dhendron

I retired as a peace officer after 33 years in 2013. I currently own and operate a mobile notary public business.

Having been involved in co-ed Scouting (a Venturing Crew, and now a Sea Scout Ship) since 2008, and comparing to that my experience as Scoutmaster, I have to say I like co-ed much, much better. I hope they do make the change, which (correct me if I am wrong), would put us in line with international Scouting. 

I would love to see the gals in Order of the Arrow...

Another completely stupid rule I think we will ignore.

Our Council (San Diego - Imperial) began requiring adult applications for our 18-21 year old Venturer's and Sea Scouts with the recharters for the 2015 year. No phased-in period here, I guess.

I echo the suggestions above re getting your charter org rep involved. A sit down him him/her, the SM and the committee chair to ensure everyone is on the same page. This is Boy Scouts, and most charters want a traditional Boy Scout program. As a former SM myself, I have had leaders go off of the rails before on the thankfully rare occasion. Sadly, as charter rep I have been forced to dismiss two leaders (an SM and an ASM) a few years ago, and did some housecleaning again last year in our Troop and Crew. A reminder to your wayward ASM that he serves at the pleasure of the charter, along with what he committed to do as an ASM when he signed on the dotted line appears to be in order. We are all volunteers, and as such take the good with the not so good. Hopefully, after a wake-up call, your ASM can join the team. If not...well, he can always be encouraged to find other opportunities elsewhere. Just make sure it is done diplomatically, and that anything that occurs is for a better youth program. Good luck!

You're welcom, LeCastor! I put on this training a few nights ago. I updated the PPT and edited the link above with the newer version. I hope the leaders here find the presentation useful to their units.

We get the same thing here in the San Diego - Imperial Council.

 

So, at this point I have taken care of my own problem and have a PowerPoint with presentation notes ready to go. It follows the syllabus. If anyone wants to download it, feel free. Here is the link:

 

https://www.dropbox.com/s/49v0zv6856z1pm2/Crew%20Committee%20Challenge%20Training.pptx?dl=0

 

 

Feel free to modify it to suit your needs. If anyone spots any errors or omissions, please let me know and I will take a look at it.

No, nothing online and apparently BSA has no plans to do so or offer the training via the Councils. However, they do require that committee members have the training and supplied a PDF syllabus. We asked why they weren't planning on doing an online training like the troop committee training, but they simply say that there are no plans to make an online version on my scouting.org. We're on our own if we want to satisfy JTE requirements.

Hi all! Checking in to see if someone has access to a Venturing Crew Committee Challenge PowerPoint they would be willing to share? I have been asked to do the training. No point in reinventing the wheel as they say. Thanks! Dave

I dont know where this was ever determined HAZING. Hell we did it as youth' date=' its just a stupid game like the cinnamon test or the new light myself on fire test. Its Kids being KIDS, let them be kids [/quote']

 

The problem with the "kids will be kids" approach is that in our case (see the 2010 post), it sent one of those kids to the urgent care. No, this is not "slug bug" or something else that is painful but relatively harmless. This can result in permanent injury. Would we react the same way if instead of "sack tapping" they were taking turns poking each other in the eye? Nope. This kind of thing is a serious issue requiring a serious response.

On this note, our unit is involved in a six-month ordeal (so far) getting lost paperwork handled. We submitted some adult leader awards and two leader applications in January. All were promptly lost. Resubmitted to the DE. Lost. Contacted the DE again to get it taken care of with cc's to his supervisors...some back and forth about it from the DE, but no awards and the leader applications were not processed. Somewhere along this someone got into the leaders record, added him as a committee member in the troop (he is the chartered org rep and has never been a committee member) and took him off of the Venturing crew entirely. A few days ago, we had finally had enough and fired an email missile cc'ing everyone up to the Scout Executive. Miraculously, the leader application issue, which had appeared to be insurmountable the day before, was fixed.

 

While this was all going on, other leader and youth applications were submitted and promptly lost. We were able to get those handled within a couple of months without having to annoy the SE about it.

 

The leader awards are going nowhere still (Council says they were processed and the certs and knots left in the DE's mail, so they don't want to reprocess them...we're in a Catch 22 on that one), but at least our COR can see the unit's leaders on my.scouting.org now.

I don't think there is a policy...except that the Scout Law comes to mind.

Does anyone have information on a Powder Horn Course Directors conference in the western U.S. any time this year? http://www.powderhorn-bsa.org is rarely updated for these, and my own attempts to have my own PH course in San Diego posted have been unsuccessful. Me and one of our ACD's have been trying to find a course for over a year without success and time is running out quick. Thanks!

Our DE's often look like they just stuck their finger in a wall socket! I know from talking to them that the time commitment is significant, including most nights and weekends. I am glad folks want to do the job as it is needed, but why they would for $36K a year is beyond me. I only know one that happily did it for an entire career and retired (he lived and breathed Scouting and never failed to have a smile on his face, what a great guy!), but most I have known tend to do it for a few years and move on. There is a lot of pressure to meet the various goals that are placed on the DE's, and some Council's are quite aggressive in dismissing DE's who do not meet their goals, whether they had any way to actually make it happen or not.

I had to laugh after all this discussion about the pin that I received one from a Silver recipient at his Silver Award presentation. I wear it quite proudly on my uniform even though the thing is as big as a house (okay, not quite that big...but still pretty darn big), along with my own Eagle Dad pin (not one of these guys that wears all the Eagle Mentor pins received over the year...gad, where would I put them? I have way too much stuff on the uniform as it is!).

 

Whatever the original intent of the pin, I like how it is being used now. Our Crew bought out the meager supply from our Council (they are not ordering any more) in case anyone else wants to give them out at their award ceremony).

Yeah, just get out. A letter to the SM, CC and the chartered organization on your way out wouldn't hurt (make sure all three receive it). Don't worry about whether the issue gets solved or not. That is not your problem. Perhaps a copy to the UC for whatever that is worth.

 

Perhaps your son can maintain some contact with his friends in the first troop and tell them how awesome his new troop is and why. If the new troop is better, perhaps some of them will make the switch, too. For my part, when an SM was apathetic (or in this case, perhaps pathetic would be the appropriate word if he is letting the CC run the show), when boys and their families bailed, it got some notice and the issue gets handled. But in the end, move on and don't look back.

I think it is silly when chartered organizations act like this. It is akin (in my mind anyway) to a parent saying, "Hey, I agreed to raise you...I never said anything about actually supporting your efforts. No, you can't have any stuff, no I won't support your activities, no..." What is the point of them hosting a BSA unit if they are only paying lip service to the agreement?

 

Yep, the agreement does not specifically mention storage, but seriously, how do they think they are going to fulfill the last part of the agreement ("Encourage the unit to participate in outdoor experiences, which are vital elements of Scouting.") without providing a location with which the unit can store gear necessary for the vital outdoor experience?

In our Council (San Diego-Imperial) the assumption is that the submitted paperwork will be lost. It has become a sad institutional joke. We keep copies of everything submitted. At one point, 100% of everything except new applications were lost, including advancement forms, reimbursement requests, leader recognitions, etc. I submitted many items at least two times. Some we got, some we didn't. I always wonder how all that paperwork gets lost, until one year I found out that a Council employee was simply shredding a lot of her work. I am guessing that is how a lot of it ends up.

 

Last year, we had a new approach from Council: simply ignore the paperwork...we had this with ALL of our high adventure awards submitted for 2013 (we finally gave up and retrieved all of the paperwork recently from Council and the youth never got their patches). I submitted a recognition to our DE a couple of weeks back, and his response was essentially that he was going to turn it in the following day and it would be immediately lost. Pretty frustrating sometimes.

Has Any Crew Opted to adopt the Boy Scout Shirt as their "main" shirt?

I copied this from ussscouts, but it cites the governing language on this. We see this occasionally here (San Diego), too, but it is rare and usually elicits a comment from the youth:

 

The 'Official' word on Venturing uniforms comes from the Venturing Reference Guide, included with the Venturer/Ranger Handbook (#33494B, 2005 Printing) on pages 78-95 (Venturer half) and Venturing Leader Manual (#34655D, 2003 printing) on pages 328-336. The current version from the Venturer Handbook (pg 93-94) and Venturing Leader Manual (pg 335) says:

 

Uniforms and Insignia (BSA). The BSA green Venturing shirt is available for wear by Venturers and adult leaders. The green Venturing short-sleeve shirt with green shoulder loops will be worn with charcoal gray shorts or long pants as the recommended field uniform for Venturers. Male and female Venturers should not wear the BSA tan shirt with green shoulder loops. Existing insignia placement policies related to BSA uniforms shall apply to the green Venturing shirt. Crews choosing to wear a patch related to their specialty may do so on the right shoulder sleeve. District, division, council, and national adult leaders related to Venturing may wear the green, silver, or gold shoulder loops with the green Venturing shirt. Sea Scouts may choose to wear nautical-style uniforms using Sea Scouting insignia available from the BSA Supply Division. For further information on BSA uniforms and insignia, contact your BSA local council or refer to the Venturer Handbook. A uniform, if any, is the choice of the crew.

dhendron, that's an interesting question. But to me, it would be/should be like an Eagle mentor pin. I can't see such a pin being something that you fulfill requirements to be awarded. Someone either considers you their mentor or doesn't and uses it to recognize your contribution to their life. We have plenty of awards and knots that come with requirements. Mentor isn't one of them.

I completely agree! I just seem to recall (and found some notes to the effect) that there were going to be requirements for the pin from comments on this forum (the comments being a gripe that National had issued the pin without the requirements for earning it). I recall thinking at the time that I hoped not, that it would be the same as the Eagle Mentor pin, perhaps given out to helpful individuals by a Silver recipient at his or her Court of Honor. I have lots of Eagle Mentor pins, and would be honored by any Scout who felt I had been helpful to him or her. Thanks for the comments, everyone!

Congrats on getting the pin!

 

I have a question, though. I seem to recall some time ago when they first started making the Venturing Mentor pin available, that there was some discussion of the requirements for earning the pin, complaints that BSA had put out the pin without the requirements for earning it. I don't think anyone knew for sure if there WERE requirements, of what exactly the pin was for. For my own part, I wondered if the pin was just that: a mentor pin just like the Eagle Mentor pin. Does anyone know for certain?

Isn't a scout (and scouter) respectful? (13th point of the scout law). We'll go to whatever religious services are available to the troop. It is usually Christian, but many flavors of that. It has also been Jewish or Muslim. We don't "make" everyone go. But do encourage attendance, as much as learning about other traditions as showing respect for others. Our troop chaplain's aides do a terrific job using materials from many faiths and spiritual traditions (we're not chartered by a religious group).

I think the 13th point of the Scout Law is "A Scout is hungry" but I could be mistaken...

Seeing as this is a Scouter forum, I don't think we are your target audience. What is a Venture Scout?

Actually, there is no such thing as a "Venture Scout" or a "Venture Crew" and never has been. A Venturing Crew member is a youth (male or female, depending on the demographics for that particular Venturing Crew) that is registered with a BSA Venturing Crew.

 

The word "Venture" is no longer officially used by BSA. Its last use was associated with the "Venture Patrol", which I understand (correct me if I am wrong) is no longer officially supported by BSA although they still sell the patch and many units still have them. This was intended to be a high adventure patrol of older boys in a Boy Scout Troop.

Some folks might bristle at this, but the Chartered Organization Rep has a number of responsibilities, but setting unit policy is not one of them. The role of the COR is spelled out here: http://www.scouting.org/filestore/pdf/04-113.pdf . You will not find any reference to his or her setting of unit policy, or anything like that, in the document. Of course, if he or she does not like what you are doing, they can fire you, but that is another issue and would be retaliation for not following a directive that is not their place to make in the first place.

 

Uniform police aside, posters here have given a number of reasons why they use patrol patches. Wood badge, adult leader team solidarity, etc. If you want to use them, go ahead. If the COR doesn't like it, politely thank him for his opinion and refer him to the Scoutmaster, who DOES set program policy and DOES have the right to set uniform policy in the unit. Who does it harm? No one. It is often fun (we proudly wore our Old Goat patrol patches: I loved the ghost writing that read, "Ask your Patrol Leader"), designates a Wood Badge Patrol, etc.

 

So, have a little fun, don't worry about the folks who worry about what is on your uniform (let them worry about their own uniforms instead), and lead on!

 

Good luck!

Heck, even if for some reason you think that what another person's sexual preference is somehow has something to do with you (why???), look at it this way: this gives us an opportunity to reach boys and girls (Venturing and Sea Scouts, yay!) and teach them all the great things about Scouting. Plus, we will probably get some terrific leaders (who out there has enough leaders...anyone?).

 

Now, how can that possibly be a bad thing?