'right' but I sure wish in our old Pack that the CO would have removed the CM. He did not understand the way BSA was supposed to work. He just wanted to be 'in charge'. He walked all over the CO who was not assertive enough to put him in his place. As a result the Pack continues to dwindle.

[scoutldr 732]

Fred said, "In any event, the COR has notified the DE that he wants a new CM for the Pack, otherwise they are considering dropping the charter. "

 

One thing bothers me about this. According to my training, the CM serves at the pleasure of the CO®. So why did the COR "notify the DE that he wants a new CM"? Now it's the CC's problem to fire the old one and find a new one? Why isn't the COR doing the dirty work? The way I think it should work: the COR notifies the CM that his services are no longer required. Then the CC may be contacted to help the CO find a suitable replacement (through a nomination procedure or search committee). OR...the CO can just appoint a new one. Done.

 

And the DE has no authority or other role in firing or selecting unit leaders, absent violations of national policy. The District/Council should be represented by the Commissioner, as needed.

 

[rkfrance 11]

Fred,

 

This is not a case of life and death. This is Scouting. Unfortunately, as has been previously stated, egos get in the way.

 

As a UC, you are expected to support the unit and offer advice to try to keep it moving in a positive, healthy direction. Don't beat yourself up if the CO, COR, IH, CC, CM or anyone else in the unit won't listen to you. You can't make them do anything.

 

Your position is to support the wishes of the unit(CO) (even if they don't know exactly what they're doing). You can and should work with each of the leaders to develop a relationship where you are able to offer sound advice and hopefully they'll listen (or at least be receptive). Help each leader understand his/her position and responsibility. This is the toughest part of being a UC, but it is the most critical component for you (or any of us) to be a successful commissioner.

 

What I would ask is did you let your ADC, DC, and DE know what was happening? If so, what advice did they offer? Did you try to handle this on your own? How long has this situation been brewing? What did you do to try to avoid this situation?

 

Unfortunately, I anticipate this is only the beginning of bigger headaches to come. I've been there myself on the receiving end. Work with your ADC, DC, and DE on a plan for damage control. Expect more losses in the unit, youth and adult. Work the positives and try to minimize the negatives. Is this an opportunity to start a new unit? You have an experienced CM and ACM. Offer to help the outgoing CM and his family find another Pack if they choose to pull their boy(s) from the unit.

 

Thanks for taking on the challenge and responsibility of being a UC. Remind yourself at the end of the day, you are still just a volunteer. Life goes on. The BSA will go on. Don't beat yourself up over this. And above all, don't try to handle this on your own. Ask for help. In the end, try to learn from the experience and share what you learn with your commissioner team.

 

Rob France, DC

[fgoodwin 23]

The emergency committee meeting will start in a little under three hours.

 

Thanx to all for your very sound advice -- I will consider everything you said as I observe the meeting (liek a good UC, I will be there to listen and offer support, but I hope they aren't looking to me to solve the problem!).

 

I want to answer a few of your questions -- but like I said, I don't want to compromise anyone's privacy by getting too much into specifics.

 

Yes, the DE is aware of the situation. He was brought into the loop by the CC, when the CC copied me on a message to the DE asking for guidance on the issue.

 

The CO (I think it was the COR, not the IH) notifed the DE that the CO wants a new CM. Apparently, the CO (again, not sure if it was the IH or COR) has had issues in the past with CM. The CM's job often conflicts with his ability to attend committee or pack meetings.

 

The CC tells me she has planned and hosted the last few pack meetings, because if she hadn't, the boys would not have had a pack meeting due to the negligence of the CM (understand, I'm hearing the CC's version of events, I haven't talked to the CM).

 

Although I've left messages with the CM, he hasn't called me back (the CC said she got the same lack of response from the CM, and so have other pack leaders).

 

Given his lack of engagement, and his history with the CO, I can kinda see why the CO and pack want a new CM. I just wish I could hear the CM's side of the story.

 

The CM's wife, an ACM, tells me she has no idea what the others are saying about her husband, but she thinks the pack is ganging up on him.

 

This whole mess sounds like a little "Peyton Place" (you Boomers will know the reference!), and the reason I feel like I've failed the pack is because I knew there were issues between the CC and CM, and still didn't step in soon enough to avert this result.

 

For those out there who see the UC position as a paper job for old-time Scouters, I can assure you it isn't -- but I hope I'm not scaring off any potential new UCs -- its really a great job and I really love it -- like someone said, I just wish the adults would "play nice" and just be adults.

 

Well, I'll fill you in after I get back from the meeting. Thanx again for your support.