Lightning Safety Rules

[milwscout580 10]

I looked in the Guide to Safe Scouting, and I could not find any exact times for how long you must stay off the water for thunder and lightning. Does this mean that there are no set time limits? because at my camp, it is 20 minutes for thunder and 45 minutes for lightning--but they make it sound like it's a national policy. (maybe I have an outdated G2SS)

[epalmer84 10]

Perhaps it is in the mysterious Camp School Manual?

 

The latest G2SS section on lightning makes no mention of times.

http://www.scouting.org/pubs/gss/gss03.html#d

 

 

From the National Lightning Safety Institute:

http://www.lightningsafety.com/nlsi_pls/ploutdoor.htm

 

"Keep a high level of safety awareness for thirty minutes after the last observed lightning or thunder."

 

Ed

[LongHaul 10]

As an AYSO Soccer referee I am advised to immediately stop the game upon hearing thunder. If a second report is heard within 20 minutes the game is cancelled. It is said that lightning may strick out of a clear sky within 10 miles of an electrial storm. As a water front staff person our rule has always been to immediately clear the water upon hearing thunder. Again if a second report is heard within 20 minutes the water front is closed. Observed lightning closes the water front immediately. Nobody wants to close the water front and stop the boys from having fun but who wants to explain why x number of youth were electricuted because we didn't want the boys disappointed?

milwscout580, you use the phrase "stay off the water" as opposed to stay out of the water". This makes me think you are referring to boating rather than swimming. Our water craft are aluminum except for the sail boats which have aluminum masts. Scarry places to be in a lightning storm.

LongHaul

[milwscout580 10]

Yes, I should clarify that when I said "get off the water," I meant it to include swimming, boating (which isn't done very often---we're a Cub Scout Camp) and anyone standing on the piers. When we hear thunder everyone gets out, we do a buddy check, and then we do "rainy day" program on the beach--sand castles, crab soccer, silent ball, etc. Someone then monitors the Lightning detector and weather radio. Lightning shuts us down immediately. New policies (either from National, or maybe just my council, probably because of the lightning incidents in 2005) seem to have been applied this year (2006 season). We go inside immediately for lightning, no matter if you are at Aquatics, Nature, or Archery. The rules are basically the same at the archery and bb ranges and the athletic field, because they are so open.

 

When we got the new regulations, we had trouble "interpreting", I guess you could say. The Health officer had to constantly carry the new lightning detector, and she had to make us sound the severe weather siren whenever the detector went off. Obviously, this was impractical, so they "re-interpreted" the rule to be more practical. she had to watch the lightning detector, weather radion, and the radar on the Internet if it seemed bad or they heard thunder. Lightning still brought the whole camp indoors, though, but it was to cabins, and program continued as best as possible (as opposed to going to the shelters for the severe weather alert). Fortunately, this "re-interpretation" happened by the end of

 

At the Boy Scout camp in the council, they treated lightning like a tornado... they take immediate shelter in three buildings. I was there the first week, and it wasn't fun.(This message has been edited by milwscout580)

[frank10 12]

It may be a state law or health code.

[LongHaul 10]

We don't go to those lenghts in Illinois or in Michigan. Lightning closes Aquatics but not other areas. Severe weather sends everyone back to their campsites but not indoors. Even our Cub Scout camp sends us back to our camp sites but indoors. Probably local council decisions.

LongHaul

[EagleInKY 14]

I think there are state rules that govern this, as well as overall best practices. Around here in Kentucky, it's 30 minutes. The only challenge we have at our camp is that we are fairly close to Fort Knox, so it's difficult sometimes to tell the difference between artillery and thunder. The artillery goes on almost every day and sounds like a distant rumble of thunder. But if you see lightning, it's an immediate evac from the lake and they have to stay our 30 minutes after the last strike.

 

I've spent some time in the desert southwest, where you can see lightning a hundred miles away. I'm sure their guidelines for closing a swimming area would be quite different than ours.

[mmmmontano 10]

We used the 30 minute rule after the last observed lightning or thunder at Northern Tier base at Bisset.

 

Mario

[suzanneoswald 10]

LEt me add one further safety caution from experience. If lightning threatens get into safety or on low ground QUICKLY! Last year we were camping with Cubs, it started to rain, as we rounded the kids up to go across to the pavilion the first and only lightning strike of the storm came - - not 50 feet from where where we were standing on the top of the highest point in the state. Everyone jumped, one of our Eagle scouts "screamed like a girl" (his term). I was standing just outside the dining fly, in a puddle, in moccasins. I got a jolt of electricity up my legs that put me flat on the ground. Luckily no permanent damage was done but we learned to be extra cautious in any situation where lightning COULD strike.

 

Suzanne OSwald

 

[packsaddle 753]

Welcome to the forums, Suzanne. I too have had a few close calls, working on the water. The 30 minute rule is close to optimum.

I have been working on the water several times in the summer when storms were building all around. When you hear buzzing and see tiny sparks flying off the radio antenna of the big hulking aluminum work boat you're on, one only has a few seconds to act or become ground zero. So far, I've survived...probably longer than I deserve.

 

But to help with the work I purchased detectors for the field crews. Here is a web site that has products that are worth considering. There are other similar devices:

http://www.ambientweather.com/handheldlt.html

They are not cheap and they still leave decision up to the individuals but these and similar devices provide much better information than 'rules of thumb'.

Edited Part:

Here's another that is a little more reasonable for a personal budget:

http://www.gemplers.com/pestmgmt/weathermonitoring/alarmsystems/G79950.html(This message has been edited by packsaddle)

[milwscout580 10]

I was the Health Officer at the Cub Scout Camp this summer...

 

Thunder-monitor weather radio and lightning detector. Waterfront shuts down

 

Lightning- Bring people indoors. Fortunately, we only had to do this once, but UNFORTUNATELY, it was at MIDNIGHT!. The Asst. Program Director, Camp Director, Head Cook, and Asst. Cook and I (the only staff left in camp... the next day was the Staff''s Day Off) had to go around to each campsite, wake up the campers, and tell them to move into the cabins. All of the people were apparently pre-warned that this may happen (we were expecting storms) so most were fine with the move. But one parent refused to move, and he stayed in his tent with his son. He later appologised for yelling at the Head cook, because apparently his tent collapsed on him in the middle of the night...

 

 

The Boy Scout Camp revised their procedures... They now have 4 different weather-related siren tones. They send people indoors as soon as lightning is seen, and also I believe as soon as thunder is heard.

 

Tone 1: Hi-Low tone (Level 1 Weather Emergency) Return to your Campsite. Camp-wide program ends when a storm is approaching camp. Troop program continues in the campsites, and Site Guides head to and stay with the Units in the sites. The theory behind this is that when the storm is closer, everyone is accounted for already and they can head to the shelters much more quickly. This is also used for Lost Swimmer and Missing Person.

 

Tone 2: "Police car siren" (Level 2 Weather Emergency) If the campers are already in their sites because of the first siren, they head immediately to the shelter buildings. If the storm approached too quickly for advanced warning, this would be the first siren to go off. Campers would Return immediately to their campsites. Site guides will meet units at the sites and proceed to the shelters as soon as everyone is accounted for.

 

Tone 3: Steady tone (TORNADO) Head for a brick building if you are close to one, otherwise find the nearest ditch. There''s no time to assemble the Unit.

 

Tone 4: Buzzer (Night Weather Emergency) Between 11pm and 6:30 am, this will sound. Scoutmasters should assemble the unit and take them to the shelters. Staff will meet units at the shelters instead of the sites.

 

(In Case you were wondering, we also have a Forest Fire siren and an All Clear siren)

 

It was pretty confusing the first time I heard the procedures, but I''ve pretty much got them memorized now...