Assistant Den Leader Training

[Cubmaster Bill 10]

I'm a new CM and I have "taken over" from a not very proactive CM so I am in the process of making sure everyone is up to speed as far as training is concerned (among other things).

 

I have a assistant den leader who just refuses to go to any training due to the time involved. Am I out of line by suggesting that maybe she needs to step aside? I haven't had this conversation yet as I am not that sure what the emphasis is on assistants getting the training and people willing to volunteer are hard to come by. My den leaders are all up to date with their training.

 

I am going to make sure that everyone involved with the pack has read the scouting safety information.

[EagleInKY 14]

Hmmm, interesting? I guess one question is how does she have the time to be a leader if she doesn't have a few hours to dedicate to training?

 

Since she's an ADL, I might give her a little slack. I would insist, however, on the Youth Protection and Cub Leader Fast Start. Both of these are available to be self-taught (YP is online, Fast Start is video). She really would have no excuse to not take those two. After that, you may have more success getting her to attend regular training.

[NeilLup 13]

Hello Bill,

 

You are not necessarily out of line at all. Depending upon the situation in your Pack, it may be very appropriate. It is great that all of your Den Leaders are trained.

 

Note that this person MUST have Youth Protection Training which can be accomplished on-line. Then, Fast Start can be accomplished on-line.

 

If you have a Pack Trainer, that person can then administer New Leader Essentials and Den Leader Training in your Pack. If not, there still should be training for CS leaders in your area.

 

I would suggest that establishing the attitude that a Leader in your Pack should attend training is very appropriate and enviable. However, you will probably need to "sell" training to some extent and convince people that going to training will actually make Cub Scouting more fun and enable the leaders to get the job done in less time with less work. And if telling someone "I'm sorry, but we believe that our children deserve trained leaders. If you don't have the time to learn how to do things properly, we understand but maybe it's best that you not be a leader." is necessary, you may be very surprised with the result.

 

If we regard training as something special and valuable, our leaders will believe us. If we regard it as something miserable to be suffered through, again, they will believe us.

[fotoscout 15]

Before I did anything I would ask if there was another parent willing to take the position that was also willing to take the training.

 

Once you've established this fall back position, you can confidently go the ADL that refuses to take training and make your case. If she still refuses, you can tell her, "thank you for your service, but I have another interested parent that is willing to be trained".

 

Alternatively, you could offer her some other less demanding job, and suggest that she use her extra time to be trained. Perhaps next year she can return as a Den Leader.

 

[dsteele 20]

Has the individual in question filled out an adult application to be a registered BSA member?

 

Unc.

[Eamonn 61]

Hi Bill,

Welcome to the forums.

You might want to see what your Chartering Organization feels about un-trained leaders, and see how the pack committee feels.

I agree with Neil that training needs to be sold. Depending on what policy's are in place by the chartering organization. If they say that all leaders have to be trained. That's it they are the boss. It could be that they don't have a policy. In which case the pack committee will have to decide what their feelings are and decide if a leader who refuses to attend training is allowed to continue in the pack. They would make sure that the COR runs this past the chartering organization and that everyone is on the same page. It could be that the chartering organization doesn't want someone going around town saying that they were "Fired" By the organization.

You would be over stepping the mark to ask this leader to step aside without the backing of the Pack Committee and if possible the backing of the chartering organization or at least the COR.

While the YP training is a must, to the best of my knowledge the BSA doesn't have anything that makes the other training mandatory. There are some Councils that are demanding that all leaders take training.

You might do well to talk with your unit commissioner about this problem and ask him or her to discuss with you the role of the Cubmaster. You really don't want to get caught up in the removal of adult leaders.

In most cases in Scouting when it and if it comes down to asking someone to leave, the person doing the asking should be the person who signed the Adult Leader Application.

I am 100% for training and trained leaders, but unless there is a policy in place, you as the Cubmaster can't start making up your own rules.

Hope this helps.

Eamonn

[Cubmaster Bill 10]

I'm 99.9% sure that she is registered but I will check tonight to make sure. She is a parent who at least participates so I don't want to push too hard. Basically she just comes to the den meetings and helps hand stuff out. (What I would really like to see are both the leader and the assistant trained and coordinating what is going on in the den so if the leader is absent the meetings still take place. There are usually enough parents around to have enough adults in the room.)

 

The pack committee is not very well organized to the point of not functioning at this point. Basically it is comprised of our COR (who wants the same things I do for our pack but is overloaded with work and home issues) and several others who rarely contribute. There are two I have never even met. None of them have been through any training (except for the old CM and he has major follow through issues). I went to the committee training so that we would all be on the same page but none of them showed up even after we agreed to meet there! I am working with our COR on adding new members to the pack committee and trying to provide some direction. Not sure if that is my job but no one else is doing it.

 

In the meantime I had to take organizing the summer activites on as well as planning a graduation day. Fortunately my boss is a former Scout parent and if I need to leave early to tend to a Scouting issue he is very flexible.

 

I am taking this year as a learning and organizing experience for next year. Otherwise I think I would go crazy!

[scoutldr 726]

One of the purposes of having an "Assistant " is to have someone who can keep the program going in the absence of the primary leader. It is not expected that the DL will be able to attend 100% of the meetings, so the DA has to fill in and take up the load in his/her absence. That means the DA needs to know everything the DL knows, and it's another benefit of "two deep" leadership. Every registered "direct contact" leader should be "Trained" in their position. Some councils are making it mandatory.

[Cubmaster Bill 10]

I e-mailed our COR with the information from this discussion recommending that we require all leaders (including pack committee members) get officially trained. I spoke with our district trainer a few weeks ago about a Saturday training and there is one planned in the fall where they will get new leader essentials, YP and leader specific in one long day. That might make it a little easier on any new leaders or assistants. Normally the training is over two nights in the same week.

 

I'll also check with my district on their trained leader policy.

 

Thanks, you all have given me some great information!

[NeilLup 13]

Hello Bill,

 

You sound as if you are very much on the right track.

 

Please don't race past some of the other comments made. Attending your district training is great and probably gives the best quality training but if you have a qualified person in your Pack or if your Commissioner is qualified or if one of your district trainers is willing, you can run the training in your own Pack. The position of Pack Trainer is specifically intended for the person who does this.