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We currently have about 18 Eureka Timberline 4XT's with the vestibule and we are not very happy with them. The tents are 1 to 3 years old. We camped on both of the last 2 weekends and it rained both times and most of the tents had problems with water penetrating up through the floors. All of the tents were on ground cloths and the edges tucked under but where ever water got between the tent and the ground cloth the water wicked through the tent. Last week end out of the 23 scouts we had to dry 18 sleeping bags Saturday. My tent is a Coleman and almost 20 years old and I did not have any issues with water seeping up. I had given my ground cloth to two of the scouts since we were 1 tarp short. I agree that the Timberline tents look great and they have easily replceable parts but I am at whits end on the floors. I have a couple of questions?

 

1 Are the Timberline Outfitter 4's any better?

2 Do you reccommend any other brand and model tent?

3 How about the Coleman Trailblazer Tent, it has a vestibule and at $65 we can buy 4+ for the cost of a Timberline Outfitter with vestibule???

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After a lot of research, our troop just bought several Eureka Alpenlite 2XT 4-season tents. They weigh about 7.5 lbs each, and can be used as backpacking tents year round by 2 scouts each splitting the gear in their packs. Unfortunately, they are a bit expensive, about $240.00 each brand new from Eureka, but our guys swear by them. Good luck!

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First, are you SURE that the water came from the floor? This time of the year lots of Scouts are zipping their tents shut at night and with the very cool nights that can lead to lots of condensation which eventually makes its way down to the floor. Last fall on a particularly chilly night my son and his buddy zipped his 4-person tent completely up and ended up with puddles - real puddles - on the floor by morning. I KNOW his tent didn't leak since it didn't rain a drop during the weekend.

 

For tents, take a look at http://www.alpsmountaineering.com

 

They offer Scouts a 45% discount. Details are at http://www.scoutdirect.com .

 

I (Scoutmaster) have the 6-person Merimac and the 5-person Taurus. I like them both a lot. The Taurus 4-person is probably closer to what a troop would want for Scouts. The Merimac has lots of netting, which gets a bit drafty for cooler weather camping, but is nice for warm weather camping. Another very nice model is the Vertex 4.0, though I'm not sure if it has the thicker floors and HD zippers.

 

If interested, just call them and ask about the tents. They are real nice folks.

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firemedic...

first sorry you don't like the XTs. We have 21 -XT 2s and 6- XT 4s ...have had most of them for five to eight years of heavy troop activities...we love them. First thing we did when we got them and every fall since has been to seal all seams with seam sealer.

 

As to your "problem"...If the ground cloth is tucked under...just how does water get between the ground cloth and the cover? It should not be able to..unless the tent site is in a depression that allows water to run under the tent or some section of the g.c. was not really tucked all the way under...Or the boys left the vestibule slightly open and the water hit the g.c there...or the fly was not drum tight and water found a way into/onto the main tent body.

 

On a practical level, most of the water problems I have seen (over the last twenty years) even with moderate "quality" tents is usually (frankly) "user error"...seams not sealed, tents not pitched with flys "drum tight" so water from the fly hits the tent "tub" bottom and rolls under the tent (and on top of the ground cloth- by the way) or the rain makes its way to the zippers (not closed completly or not closed at all (in some cases) and water then enters the tent and looks for all the world like it came "up" from the g.c.

 

Nylon floors with urethane coatings will leak if water has been trapped between the nylon fabric and a water proof (plastic/vinyl)ground cloth and has the pressure of several boys on top of it...usually the floor seams leak first...usually the water is forced through the stitch holes before it leaks through the floor fabric... but the more gear that gets dragged across the coating the sooner it will leak...

 

Personally, there are two things you might want to try...the First, is to use a water permeable g.c. (say a sheet of non waterproof canvas) rather than a sheet of plastic...If the tents are in good shape, and the primary purpose of the ground cloth is to protect the floor from rocks and sticks and small trees that the boys should have policed up to begin with this will allow water to percolate through the ground cloth...thus no water in tent...(unless the boys didn't pitch it correctly or in a good spot or left the windows/doors unzipped).

Of course then you have to deal with heavy/damp g.c.s and that host of problems

 

The second, and far away my favorite, is to cut and place your G.C.s inside the tent...the impermeable plastic (we use 6mil builders cloth cut 10-14 inches longer and 10-14 inches wider than the floor) will only let water through if the boys poke a hole in it and it seems to reinforce the nylon floor enough that minor rocks and sticks do not "punch through" and tear your tent floors...

 

If you do this and boys get wet...it ain't the tent floor leaking...

 

Quick story...we were out a few years ago with a group of fairly new scouts...middle of the night, raining cats and dogs, temp had dropped 20 degrees and I hear voices and a flash light beams my tent...three half dressed (no shoes/shirts) scouts whining their tent was leaking and their sleeping bags/clothes were soaked...well, I got up dragged SPL and PLs out of their sacks...sent everyone to the trailer (thankfully this was a truck camp) for a new tent and some emergency wool blankets and went for a "look-see"...These scouts had 1. put their tent in the best place in the whole camp- if you wanted to sleep in a stream during the rain (a swale), 2. half of the G.C. was sticking out of the side of the tent, and 3. best of all (the XT's have two doors), the rear door was totally unzipped so that one of the sleeping bags had "migrated" ten/twelve inches out of the tent and was in the "stream" acting like a big canvas wick!

 

the point being; it was not the tent leaking...

 

last thought for now...condensation..three or four boys can exhale a quart of water over night which can form on the underside of the fly and drip back in the tent and look like water coming from the "floor" so make sure the guys leave both windows open at the top a bit to keep air flowing and reduce condensation...

 

 

(just a follow up question...do you let the boys take their packs into the tents?)

 

Anarchist

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We've got close to 20 Timberline 4 Outfitters and love them! Pretty easy to put up and we haven't had any major issues that I can think of. Yes, they are expensive, but I think they'll last quite a while.

 

I personally have an Alps Mountaineering tent. I don't remember the model name at the moment, but it's a backpacking tent, 2 person with two vestibules and two doors. High quality stuff:)

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We have the Eureka Timberline Outfitter 4's and love them.

Over half of them are more than five years old and you can't tell them from the 2 three year old ones.

The only issue we have run into at all is two of the tents have NO shockcording("before my time" a couple of scouts didn't understand the sections were "tied" together and cut some cords to untangle them - a training program was immediately reinstated), it has been virtually impossible to replace the shockcording even with the kits. We now train prospect Webelos and other prospects before they even join the troop.

 

No wetness issues, no leakage, no holes, no stuck zippers BUT they do take a little bit longer to dry the fly in the morning form the dew than the thinner regular Timberline tents.

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Ditto the comments on Alps Mountaineering. My son has one of their tents and is very happy with it..

 

I have an REI Half Dome that's 6 years old and holding up extremely well, and that's with camping/backing nearly every month of the year.

 

FYI - REI currently has the Half Dome on sale thru May 11 at $109...

 

 

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Can the non-profit account be used for personal purchase? I was thinking that it could only be used for the pack/troop to purchase common gear. That would be great to purchase gear for use for my scouting and non-scouting camping.

 

I have purchased a new Kelty Green Mountain 4 and an Alps Taurus Outfitter tent, but I haven't had a chance to use them. The Kelty was on sale at Costco in December for only $99. I hope to use them soon.

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Scoutingmomma,

 

Yes, sorry, forgot that its a members only sale to get them at the $109 price.

 

Also forgot to mention that you can register your troop with REI ( call their 800 number ) and they will give you an additional 10%, even off the sale price.

 

 

 

 

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The problem of Eureka Timberlines and wet sleeping bags is very easy to fix.

 

Just add "small two or three man tent with bathtub bottom" as an optional item on your Troop's personal equipment list.

 

Kudu

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  • 2 months later...

My son has a 3xta, great tent...dry too, except when there is a user error..... which happens far to offen.. On our last camp out at Medician Mt Scout Ranch SD it rained every night...hard, sometimes with hale..... lots of fun.... stayed dry except for when they left the fly open...or sleep against the side of the tent....

 

Will make one comment on quality... the zippers are bad news, at least his is.... following next camp they will both be replaced... he has about 14 setups... in 3 years with four summer camps...

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