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Scoutfish

proper neckerchief placement : over/under?

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I love my uniform. It think it's pretty sharp looking. I like how everything is neat and has it's place (assuming everybody matches) .

 

But one thing I hate, is trying to get my neckerchief to lay right at the collar.

 

Now, I tuck my neckerchief under my collar. Why? Well, that's how I have always seen everybody else do it.

 

But I have seen others wear theirs over the top of the collar.

 

So here's my thing: I do think itb looks neater under the collar, but it is the biggest pain trying to get it to lay flat under the colar and to lay evenly under the cllar on both sides. Then my collar doesn't quite want to lay right at the folding seam.

 

So, I have done some looking, but without knowing the right place, do not know exactly where to look to find out if it should go over or under.

 

I mean, I see the pictures, but over/ under is NOT specifically mentioned!

 

http://www.scouting.org/filestore/pdf/34282.pdf

 

http://www.scouting.org/filestore/pdf/34048.pdf

 

See the uniform guide says under neckwear that it is optional, but refer to insignia guide for specifics, but insignia deals with badges and patches, not neckerchiefs.

 

And as i undersatnd it, long, long ago, in a galaxy not to far at all, shirts were offered without collars. And I read about some older leaders who wear over the collar.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Again, I think under looks neater and more clean, but over sure would be easier to do.

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Traditionally the neckerchief was worn over the collar.

 

I have a reprint of a publication Scouting with a Neckerchief by W.E. Longfellow, copyright 1927, that contains an admonishment by then Chief Scout Executive James E. West about the proper wearing of the neckerchief. After instruction of how to place the neckerchief over the collar, West is quoted To tolerate a conscious disregard for requirements, even in simple matters, breeds disrespect for law and order. A little over the top, but theres no mistaking what the proper way to wear the neckerchief was in Wests day.

 

I think, and other scouters can correct me, that when the stylish ODR uniform came en vogue the neckerchief went under the collar. I think collarless shirts went out of style at that time as well, although I dont see what the problem is with wearing a neckerchief over a collar shirt.

 

I have a collection of old full square neckerchiefs (readily available on eBay) that I choose a couple to wear from. I also have a couple of triangular Cubs BSA (c. 1930-47) neckerchiefs that I also wear. These are larger than the current triangular Cub Scout neckerchiefs.

 

I think the look of the neckerchief over the collar is both traditional and more "rugged" looking than under. You dont see scouts of the Old West with neckerchiefs under the collar.

 

Please wear your neckerchief proudly! It is one of the traditional, universal symbols of Scouting!

 

YIS

Mike

 

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I neckerchiefs, too, Cimarron and I always wear mine proudly. Like you, Mike, I have a huge collection of the old full-square neckerchiefs that I wear over the collar. They are big, and comfortable, and they look fantastic.

I an glad that there is a groundswell of support for neckerchiefs. They are indeed the traditional and universal symbol of Scouting.

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For BSA troops:

It is proper to wear a neckerchief.

It is proper not to wear a neckerchief.

If worn, it is proper to wear over the collar.

If worn, it is proper to wear undert the collar.

 

What is not proper is not to have uniformity amongst the troop. Also, the top button on a unform shirt is always to remain unbuttoned.

 

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From the Insignia Guide:

 

"The Neckerchief

Official neckerchiefs. Official neckerchiefs are triangular in shape. Tiger Cub neckerchiefs are orange and blue. Cub Scout neckerchiefs are gold with blue border for boys working in the Wolf Handbook, light blue with dark blue border for boys working in the Bear Handbook. The universal Cub Scout emblem is displayed in a central position on the downward corner. Cub Scout leaders may wear the blue and gold Cub Scout leader's neckerchief. Webelos Scouts wear the gold, green, and red plaid neckerchief with the Webelos emblem on the downward corner. A Webelos leader wears a neckerchief similar to the Webelos Scout neckerchief, �except that it has gold embroidered edging and is larger.

 

A special Lone Scout neckerchief, No.�00703A, is gold with the black and red printed insignia of the lone Scout. It is worn by both Lone Cub Scouts and Lone Boy Scouts.

 

Boy Scout neckerchiefs are optional. The troop decides by vote, and all members abide by the decision. If the neckerchief is not worn, then the shirt is worn with open collar. Boy Scout and Boy Scout leader neckerchiefs may be worn in a variety of plain colors and contrasting borders. Those available through Supply Group include the embroidered universal Scouting emblem if perma-press, or printed if not. Troops choose their own official neckerchief.

 

Local councils may prescribe the specific official neckerchief to be worn by Boy Scouts and Scouters on a council or district basis.

 

The neckerchief is worn only with the official uniform and never with T-shirts or civilian clothing. All members of a troop wear the same color.

 

Special neckerchiefs, the same size as the official ones, may be authorized by local councils. Such neckerchiefs may include identification of the chartered organization. The standard �designed neckerchief may be personalized with troop number, city, and state. By troop approval an Eagle may wear an Eagle neckerchief."

 

and

 

"b. The unit has a choice of wearing the neckerchief over the collar or under the collar."

 

http://www.scouting.org/scoutsource/Media/InsigniaGuide/03.aspx (scroll down to the bottom for info on neckwear)

 

From the Boy Scout Uniform Inspection sheet:

"The troop/team has the choice

of wearing the neckerchief over the turned-under collar or under the open collar."

 

So when wearing the neckerchief over the collar, one turns the collar to the inside of the shirt, so that it resembles the old collarless shirt.

 

 

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For whatever reason, someone in the 1970s came up with the necker under the collar. And we all knwo how bad the 70s were in scouting. I have always worn the necker over the collar.

 

BUT the "Elvis" collar of the CU make it a bit more challenging IMO to wear it properly under the collar. I've found that in order to get it set correctly when I tuck the collar in, I must button it, then tuck it.

 

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Until we got the "Oscars", the long sleeved "winter" shirt had a collar that was turned under to mimic the short sleeved "summer" shirt with its V-neck. Adults, in long sleeves, had the option of wearing the appropriate necktie, of course with the collar out.

When I reached the point of needing new shirts, I continued to turn the collar under, but the Scouts with whom I was associated preferred to wear the neckerchief under the collar and complain that the collar covered part of the identification on the necker.

Last week my grandson got his first Cub Scout uniform and complained about the fit of the neckerchief, over or under the collar. I showed him the way in which I wear a necker, he tried it and liked the feel with the collar turned under and the necker smooth against his neck.

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The proper way is around your neck. Unless, or course, it is being used to tie a splint or hold a bandage.

 

I've had people come up to me a put it under, take it out and even un-tuck my collar. grrrrrh

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Sometimes as SM I wear the green tie. I put that under my collar. Sometimes my WB necker, over the collar, sometimes the troop necker, over the collar, sometimes no necker at all. Sometimes I wear campaign hat, sometimes expedition hat, sometimes garrison cap sometimes a stocking cap when it's cold enough.

 

Neither of these items is official in the troop although most boys wear no hat and troop necker.

 

However, they always wear a uniform shirt and pants. Most have the official scout belt and socks, if they are wearing uniform shorts.

 

Regardless of how well we uniform up or not uniform up, we still wear more uniform than any other troop in the council.

 

Stosh

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Our Troop folds the collars into their shirts then they can just put the neckerchief around their neck without having to worry about the over/under thing!

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