CrewMomma

Hi All!

Even IF your spouse is involved in scouting with you, it still can drag on your family! Both my husband and I are leaders and WB trained. We both spent several years on staff at WB. He is a Scoutmaster, I am (was) an associate leader in a Venture Crew. Our son just made Eagle and we are both sensing that it is Time to take a step down.

What we struggled with as a scout family is that the only family time we had was with whatever activity was going on with the Troop! We didn't have plan family events because there was so much going on with the troop, as this is a very active troop! The other big issue was seeing how the politics that happen within the organization (like every organization) take a heavy emotional toll on our whole family.

When it starts to become something that is resented, then it is time to re-evaluate. I heard that there was a survey that said between 3-4 years volunteers start to hit that burn-out phase in what ever they are doing.

It's hard to remove a kid because as leaders, our goal is to create an environment where the kid can learn and grow. However when the kids is so disruptive to the rest of the group that it takes all the leaders to manage him, it might be time for him to move on. I don't know if its a "giving up" on the kid or really not knowing how to handle the mental/behavioral issues. As leaders, we aren't psych majors, we are volunteers doing the best we can.

We had a kid that was removed earlier this summer, after being with the troop for about 4 years and having a long history of behavioral issues during those four years, that was showing threatening and violent behavioral that just kept escalating as he got older. He is now a mid-teen. It got to the point where his behavioral was threatening to the leaders and intimidating to the other younger scouts so he was removed from the troop. Now there is a fear that there is going to do some kind of "revenge/retaliation" coming down the road.

We really tried to work with him but his mental health issues were beyond what we could handle. I am upset for him but you have to think about the safety of the rest of the troop.

Basement Dweller -

Did these boys have prior issues or was is just "Out of the blue" and a shock that these were the boys involved?

I guess what I am getting at is, if you have boys with discipline issues, what's the final straw for you to say "ok, enough is enough" as a volunteer?

SO what would prompt you to remove a boy from the Troop? What actions would the boy have taken where you felt you had to remove him?

With working with as many boys as we do, you are bound to come up with some that are going to have behavioral issues. Does your troop have a process for dealing with behavioral issues? You know, like warnings or probation? Have you ever had to ask a scout to leave the troop due to behavioral issues?

It is in the grace in which we choose to handle our mistakes that attests to our character. We all make mistakes. Not all of us step up to the plate to correct or own up to them - heck some even go on to have a successful political career (but I wouldn't want to drive anywhere with him!).

They could have hidden her away somewhere or they could be honest with it, come out and say "Here we are, it is what it is". I am glad they were open and honest. Who knows what lessons will come out of this. Do we teach our youth to shun people that make mistakes, or do we go forward and see what they have learned from this.

As with any youth that make a mistake, how we handle it is very important. Love the person, hate the sin. Don't get that confused, there are too many youth counting on us.

This article was sent to me today. A pretty good read...

~~~~~~~~

A different way to view the BSA

We still deliver the character traits found in the

Scout Oath and Law.

With those values in mind, today we are very

much a part of workforce development!

Employers tell me that they always need kids

with a good education. But, what they would

really like is people who come to work on time,

dont lie, and dont steal from the company and

who will give a full days work for a full days

pay. Those are character issues, not educational

issues.

People are seldom fired over reading, writing,

and arithmetic educational issues. People get fired over

character issues trustworthy, loyal, helpful, friendly, courteous,

kind, obedient, cheerful, thrifty, brave, clean, and reverent.

Your education is what gets you the interview. Your education is

what is required to get the job you want. However, it is your

character by which you keep that job.

Lets get personal

Families dont break up over educational issues.

Relationships break up over character issues

trustworthy, loyal, helpful, friendly, courteous, kind,

etc.

So is character important?

Tell me how football, baseball, and soccer will help a

person keep his job. Tell me how sports reinforce traits

that contribute to a successful marriage, business, or

employment relationship.

Scouting reinforces traits that are fundamental to being

a successful parent, employee, employer, citizen, or partner in any

relationship.

Article submitted by John Thurston, retired Scout Executive from

Corpus Christi, Texas

SPL Owl checking in!!!!!

3 more weeks until course starts!!

"Working late, feeling fine, making sure the troops on time!"

Congratulations WarrenW! Don't forget to work your tickets or you will probably have some craaazy Woodbadge Staffer after you!!

GMitch, your diversity ticket can be something that's real personal to you or something that you see lacking in your unit. When I went through course I had as my diversity ticket a report on women leaders in scouting that I have to give as a presentation. It was basically a history lesson on how women have contributed to scouting and some of the difficulties that they had to face.

When I was a Troop Guide, one of the guys in my patrol wanted to see more community unification. So being a cub master, his unit is sponsoring a Pinewood derby for the kids in his neighborhood that aren't of the same religion he is.

Another gentleman I worked with is setting up an orienteering course for people with disabilities and are wheelchair bound.

Think of what's needed, think of what you would like to see happen, envision it and make sure it's SMART

I am looking forward to being on staff again this year and having lots of fun! You just can't get Gilwell out of your head!

Isn't the Venturing Activity Interest Survey used to see what the Venturers are interested in doing after they have joined the Crew?

The Venturing Crew focal interest usually depends on what the members are interested in? If you go into an established crew, they will let you know what their focus is but most crews are great at changing focus - or reassessing - what the youth's interest are every once in a while.

Whenever we get a nice influx of youth, we go through a survey just so that we can see what has changed with the youths interest.

My only problem is loss of legs.....

My son went to a camporee last year where he zipped the legs off and thought he stuffed them in his pack while he was on the trail. When he came home, they were gone and loss.

I would love to find a pair of switchbacks that had a compartment to stuff the zipped off pant legs in! Or at least a bungee to hang them on to!

I'll echo this sentiment, WISE words from RememberSchiff:

"Thanks for your service to scouting but remember your family comes first, meaning preserve and cherish your separate family life. At your stage, I fell into the trap of only seeing and working with my sons at a scout activity where I was already busy with other scouts. Learn from my mistake. An Old WBer told me that and I didn't learn. "

Hi Mike,

I think thats where the "new" (Wood badge for the 21st Century) Wood badge departs from the "Old" Wood badge. I would really recommend that anyone planning on sticking around in a leadership position in scouting take this course sooner then later!

IMHO the training is invaluable not only for scouting but for everyday life. Yes, there are some people that think WB is more of a leadership course then a scout skills course. Well, honestly it is! You will be using your scout skills during the course but you will also learn new skills on how to work with and lead your unit. The best thing is when you get back to your unit, you will be modeling what you have learned. Isn't that a lot of what we do as leaders? The youth watch what we do, how we handle situations, and learn from us?

The other great thing that I took away from Wood badge is the people that I have met and connected with. There is something to be said about bonding with a group of people that all have the same goal in mind. Its a new network to pull resources from too.

Anyway, I hope this helps you out a little bit in deciding if you are going to attend Wood Badge or not!

Venturing On...

~CrewMomma

Yeah, I hate when I see a Troop that isn't boy led or boy run. We are suppose to be training these youth to be adult leaders, not to do the work for them.

I am involved in two different troops and I am an associate adviser for a Crew. One Troop is totally boy run with the Scout Master keeping an eye on things, stepping in when the SPL asks him too, and giving him "guiding" advise. The other troop, the SM is in control. Period. He speaks for the boys, he makes the decisions for the boys. This SM came into the Crew meeting the other week with the SPL to discuss some cross training, to my dismay, the SPL didn't say a word. I had to ask him if the boy with him was the SPL for the troop, I then directed him to our Crew President.

Yep, one SM was WB trained and a former staffer, the other was a new SM with no WB experience. I got a chance to talk to the new SM a little bit about WB training and I am hoping that he gets a chance to attend.

You probably guessed it but I am WB trained and currently on staff. I believe that WB for the 21st Century has a lot to offer ALL leaders: BS, CS, VC, DE's. Yes, we are modeled after a troop, yes people are put into patrols and people learn if they choose to learn - or not if they can't get passed their closed minds.

Saying that the course has been "dumbed down" is an ignorant statement, plain and simple. Ignorant, intolerant, and bad spirit. Yes, it's different from "old wood badge" but you know what, things change. Life Happens.

Joni - I am sorry that you are not seeing the results from your WB Leaders that they should be giving to their Unit. I think that is unfortunate. I guess I am fortunate enough to be in a council where I have seen LOTS of good come from WB training on all unit levels.

Try not to be discouraged. A lot of us are here doing what we do because we believe we are ultimately helping out the Youth.

~CM

Thanks nldscout, I kinda know the specifics of a Venturing Crew, I am an adviser for one. You forget that they just can't be 14yo, they also have to have completed 8th grade.

Is there a way that, when the parent speaks up you can politely turn and remind her that the kids have things handled? Or give her a brief lesson in the EDGE model, letting her know that as their trained adviser, you are helping the youth learn how to be leaders?

Simply, you can't ban parents from meetings. Just for your own protection as well.

I would have to AGREE with Oak Tree on this one.

OBSERVE - means to watch and it is a parents right to know what is being said/done/taught to their child.

This attitude:

"Like I said Tell the Parents the where the parents sit and if she doesn't like it she can take her venturer and leave. Be sure you say " Have a Nice Day" on the way out. "

Seems so very counter productive to what we are suppose to be doing here for the youth. Yes, I have a parent in my unit thats a Pain in the Rear too, but I would find another way to tell inform the parent then in a sense, kicking the kid out.

Heck, get that parent involved and send them to Woodbadge to learn what a youth run unit is suppose to look like. It will get them out of your hair for a bit AND they can come back and be more productive for YOU.

~CM

Isn't that why there is the interest assessment form that the kids fill out? So that you don't end up with blank stares? What are your kids interested in? What is the adviser doing to spark that interest? Each leadership position in a crew has an adviser that works with them. When projects come up, my first comment to the crew is "Who is taking the lead on this one?" Someone steps up, or is assigned, and you work with that youth.

Not sure if I understand your post Jblake47.

Dual registration is common among Venturing Crews and Troops, we haven't seen a problem with it. Our Crew has been around for about 6-7 years now. As for cutting off the best leaders of the Troop, isn't everyone that is in the troop a potential good leader? Developing leaders should be a constant within the troop from the time that they join. My husbands troop just went to a Winter Survival Camp where the SPL was a 13yo life scout, leading kids that were all 13yo and under. They won 4th place out of 10. There are leaders at all stages and ages.

My crew is Co-Ed. We do have girls that join,they work on their Venturing advancements. From what I understand, you can be in a Venturing Crew and not be associated with a troop too. I have to look up that policy and double check it though.

Which part of the scout law is it counter-productive to? I highly doubt that it is also counter-productive to the scout movement to have boys that want to work on their Eagle award as well as their Venturing advancements at the same time.

It sounds like to me that you are running your Venture Crew like a Venture Patrol. I have a few boys that are registered with both the crew and a troop but see the Crew as their primary unit: They don't attend troop meetings but are still working on merit badges and working towards their Eagle.

I guess I am having a little bit of an issue of "The Troop comes first over the Crew". To me, they are two different units.

Hi Jean,

I am from Idaho as well. My Crews website is hosted by Decision Design. They offer free software for scouts that makes super easy to get a website up:

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Good luck!!!

Hi EagleDad!

Thanks for being so understanding. I agree with you about the "ManScout" and the "WomanScout" thing though, we are here for the kids. A lot of people forget about that. When we participate in Woodbadge, it's so we can go back and help the kids. Yes it's fun and we have a great time, but all of that is useless unless we can communicate what we learned to our units.

EagleDad, Whew! Thank you for taking that burden off my shoulders! I'm getting a lil tired of trying to constantly get the point across that woman have something to offer the units other then organizing the Christmas party. (Eek, sorry, I am actually helping to organize it this year for my husbands (SM) troop!)

eolesen

" We had a camping toilet for our pack once... consisted of a Home Depot bucket with a toilet seat. Beat the heck out of hovering over a cathole!"

We are building a cabin on our property where there isn't much water. We are using the same thing for a toilet system, with sawdust to cover up the "essentials". Compost toilets!

Hi EagleDad, I have to agree that a lot of the woman who are in Woodbadge have not lit a fire or sharpened a knife. When I am working with my Crew, I try to get the guys with the scout skills paired up with the gals so that they can teach them those skills that they should know. So we have kids learning how to teach and kids learning how to learn. I find that the guys are more up on the scout skills, but the gals are much better at being organized. I hope that statement isn't completely turned around so that the girls are labeled "over agressive women".

I completely understand your statement here:

ED:

"Oh I guess, but in the last six years as a troop leader, I dont think I lit a fire or taught a single scout how to tie knots. If it could be done by a scout, a scout did it. I would venture to say that most of our scouts learned their skills from older scouts. "

A lot of the Cub scout leaders who are in Woodbadge are female, they don't have the opportunity to get out on camp outs with the lil guys to learn/show off their skills. So yes, there are a lot of females in the Woodbadge program who don't have those outdoor skills. When I come across a female cub scout leader, I invite them along to camp outs with me. Ok ok, I am trying to recruit more female Advisers.. you got me there!

Some of these female leaders weren't just "invited in" to leadership positions, a lot of them were the ones that stepped up when no one else would.

I was on course in 06, was on staff last year in 07 as a TG and I am on staff this year coming year in 08 as the SPL. What I would do to change Woodbadge? How tickets are approached. It is a source of complete frustration for the participants. I know that they are suppose to come up with their own ticket items without us suggesting things, I understand that concept but sometimes it just doesn't work. I think OGE said it best about having a segment just on tickets, including past examples. I think that would work well without spoon feeding people.

Actually, to be totally honest, I completely agree with OGE's post!

Another thing I would like to change it how the Aims and Methods of scouting is approached. I don't think that was clear enough. Again, that just may be something that the CD has to work on. BTW, the CD was female in 07.

CrewMomma

I used to be an Owl!

WE1-106-06

I still laugh at one of the new Fathers in the Troop that is associated with my Crew. The one I am thinking about hiked in with a "camping toilet" for his young son.

Hmmm....

I'm a Mom, I don't hover, I am not a "drill Sargent".

I am a Associate Adviser on a Crew.

Glad I can beat out some of the biased opinions.

( I leave my Diamonds at home with my husband when I am hiking! )

Hi there fellow Idahoian!!!

I set up my website with this company. They are really helpful and it's free! You just have to get an internet host. I used Godaddy. Check them out!

http://decisiondesign.com/decisiondesign/ScoutSite/Introduction.asp