Another Hiking MB Question

[andrews 10]

This question came up in a discussion about the revised requirements for the Hiking MB with the Scoutmaster of our troop.

 

He argued that since it didn't explicitely say so, one of the 10 mile hikes could be part of the reequired 20 mile hike. I have the impression that this is not the case, that because they are itemized seperately, they must be different hikes.

 

Does anyone have a good argument either way?

 

Brad

[OldGreyEagle 5]

I was aghast when I first read this posting. Then I went to Meritbadge.com to check the requirements.

 

http://meritbadge.com/bsa/mb/061.htm (and its the 2001 revised ones as well)

 

I could see where you could assume you could combine a 10 and a twenty, which I beleive is against the intent of the requirements.

 

The Asterisk statement at the bottom mentions the hikes of requirements 5 AND 6, not 5 and maybe 6.

 

Plus, if you have to do a write up of each hike, what do you do for the 10/20 mile hike? You write a paragraph about the first tem miles and then copy it and add the second 10 miles?

 

If this gets interpreted to mean a 10/20 mile hike is ok, the scouts will learn that finding loop holes is as important as meeting requirements, whether they are specificaly stated or not.

 

 

[Rooster7 11]

It's not the SM's decision. It's the merit badge counselor's dilemma. Frankly, I don't see any SM or merit badge counselor signing it off (counting a 20 miler as 10 and 20 mile hikes). Regardless, this is not a decision which a Troop or SM needs to be (or should be) debating. In the end, it will be up to the individual merit badge counselor (assuming there is no clear direction from BSA). Personally, I think it is pretty clearthey should be two separate hikes. My argument...Use common sense (although that might ruffle a feather or two).

[Mike Long 10]

He is wrong. They should be two separate hikes.

[P_Swigs 10]

What would possess a Scoutmaster (of all people) to think a ten mile hike could be incorporated into the twenty mile hike? One would think a suggestion like that would come from an uninformed parent looking to make things easier for "little Johnny", not the leader of the Troop to whom the Scouts are to look up.

 

Scouts shouldn't do things because they are easy. They should do things because they are hard, because it's the best way to measure their skills, preparation and endurance. For a Scoutmaster to suggest otherwise is ludicrous.

 

 

[eisely 13]

I like Rooster7's suggestion to use common sense. In my mind there are two separate hikes called for. That is the way we do them in our troop. There are many ambiguities in scouting rules and policies. Some of that is intentional. Some of it is not.

 

Adding more written rules isn't always a good answer. In a previous thread on a different subject I advocated a written policy on a specific subject matter of unit management. But sometimes it seems that the more that is written, the more there is to argue about. Take the bible and the Internal Revenue Code as examples. Keep it simple.

[jmcquillan 10]

There ya go again, eisely, throwing that ol' "common sense" thing around again. :-)

 

Isn't it interesting how the notion of common sense escapes so many these days? Of course they're meant to be separate hikes. Otherwise, why not revise the requirements to eliminate 10 miles of unnecessary hiking?

 

DUH........

 

It's exhilarating, at the least, to realize how many folks out there still look for, and preach, finding the easy way out, doing as little as possible to get by, getting others to do the work for you, etc,. etc. It's also a little more than sad to realize that Scouting values have been invaded by those with that kind of mentality.

 

[P_Swigs 10]

It's also far better to know that there are many, many more Scout leaders who guide the boys toward truly EARNING their way instead of getting "pencil-whipped" through. The satisfaction in having done the job completely will stay with them forever.

 

 

[andrews 10]

In defense of my friend, I think he was more surprised at the rewrite of the rules, which kept a hike our district does annually from meeting all the required hikes. They do a 10, 15, 20 and then 50 miler (split into 25 out Friday, 25 back Sunday). That used to meet all the requirements I believe, now it is short by a 10 mile hike.

 

I also don't know if it meets the "plan the hike" requirements.

 

It came up because I was discussing working with my own sons on the badge (I am a registered counselor for it.) He reminded me about what the district does.

 

As a side note, my oldest is only Star and has enough elective merit badges for his first palm, so I don't mind working with him on another merit badge. They both are aiming at getting all of them, so we shall see.

 

Brad

[yarrow 10]

Several of the badges are written this way.......hiking, cycling, lifesaving and so on to allow the scout to work up to a long hike or bike trip. Not all young boys could do a 20 miler out of the gate. Although most could run circles around me. I should think the average adult would see these hikes as conditioning for the final "big one". Go figure.

[Mike Long 10]

"Common sense isn't very common."

-Voltaire

 

Look him up and check out how long ago he lived.

[13EagleT430 10]

I did the Hiking MB, and did not combine the 10/20 hikes. It is a good idea i hadn't seen. But from my point of view you cant combine the hikes. Most would say the same thing.