DLister

I think some of the smaller' date=' more detailed rules are stupid. Especially the rules about the OA sash not being worn on the belt.[/quote']

 

I realize I'm responding to a post from August, but I want to address this specific point. There is a symbolic reason for wearing the OA sash over the right shoulder and not in any other way. It is explained in the Ordeal ceremony right before the sash is given to the new members. Plus, there are two things to consider: first, a scout is obedient; second, adults should be setting the example for the scouts.

 

 

44 I am not talking about merit badges..... A lad can wait till the COH to be given them.

 

 

I am talking rank, Like peri, we use troopwebhost and I or the CC can enter he pasted his BOR immediately and we simply print the advancement form from the program to be turned into council.

 

A gain I am a member of a small troop and that maybe the difference.

 

 

 

 

How about a scout who wants to wear his MB sash at an Eagle CoH in a couple of weeks for a friend from another troop? Or a new scout who just completed his first merit badge... do you tell him "good job, now you have to wait three months before you actually receive the badge"? They earned it, don't make them wait for it.

92hatchattack: I grew up in an area where none of the leaders wore knots (except the Eagles) Here, I've seen some local leaders who wear 4-5 rows (even though the uniform policy says only wear 5). Get with your Committee Chair and Pack Trainer...you'll be surprised how easy they are to earn...and leaders like recognition just like the scouts. We should be able to recognize our Pack Leaders for all they do. A small square cloth knot really doesn't say a lot, but at the same time...it does say "We noticed, and we appreciate all you do."

The Guide to Awards and Insignia recommends no more than 3 rows of knots, but since it's a recommendation and not an absolute decree, I'd call it more "wearer's discretion".

I don't see a reason why units should have a lot of direct contact with their DE to begin with. For most needs/issues they should be utilizing their commissioner and/or the district committee. For recruitment materials, talk to the district membership chair, FOS presentations should be done by volunteers under the direction of the district finance chair, commissioners can be asked to help guide units in solving their problems, etc. Yes, I realize that not every district has the resources to do things in the ideal manner, but shouldn't we be working towards that goal?

The Amateur Radio Operator rating strips are now available from National at http://www.scoutstuff.org/bsa/new-items/emb-amateur-radio-operator.html. I'm not sure yet if they've made it into the brick-and-mortar stores yet though. In case anyone's curious about the size, they're the same height at interpreter strips.

44 I am not talking about merit badges..... A lad can wait till the COH to be given them.

 

 

I am talking rank, Like peri, we use troopwebhost and I or the CC can enter he pasted his BOR immediately and we simply print the advancement form from the program to be turned into council.

 

A gain I am a member of a small troop and that maybe the difference.

 

 

 

 

Why treat merit badges different from rank advancement in this situation? They should also be awarded at the earliest possible convenience, not just at Courts of Honor. I'm not suggesting troop stock-pile MB patches as well, but to make a scout wait up to 3 months for it doesn't sound kosher to me.

Dlister,

 

Are you sure about the district members and camping requirement being waived? I don't recall that and we never nominated someone form the district unless they met the camping requirements.

 

Yep I know that OA is considered free labor in some councils. But think about it, if it wasn't for OA lodges, a lot of camp maintenance infrastructure would have to be paid for, increasing the cost of going to camp. A few years back, I did a comparison of our summer camp and other local camps, and we were the cheapest by a lot. And I say that the OA is the reason for keepign the costs down.

 

Now CSDC we are the second cheapest, but only b/c of a federal grant that pays for all expenses.

 

As been repeatedly said, all scouting is local. Every lodge is different. I've been in lodges where the W.W.W. really meant Work, Work, Work, and I've been in lodges that had a balance.

 

In relation to outdoor skills, unfortunately I've seen the same deterioration, and I blame it on the BSA's current emphasis on FCFY and not on mastery of skills as in the past. Also the current BSHB is woefully inadequate when it comes to outdoor skill. I had to make my own pamphlet for IOLS b/c the info was not there. Besides 15 days and nites of camping, including 1 long term is easily doable in a year. using my troop's calendar, 2 days and nites(Fri-Sun) times 10 months + 1 six day and nite summer camp (Sun - Sat) = 26 days and nites.

 

Now the comment abut OA being a little more difficult gets a laff from me. I'm a "blue looper" now, and I was told at one OA event that "Cubs don't need to camp," and " Cub families dont' know how to camp, they pack everything in their cars and expect to drive up to the campsite and drop it off." Then at a camp event a month or so later, the same people drive up to where they are going to be at, and proceed to unpack their SUVs. While me the "Blue Looper" has parked my car in the main lot, and proceed to hike in with everything in my backpack for the event

I am 100% positive about the ability of the camping requirement to be waived by the lodge adviser and council executive for district and council scouters. See page 21 of the Guide to Officers and Advisers, available at http://www.oa-bsa.org/resources/pubs/#goa.

Now that is funny...

 

An organization of Honor Campers where you don't actually have to camp to be a member....

 

Talk about losing credibility.

The ability to waive the camping requirement for non-unit Scouters has been in place for at least the last 20 years. This is just a guess on my part, but I wouldn't be surprised if it is allowed so district and council Scouters who might not have the opportunity/ability to attend a long-term camp but would still be an asset to the OA can be inducted. I understand the same argument could be make for some unit-level Scouters, but I don't make the rules and haven't found a place that the intentions behind them are explained.

Hey everyone' date=' question for those in the know. Can the district nominate scouters for the OA? If so, I was wondering if camping requirements can be waived? I have seen conflicting reports. [/quote']

 

The answer to your question can be found at http://www.oa-bsa.org/resources/pubs/GOA-2012.pdf on page 21. To paraphrase, the district chairman can nominate scouters ***whose primary registration is with the district*** to the lodge nomination committee and the camping requirement may be waived. If a scouter has their primary registration with a unit, this procedure may not be used for them.

The safeguarded Order of the Arrow subforum for members-only discussion seems to have disappeared. Is this a permanent change or will it return?

#51 - Alumni Award

 

Red, blue, and yellow know on khaki with gold border

The change allowing 1 adult nomination per 3 youth elected does not take effect until January 1, 2013. It's likely they will update the Lodge Adviser's Handbook online at that time to reflect the change.

I know this was posted a month ago but I feel this misunderstanding should be addressed:

 

They show up for election, where I have to remove my just bridged Webelos or none of my Scouts get elected (the newly bridged boys won't vote, and those are counted in the percentages).

 

There are two different percentages to consider when an election is conducted. First, are at least 50% of registered troop/team members UNDER 21 (yes, this includes ASMs between 18 and 20) present? Second, was a candidate for election voted for on at least 50% of ballots TURNED IN? If a scout declines to turn in a ballot it does not count against those eligible for election. This is different than turning in a blank ballot which is considered a vote against everyone.

 

Now on to a more recent post...

 

SeattlePioneer: There was not a maximum # that could be elected that I've ever heard of. The limitation (eliminated in the mid-'90s) was that you could only vote for half of the scouts eligible. I was a youth when the change was made, and contrary to the doomsday predictions, the number of scouts elected (at least in my lodge) did not explode. In fact, it stayed fairly constant. Now, as far as you being considered a "Sash 'N Dasher", don't forget that an Arrowman's first responsibility is to his unit. If as SM you were exemplifying the values of the OA and encouraging your scouts to do the same, then I'd definitely call that being active.

I find it interesting that Venture Patrol Leader is not an acceptable POR for Eagle but is for Star and Life. I wonder if that was an oversight on National's part.

David CO - Would you mind explaining what you mean by "cultural appropriation"? I'm not going to try to change your mind at all, but as a chapter adviser it would help me to understand objections some scouters have to the organization.

Basement - I guess that depends on if you think paraffin fits the definition of a chemical fuel (liquid, gaseous, or gelled fuels) from the G2SS.

From page 8 of the Guide for Officers and Advisers (available for anyone to read at http://oa-bsa.org/resources/pubs/GOA-2010.pdf):

 

"Chapter advisers and staff advisers are appointed annually by the Scout executive to support the purpose of the Order and give active leadership to that purpose."

 

In larger councils, the SE will probably delegate this to the lodge and staff advisers, hopefully with input from the district(s) involved.

The election was conducted correctly. "Selective abstaining" is not a possibility, and I don't believe Eagle92 was trying to say that.

 

Twocubdad - Scouts must be listed on a simple majority of ballots cast. If a scout does not turn in a ballot, he still counts towards the quorum but not towards the number of votes needed to be elected.

From the OA handbook:

 

"The official Order of the Arrow sash is available for members through the lodge or local council service center, or through the Supply Division of the BSA. It is a white fabric sash with a red arrow embroidered upon it.

...

Sashes may not be altered in any way or form. Beading or any other material is not permitted on the sash. Nothing is to be worn on the sash, including signatures, patches of any kind, pins, or "legends" (embrordered or drawn illustrations of the history of the Order of the Arrow or of the local lodge). The only exceptions are the 50th and 60th anniversary awards. Either if these may be worn as an option, by those who have earned them, on the shoulder portion above the bar at the point of the arrow."

 

Interpret it as you will. I doubt discussion here will change anyone's mind about wearing/not wearing a beaded sash.

I second the suggestion to contact the chapter and lodge advisers, but don't ask them to show the national policy backing up the chapter chief's email. Simply ask why additional requirements are being added to the election of eligible scouts contrary to national policy.

Most likely the upcoming royal wedding. I didn't get an invite either.

ScoutNut - Looking at the OP's profile, he is the chapter chief. I do agree that checking w/ the lodge or other chapters for ceremonies that may already be in use in that area is a good idea though.

SeattlePioneer - You were probably selected for OA membership for the ability other adults saw in you to help fulfill the purpose of the Order which is to:

 

Recognize those who best exemplify the Scout Oath and Law in their daily lives and through that recognition cause others to conduct themselves in a way that warrants similar recognition.

 

Promote camping, responsible outdoor adventure, and environmental stewardship as essential components of every Scouts experience, in the unit, year-round, and in summer camp.

 

Develop leaders with the willingness, character, spirit and ability to advance the activities of their units, our Brotherhood, Scouting, and ultimately our nation.

 

Crystallize the Scout habit of helpfulness into a life purpose of leadership in cheerful service to others.

 

Notice that nothing is mentioned about going to meetings or events. If you're doing these things in your unit, and from your posts it sounds like you are, then you're supporting the Order. Paying your annual lodge dues helps support the programs of your lodge and National but does not obligate you to do anything more that you're already doing.

The local council for that area might be interested in preserving that history. If you don't know what council it is, you can find it by inputting the address at https://beascout.scouting.org/.

emb021 - The change was made in January 1997. Under the old rules, it was still possible for every eligible candidate to be elected, but it required each eligible scout to be voted for on exactly half of the ballots turned in.

 

I think the current procedure is better because it allows the scouts voting to judge the merits of each candidate individually instead of having to compare them against each other. Interestingly enough, when the change went into effect the number of scouts being elected did not significantly increase in my lodge.