How to handle the issue of medications on outings?

[jcb7265 10]

Our troop is in St. Louis MO. What is the official responsibility of troops regarding medication control/distribution on outings.

[Scoutfish 16]

Officially? It's not their responcibility.

 

 

From the BSA Annual Health Form

 

http://www.scouting.org/filestore/pdf/34605_Letter.pdf

 

 

"The taking of prescription medication is the responsibility of the individual taking the medication and/or that

individuals parent or guardian. A leader, after obtaining all the necessary information, can agree to accept the

responsibility of making sure a youth takes the necessary medication at the appropriate time, but BSA does not

mandate or necessarily encourage the leader to do so. Also, if state laws are more limiting, they must be followed."

 

Now, If a leader wants to take the chance and burden that responcibility on his own, I suppose that's his choice. But the unit itself has no responcibilitry to do so.

[dScouter15 11]

Hi jcb7265 - this topic actually comes up on here quite a bit, maybe even around once every month or so. If you search the archives for "medication," you'll probably come across pages and pages of discussion on this topic.

 

You'll probably also note that discussion of legalities surrounding Scouting medication is a common factor in these discussions, and you'll hear all kinds of claims from people with varying degrees of medical/legal experience and knowledge. My first recommendation would be to get in touch with your DE or council program director and find out if there are any laws specific to your area, or guidance available from your council on this topic - its best to hear these things "from the horses mouth," so to speak.

 

In terms of a troop's "official responsibility," the Guide to Safe Scouting and other BSA policy documents are pretty vague on guidelines for medication control and distribution at the BSA unit level. However, it is clear that the unit does have an official responsibility to ensure the health and safety of all of the youth and adult members of that unit. To me, this means that the unit has a responsibility to ensure that all youth are taking their required medications while under the supervision of the troop's adult leadership; to be reasonably certain that youth cannot easily access the medications that aren't theres; and to maintain an accurate file of BSA medical forms for each scout in the unlikely event of an emergency. How you go about doing this will depend on the specific needs and characteristics of your troop. If you have a smaller troop, I would recommend handling medication on a case-by-case basis with each scout. Have a brief private meeting with each scout who needs medication while camping, and hopefully with his parent as well. Discuss options for medication storage (with the scout, with a designated adult leader, with the scout's parent if in attendance). Discuss with the parent the scout's level of maturity - does he need to be reminded to take his medication each time? There's no need to discuss specific medical history or conditions at this meeting - just establish what level of support that scout needs to maintain health and safety regarding his medications.

 

This model may not work with a larger troop, or in a complicated situation. Can I ask if you're just trying to find some general information on the topic, or if there's a specific situation that prompting your question?

[Twocubdad 665]

Unlike a lot of national policy, this one is remarkly clear and unambiguous. It says what it says.

 

dScouter15, if your unit wants to take responsibility for medications, the policy allows that. But to create a roundabout construct to say that general health and safety requires units to supervise medication contradicts the plain language of the policy.(This message has been edited by Twocubdad)

[Beavah 205]

Yah, jcb, welcome to the forums!

 

Scoutfish gave yeh the official policy. Officially, it's not required of you as volunteers to take responsibility for meds.

 

Different troops and different volunteers, however, may choose to offer some additional support for scouts (or adults), depending on their own level of training and comfort. But yeh should always stay within your comfort zone. Or at least not stretch very far from it.

 

Can I ask the same question as dScouter? Do yeh have a specific issue that your unit is trying to deal with?

 

Beavah

[dScouter15 11]

Twocubdad - that's not exactly what the policy states. The recommendation in the G2SS does acknowledge that any given adult leader is not obligated to take on the responsibility of supervision the taking of prescription medications. However, it does not absolve the *unit* as a whole from its responsibility to provide a safe and healthy environment for its Scouts. Which, in my opinion, unfortunately would mean that the adult leadership would have to take on some degree of responsibility for ensuring that Scouts under their supervision maintain their health and safety by taking their prescribed medications. Furthermore, that quote from the G2SS and the health forms that Scoutfish posted is technically not BSA policy, but rather a guideline or recommendation. I'm not sure that the distinction is important here, but it is the case.

 

To be honest, I think that the reason that this BSA policy (or recommendation, or whatever it is) appears remarkably clear is because it does an inadequate job of addressing the realistic needs and concerns in today's "hyper-medicated" society. Really, that section in the G2SS does nothing to shed light on how unit leaders should respond to any medication related concerns or complicated situations. Let's imagine that the passage Scoutfish quoted was reformed from the health forms and the G2SS - would it's absence make things more complicated than they are now? Hence the vast number of questions posted to forums such as this one, and the inability of offer any real definitive answer.

[nldscout 18]

The reason the national policy is wrote the way it is because you need to follow the laws of the state you are in. In some states its ok for a leader to hold and dispense the meds to the scouts.

 

In some states its a crime to simply have someone elses medication in your posession unless you are the parent.

 

So national can't publish a hard fast rule for everyone.

[jcb7265 10]

This question is raised because a group of parents are accusing a scoutmaster of not following the rules. The Troop's Guide to Parents, makes no mention of specifics, and states what is in G2SS. I have now asked that those parents produce a document that holds the SM or whoever is in charge of the outing accountable for medications.

 

 

 

[Twocubdad 665]

Actually, that's exactly what the policy says. While Scoutfish linked the health forms, the G2SS says the same thing.

 

http://www.scouting.org/filestore/pdf/34416.pdf See page 48.

 

It's only as vague as you want it to be.

 

I do understand the difference between bold-letter policy and the material offered as guidelines in the G2SS. But the G2SS is the document most unit-serving Scouters have access to and are charged to read and follow. If you are aware of an actual policy statement in this regard, I encourage you to post it. Otherwise we need to follow the G2SS recommendations.

 

The long and short of the G2SS recommendation is the Scout and his family is responsible for his medications. A Scout leader may choose to take part of that responsibility, and yes, it can become confusing and complicated, especially if there are complicated medical requirements or if, as nldscout notes, state law complicates the matter. BUT, all those complications arise from an individual leader's decision to become involved with a Scout's medication.

 

Our troop does very well by requiring Scouts to be responsible for their own medications. And yes, we have Scouts with critical medical needs. Frankly, those young men are far better equipped to handle their own medications than any adult in the troop, with the exception of the MD and RN on the troop committee.

 

 

 

 

[Beavah 205]

Yah, thanks for the info, jcb.

 

Can yeh share with us the nature of the condition/medications?

 

As you can see from the discussion with dScouter and TwoCubDad, there are two competing things that we all think about as adult volunteers.

 

The first and most important one is to stay within our own level of comfort and responsibility, eh? If yeh don't feel comfortable guiding kids down a whitewater river, don't do it. If yeh don't feel comfortable or knowledgeable enough to be responsible for a lad's medical condition or medications, don't do it. It is the boy's and the parents' responsibility.

 

The second thing is that we all also try to help boys have a happy, safe, and productive scouting experience, eh? So when we do have the knowledge or ability to help with a boy's special needs, most of us would do that. Or if we could acquire that knowledge or ability without too much effort. If a boy has a bee sting allergy, many scouters and scouts would learn about it, talk to the boy's parents and physicians, take training in epi-pen use, etc. That's never required, eh? But if yeh can't make the accommodation and the parents' won't attend and be responsible, then I think yeh point the boy toward another troop that has those resources.

 

Same with more severe medical issues, eh?

 

Beavah

 

 

[dScouter15 11]

TwoCubDad - I understand what you're saying, but I think you're making it unnecessarily complicated. Policy is policy, and recommendations are recommendations. If the BSA intended for every word in the G2SS to be taken as official policy, they wouldn't have intentionally separated the official policy from the advice and guidelines.

 

As I've stated, in my opinion, the advice on medication management is rather poor, and I instead chose to work off of the recommendations of people whom I feel have more medical and legal credibility, and whose advice more closely relates to the specific challenges and complications I've been involved with over the years. My chosen course of action is not in violation of the BSA policy on medication management, because there isn't one!

 

jcb - Well, the good news is they won't find anything in the BSA literature that requires the SM or any other adult leader to take on that responsibility. So, from the BSA's stand point, that can't be required of him. My next question would be why this group of parents is concerned? Is there some special circumstances occurring where it might be in the Scouts' best interest if the adult leadership shared some responsibility for ensuring health and safety with regard to medication management?

 

And, to clarify my own position - I'm NOT saying that the adult leadership should be required to take on the responsibility of storing and distributing Scouts' medications. I am saying that due to the varying levels of maturity of Scouts in a given troop, the adults may need to share some responsibility for medication management, to ensure the health and safety of each Scout. This may involve simply reminding a Scout to take his medication at the correct time, or maybe keeping a Scouts' medication locked in a private vehicle, or maybe even requiring the Scout's parent to attend overnight outings. This would all depend on the individual needs of each individual Scout, as determined by a brief meeting between the Scout, his parent, and an a responsible adult leader. Hopefully most Scouts should be responsible enough to handle their own medication needs, but I don't think that this should be the official BSA policy (either the actual policy or implied policy) because of the substantial risks to the health and safety of the Scout that supposed to be taking the medication, and the troop as a whole. Just my $0.02.

[evmori 11]

The Troop's Guide to Parents

 

What is this? Is this a document your unit puts together? The G2SS, like Twocubdad posted, is clear on this. Each individual is responsible for their own medication.

[Beavah 205]

I don't think that this should be the official BSA policy (either the actual policy or implied policy) because of the substantial risks to the health and safety of the Scout that supposed to be taking the medication, and the troop as a whole.

 

Can yeh explain this, dScouter?

 

I'm not sure quite what risks "to the troop as a whole" you are anticipating. The BSA guidelines are tailored to minimize (legal) risk to the adults and the troop as a whole, by stating clearly it's not a unit responsibility. It's up to the boy and his parents, and the free-will choice of any volunteer whether to take on that responsibility for a campout.

 

Yah, sure, we can all anticipate circumstances where a lad might forget to take his meds, or feed 'em to the raccoon. So can a rational parent. In such a case, it's up to the parent and adult leader whether or not the boy can/should participate in the event.

 

Personally, I don't think it's wise/good advice on a standing basis to take custody and/or control of medications as an adult volunteer in the program, or otherwise assume responsibility of dispensing Rx meds (with the exception of certain lifesaving meds under standing orders). As nldscout points out, the variety of approaches taken by da several states to the control of substances makes any specific recommendation across state lines foolish.

 

Beavah

 

[jcb7265 10]

The troop has a booklet that they give to the parents of scouts. It addresses troop policies for meetings and outings, expectations of parents, gives parents contact information, and also promotes involvement and training.

 

[evmori 11]

The troop has a booklet that they give to the parents of scouts. It addresses troop policies for meetings and outings, expectations of parents, gives parents contact information, and also promotes involvement and training.

 

Does this information agree (where applicable) with BSA policy? Does this information address personal medication?