Panicked over Pinewood Derby

[BelindaB 10]

My son is a wolf and this is our first year in scouts. I just read the forum complaining about Dads helping too much and it scared me to death-- not because of the Dads helping but because I had no idea what you were talking about or how to help our son. My husband is not experienced with woodworking tools. I don't know what half the things you were talking about were. What is a "dremel". We don't own any power saws or sanders. I bought a mini hacksaw for $3 at Walmart. I looked around for a "dry lubricant" but could not find one. We were going to use leftover house paint or kid art paint. Why do you need 6 layers? Why does it have to be spray paint?

Our pack is not having a workshop. Just a tryout day where you can run cars on a track before the race day. I assume we need to build our car before that. Our denmother is not good with woodworking either and they are not doing anything in den meeting.

Are we going to be laughed out of the building on race day? HELP

[SemperParatus 1]

BelindaB,

 

Welcome. Oh the terror that our quaint Pinewood can cause.

 

Use this as a teaching opportunity for your son and as a great way to model the Cub Scout Motto -Do You Best. Stress the importance of learning about using simple tools and his imagination and remind him that it 'doesn't matter whether you win or lose."

 

Don't worry about being laughed at - that rarely happens. Usually, parents prefer to talk and laugh behind your back.

 

Couple of simple hints for you and your son so that you are not 'embarassed':

 

1. Cut the block down with your hand saw to a simple racing shape - kind of an elongated triangle is simple enough and has some aerodynamics to it. Shape the rest with a carving knife. Have your son sand it like a mad man.

 

2. Have him paint it like he wants. Spray paint works best, although I guess latex could be used. Throw on a couple of stickers and it will look like over half the cars there. As long as he is happy with how it looks, that is what is important. Believe me, on race day you will know the degree to which a parent has usurped the activity - by the shape and the paint.

 

3. The wheels - I have never thought the whole polishing thing does that much (my son won two PWDs in a 100+ boy pack and he/we never polished an axle once). Just make sure the wheels are straight and don't rub up against the car body. Go to the craft store and ask for a tube of 'dry graphite' - that is the lubricant of choice. But make sure that it can be used based on the pack rules. Give a little squirt to each wheel and spin them to help spread it.

 

4. Weight - this is the most important thing in racing. Go to the craft shop and buy some of those little metal weights (they have sections that snap off to vary the weight) and attach them

to the rear of the car until the car's weight is exactly equal to the weight limit allowed by the pack. Every PWD car that I have seen win (and thats at least a dozen years) had the same thing in common - heavily weighted in the rear. Almost to the point that the car can barely sit still without popping a wheelie.

 

5. On race day, stress again how much fun it will be to see the car going down the track - win or lose.

 

By the way, one year we had a scout show up on PWD day with his complete kit still in the box (don't ask me how this could happen). He attached the wheels to the block of wood, squirted them with some graphite and won a couple of races. That car got the most attention of the day. Everytime it raced the chant, "BLOCK...BLOCK...BLOCK" would fill the room. That scout thought the PWD was the coolest.

 

 

 

(This message has been edited by SemperParatus)

[molscouter 10]

Belinda, don't worry about it. Handtools work just fine. I would advise buying a cheap coping saw at your local hardware store (ask them, they'll know what it is) and lots of sandpaper. You could borrow the saw from a neighbor even. While you are there, buy a tube of graphite dry lube (again, ask them). Open the tube, pour some into a sealable plastic bag and put the axles in. Shake the bag a couple times a day for 2-3 days.

 

Be creative in your design. My younger boy (now a Webelos I) this year decided to make his look like a river boat using the kit and a piece of balsa wood. It was nowhere near the fastest, but it was his, he had fun making it, and he was proud of it. He painted it with paint we had laying around the house. Spray paint is used because it puts a very thin layer on and keeps the weight down, but it's not necessary.

 

Heck, you don't even have to cut the wood. Last year, we had one boy who for some reason never got a kit. The night of the race, he asked if he could make a car. So we pulled out a kit and stuck the axles and wheels on. It must have been a real old kit, because it actually weighed in over the allowable 5 oz. His dad had to drill holes in it to get it down to weight. "Swiss Cheese" actually won a race or two. A sleek design looks great, but in a 30 foot race, aerodynamics mean nothing. It really comes down to getting the axles on in such a way that the car rolls straight.

 

Semper, I was typing this while you were submitting your post. Glad to see there are other block stories out there.

 

(This message has been edited by molscouter)

[ManassasEagle 10]

Don't worry about it. We, too, just this past month, had one scout who had just stuck the wheels/axles into his block and colored the wood with crayons. He had a fine time. The Pinewood Derby is only as big a deal as you make it.

[fotoscout 15]

Hello and Welcome,

 

Don't stress over this! Many of the cars will be made entirely by the boys, yours will not be the only one that does not look like it came from a custom body shop.

 

Yes it's true that some, not many, of the dad's obsess over the cars. My guess is that less than 15% of the cars will be "Dad" cars. MOST will be done as a team effort by the parent and child. Most of the cars will look like the kids did them with some help. Some will look like the kid did it all by himself! Your son will be very proud of his car.

 

As for the other adults watching the derby, we can't help but take note of which kids participated in the creation of their car, vs, which kids were bystanders. It's always nice to see that the boy had a hand in making his car.

 

So don't stress over this just have fun.

[Its Me 10]

I have seen boys just paint the block of wood as it came out of the box. The nail-axles weren't glued on. It did ok. At least it wasn't last. A good pack will have a few ringers that the cubmaster and other den leaders run that seem to be beat by all other cars.

 

We use Wal-Mart spray paint that cost $1.00. Spray paint dries in 1/10th the time house paint will dry. While at Wal-mart buy some rough and some smoooth sandpaper if you want numbers 80 grit and 150 grit. Then cut the sheet in quarters and turn your boy loose. Tell him not to sand right by the wheels.

 

Most boys will sand until its a tooth pick. When his sandpaper gets to all paper and no sand give him a new quarter sheet. Before painting give it a once over with the 150 grit.

 

When you get there look for the best looking car and ask that dad for some graphite lube. It will be in his right front pocket.

 

 

[ScoutNut 147]

Don't Panic! Have Fun!

 

Making the PWD car is supposed to be a cooperative effort between the boy & his folks. A FUN learning process with the parents making sure that no digets are injured in the process, at least not badly !

 

As the others have noted you don't have to be a woodworking pro to do this. As long as your son is very involved in the creation process & happy with the final look that's what counts. We had a brand new Webelos this year who did the basic block design in orange with some pumpkin stickers. His mom was worried that he would be disappointed. I told her that I had seen block designs before that did fine, but she was unconvinced. The BS Den Chief dad working Pit Crew kind of pointed & chuckled. Every boy in the Pack ran 7 races. Out of this Webelos 7 races his good 'ole pumpkin won 2. The boy was thrilled, his mom was happy, & the Pit Crew dad stopped chuckling!!

 

BTW - 1) Ask if your Pack has any printed rules & regs for the race so you will not be suprised on race day. 2) Make sure that you do NOT add any weight, or anything else, to the BOTTOM of the car. Each lane of the track has a strip of wood down the middle that keeps the cars in a straight line. If you add stuff to the bottom it will scrape against the strip of wood & not go ANYWHERE very fast!

 

HAVE FUN!

[OneHour 11]

Another idea ... use that block of wood and use that box it came out of. The box can be shrunk to wrap the block of wood. One thing that you can do is to make sure that derby car weighs about 4+ oz but no more than 5 oz. Glue quarters, nickels, pennies on the block before you wrap it with the pinewood kit box! Attach your wheels and axles and voila` you have gotten one fine pinewood derby kit racer. Glue them with Crazy glue or super glue at the pointed edge of the axles (nails), but be careful and don't tip the car while you are glueing ... be care not to let the glue run down and glue the wheels.

 

Go to Hobby Lobby or local hobby shop and get some (graphite-molybdenum) graphite dry lubricant. Have your son squirts some of the lube into the wheels and spin the wheels, repeat until the wheels can spin free for about 10-15 sec counts. Get your son to clean his hands thoroughly afterward. Then your son is all set!

 

If you want more info, do a search on Google for Pinewood Derby and you'll get a ton and a half of information.

 

But to make sure that your son car is competitive: 1)the car has to be at least 4oz, but 5oz is the best, 2) make sure that the car runs straight, and finally 3) lube the wheels,

 

Good luck and have fun.

 

1Hour

 

ps: I let my Webelos builds his own (I only help with the cutting), but I race against other dads in the open race.

[anarchist 10]

BelindaB,

relax, you know your son and by this you will know all!...now that the zen lesson is over with...know that there are parents (usually Dads) that simply can't let their kids 'do' it!... Same Dads who will later buy junior his first car (a decked out, over horse powered, chick machine)...to prove their kid is cool.

Let your son find his way...if he is very young turn the block into a triangle with a handsaw give him some sand paper and let him round the edges, choose a color (spray paint is better for shine) and have at it...

If he is older you might want to let him try to use the hand saw...just lend a guiding hand...check internet for wheel and weight theory...it is interesting...

story: I have two sons (both Boys scouts now) oldest is rather 'anal'...as soon as he could handle the saw it was HIS project...sanding, priming, sanding, repriming, sanding, painting, sanding,painting...clear coat, steel wool, clear coat.....weights to the third decimal point, only three wheels touching...smudge on the finish, more sanding...drving dad nutz!

second son was on his on form of natural valium...ho hum, cut some corners off, throw so weight on it, wave the paint can it its general direction and put the wheels on...and he is good to go...in fact he did an 'ovaloid' car once and use flat brown paint,cause thats what was 'closest'...(dad has to admit it looked like a...oh well,) but they both had fun and over their cub 'lives' both won a derby and both finished in the top four a couple of times...but they did it the way they wanted and had fun...

Years later I am still in the pack, as an assistant CM, and this year we had cars ranging from 'semi-pro' to 'disasters' and I did not see one unhappy racer...I think the unofficial races after the main event are as much fun as the pine wood!

 

If your boy goes over the 'deep end' you have plenty of time to get a Dremel Tool for your birthday or next Christmas!

good scouting!

[Shilo 10]

It has been a few years since pinewood derby's. My son started derby running as a Tiger and ran a car every year through his second Webelo year. He did the work as age appropriate (the power saws were off limits to the tiger/wolf). Design, sanding, painting, and decorations were all his.

 

We have all the equipment a scout or parent could drool over ... and guess what ... Dad took the biggest ribbing when his cubby's car came in behind cubbys' cars who did not have dads (so guess who substitued as "dad"); the cubs were all treated the same ...

 

A couple of suggestions ... when guiding your cubby do not let the car be lowered, or narrowed ... cubs get more upset about their car not running the track than they do about not coming in first!

 

I have seen fire engines, green tanks, wedges, solid blocks ... painted, crayoned. Did not matter ... every participant got a "Derby Licence", Certificate, derby section, and ribbon. We gave out trophies and medalian medals; no scout got more than one trophy (if your car came in 1st, 2nd, or 3rd, it was automatically disqualified from best of show, most whatever, ... and the judges of the non-winner type trophies were the parents or guardians of the race winners! Never heard a complaint.

 

The creating the derby is the cake and icing ... the race is just the package.

[Fuzzy Bear 12]

People get upset at these things because their son is defeated and the winner usually looks like a professional job (Dad done it all) type car. The inequity of the loss is maintained with plenty of talk around the track after the defeat.

 

Although some contend that a car straight from the box on race day is the secret to success that has not been my experience. I have seen Mom and Pop operations that have had a string of victories over the years. The oldest son won and then the next and the next and so on. The race is everything to the parents and it is the only time of the year they appear. They leave a wake of tears behind them with all of those would be's. I suppose crushing little kids with their superior knowledge and ability is their way of finding success in life. Many in the Pack were elated when that particular crew finally reached the last purpose of Cub Scouting.

 

I told a group of parents once that Scouting taught kids how to lose. Even now, as I reflect on that statement; I find it kind of amusing and not what I was trying to say. I meant that Sportsmanship is one purpose in Cub Scouting. That means that a Scout tries to do his best. It does not mean that he will always win. It means that what he carries away from the event is the lesson.

 

Here are some lessons to pick from:

 

People that cheat will win so, I must cheat to win.

People that get expert help will win, so I must rely on others to do all of my work for me.

I enjoyed working on my car and I got closer to my parents in the process.

I learned some new skills today about how to cut, sand and paint.

After the derby, my parents and I went for ice cream.

Some of the cars were really neat looking, next year I have an idea about making one that looks like an animal.

Why are some cars fast and some are slow. I want to know the dynamics of force and momentum. (*this one is for the nerd within)

 

So, what I am trying to say is work on your son's car with him but also prepare your lesson plan. There can be something very important to be learned.

 

FB(This message has been edited by Fuzzy Bear)(This message has been edited by Fuzzy Bear)(This message has been edited by Fuzzy Bear)(This message has been edited by Fuzzy Bear)(This message has been edited by Fuzzy Bear)

[BelindaB 10]

Thanks for all your help. The friendly guy at ACE hardware helped me find some dry graphite. My son has drawn a design and we're going to try some sawing tomorrow. Again thanks so much for all the suggestions and support.

[OneHour 11]

Belinda,

 

Instead of using the coping saw or the likes, find out in your pack the person who has a band saw and ask him to assist. It takes less than 1 minute with a band saw (the thin saw that goes up and down just in case you don't know what it is). There has to be father who is a woodwork expert in the Pack. 10 out of 10 times, if asked, the person will be more than willing to assist! Let him do the cutting. We made a mistake this past pinewood derby workshop. We had a band saw at the workshop. We usually cut the car, but one father insisted that he could do it by himself. Well after 5 minutes later and one bleeding, deeply gashed thumb, we vowed to ourselves that only we do the cutting at the workshop. Outside of that ... anyone can go at it his finger at his own home!

 

Coping saw will work, but it will be slow and you will need a good clamp. Regular saw will be hard. IMPORTANT: don't forget to knock in your wheel axels when the block of wood is whole and then remove them with a pair of plyers. This way, once you cut the wood and sand it and paint it, all that you would do is to slide the wheel and its axel into the slot ... and glue them. Again ... don't forget 1)the car has to be at least 4oz, but 5oz is the best, 2) make sure that the car runs straight, and finally 3) lube the wheels.

 

Have fun and good luck