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Abel Magwitch

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Posts posted by Abel Magwitch

  1. Here’s another question - how will councils deal with the "practical problems" if the local option gets the thumbs up?

     

    I believe one problem that councils may run into is that they may have to adjust their summer camp program to accommodate all the diversity.

     

    There should be an all-inclusive week of camp where everybody is welcome regardless of sexual orientation. Another week could be set aside for those against having to camp with troops that may have a gay leader or gay Scout. Another week could be exclusively for Roman Catholic troops only. The same can be done with those in-school units where the DE’s are the unit leaders. And let’s not forget the LDS units. They can continue having their own exclusive week of summer camp so they don't have to deal with those non-LDS scouters.

     

    Yes, the councils will have to accommodate its members various likes and dislikes of each other. If they do it for the LDS, they should do it for every other group.

     

    Boy what a hole the Irving pros have dug themselves.

    Not quite the same in my neck of the woods peridiochas. different experiences I have had.
  2. It sounds like this question is in regards to the local option. Pros have told me that the sponsoring institution owns the unit and the SI can decide on who can be the leaders among other things.

     

    Believe it or not, there are units out there that will only take on members who belong to a particular religious denomination. There are also units who will only take on members from the particular school the unit is chartered to and will only allow teachers from the schools to be leaders. There are even ethnic units which have the requirement that a member (including leaders) must speak their language. And I am sure that there are some LDS units who will only accept LDS members period.

     

    The local option has been around a long time now.

     

  3. Here’s another question - how will councils deal with the "practical problems" if the local option gets the thumbs up?

     

    I believe one problem that councils may run into is that they may have to adjust their summer camp program to accommodate all the diversity.

     

    There should be an all-inclusive week of camp where everybody is welcome regardless of sexual orientation. Another week could be set aside for those against having to camp with troops that may have a gay leader or gay Scout. Another week could be exclusively for Roman Catholic troops only. The same can be done with those in-school units where the DE’s are the unit leaders. And let’s not forget the LDS units. They can continue having their own exclusive week of summer camp so they don't have to deal with those non-LDS scouters.

     

    Yes, the councils will have to accommodate its members various likes and dislikes of each other. If they do it for the LDS, they should do it for every other group.

     

    Boy what a hole the Irving pros have dug themselves.

     

  4. I can see where the BSA smells money. By dropping its anti-gay policy, the BSA would be able to once again start phony units in schools. In-school scouting would really take off again - instant membership; registration being done in September (costs a lot less to register a youth at the end of the year); and the unit doesn't even have to meet as long as the youth get registered. United Way would be again happy and donate dollars based on membership, both traditional and special programs. Money, money, money!

     

    I surmise that the suits down in Irving have already run the numbers and realize that school scouting would trump LDS numbers if LDS decides to pull out because of the decision to allow gays.

     

    My district is now down to 4 traditional troops yet if a stranger looked at the district roster of units, it would appear that the district is doing just fine. Yet I was just informed that our district chairman had quit back in the late summer. So I guess my little district (big if you include the school units) has been operating with only a key 1, a professional and nobody was told.

     

    Yes, this policy (coming out possibly next week according to NBC) means $$ for the BSA. The BSA seems to be willing to do anything as long as there is $$ to pay the professional salaries, imho of course.

     

  5. It has been announced in my council that there will be a reorganization of districts happening in January. I decided to google boy scouts district reorganization and found that the same thing is happenening in councils all over the country.

     

    My council will be going from 8 districts (we used to have 9) to 3. And we have been told that there will be no downsizing of the professional staff. In fact, we have been told that additional professionals will be hired so each new district has multiple DE's. The council went on to say that they would be choosing (handpicking) the new district chairs and committees. No need for district nominations or votes. The hand-picked executive board of course is giving their rubber stamp to corporate BSA as they are hardly involved with the program at all.

     

    Corporate BSA has slowly and effectively giving itself more power and to hell with BSA policies and procedures. I also foresee the mergers of councils coming very soon to my neck of the woods. It's next in a logical procession of national decisions.

     

    In essence, there will be two thirds less of those pesky volunteers getting in the way of corporate BSAs doing their own thing.

     

    Thoughts?

    (This message has been edited by abel magwitch)

  6. Tokala, your councils 990 for the past three years stated that the council served 30,928 youth. Your current totals add up to 4,459 traditional youth. Do you realize that your council has lost more than 26,000 youth during the past year alone? That is an enormous, incredible loss (words allude me) in youth membership.

     

    I hope your council's executive board has downsized its professional staff to match the loss of youth. FOS must be pretty expensive considering the amount of professionals that were needed to serve all that youth.

     

    I am curious on what the youth totals (including LFL) were on your councils 2011 annual report. I see that your council does not make its annual report accessible on line like many other councils.(This message has been edited by abel magwitch)

  7. Tokala, your numbers add up to only 4,459 youth (traditional?)

     

    It appears that your council lost more than 22,000 youth since the 2011 annual report considering the council stated on the report that it achieved its Gold Journey to Excellence award by serving over 27,000 youth. I guess I am a bit floored over the tremendous loss of youth.

  8. Tokala, I can tell you that your council's 2011 annual reports doesn't match up with your council's 990 tax return when comparing membership numbers and expenses and revenue. Tell me what you think is a ballpark figure of Boy Scouts in your council; Cub Scouts in your council. Do you have any idea?

  9. The right to bear arms is in our constitution. I suggest as a start, this country should consider strongly regulate the ammunition and ammunition supplies for reloading etc. Of course nothing is ever foolproof and there is no way to get guns out of the hands of the mentally ill or criminals but this would be a start. Perhaps it is time for the National Guard to take on the duties for regulating ammunition as the NG is our country's organized national militia which is well regulated.

  10. ...Unfortunately, what is in play with BadenP has little to do with most issues in reality...

     

    On the contrary, BadenP speaks reality. He is proclaiming that the emporer has no clothes and there are many who refuse to see. Many of his comments reflect my council as well as others. I find it fascinating that some of the troubles I see in my council are the same in other councils around the country.

     

    I have often stated that for those in Scouting who are lucky to be living in parts of the country where Scouting thrives; where membership is still strong; where the traditional units are still the norm; where the council is well funded and managed by good pros; where the council camp is in repair, fantastic. I envy you. But BadenP speaks from his experience both volunteer and professional.

     

    If you are unfortunate to belong to a council in one of the country's more depressed and poor areas, I can guarantee that the volunteers are struggling to get any service from the council. The council professionals are only concerned with meeting membership goals and they will do what ever it takes to get those membership numbers up. In School scouting is abused. Units are formed yearly in schools and whole classrooms are registered as members in the fall when the registration fee is low. Who cares if the unit ever meets the rest of the year? The kids are registered and the membership criticals are made. And all along the camps are run down; there are few district events; and council ends up on breaking their promises to the youth by not fulfilling their part of the bargain by providing the promised program at summer camp the Scouts paid for.

     

    Skeptic, go ahead and put BadenP on your ignore list. What you are essentially doing is putting your fingers in your ears and saying lalalalala. But it wont change the truth BadenP is writing about. It is in fact reality in his council. There are indeed crappy councils out there. There are bad pros out there. And national is making decisions which do not reflect the spirit of Scouting. The folks that notice it the most are those who have been involved in Scouting for more than 35 years and are still around. I am one of those. If you dont want to believe that collusion is going on in the professional ranks of Scouting, you are only fooling yourself.

     

    And a suggestion for any other volunteers stuck in a poor council. You want to learn some things? Get in touch with some former professionals who left the council after only working for a year or less; those who you may find left the profession in a poor economy because they could not continue working for a corporation where the sole purpose was to manipulate the volunteers in order to make personal gains and doing so while neglecting the youth they were hired to serve.

     

    I say kudos to BadenP and others who are speaking the truth. Though it may seem that nobody is listening, realize that you are being heard.

     

  11. Since the DE's salaries along with the rest of the bunch - DD's FD's are lumped together on the IRS 990 as "program", just what is "program" and how is it truly defined? Is the program what the volunteers do? They organize the camporees, the Klondike derbies; the volunteers put on training as well as volunteering their churches etc. for free to have the training...

     

    If a DE is going to be considered "program" for tax purposes for this non-profit organization (where it is my understanding that there are supposed to be a limited number of people on the payroll to be considered non-profit), then for me I expect a good DE is one who fulfills his/her role in being "program". But unfortunately, program is what the DEs in my council do very little of if at all. In fact, we have an abundance of DEs and have been told that there will be even more.

     

     

    Theoretically, my council should soon be booming with an abundance of outstanding program.

     

     

    Cant wait for the service.

     

     

    Thoughts?

     

  12. DeanRX, I am curious about the membership issues you mentioned. According to the most recent annual report posted on your council website, the council is bragging about increases in membership as well as record attendance at camp.

     

    By the way, your council spent $1,829,637 of its program expenses on professional salaries and your SE is making $257,497 a year. For all your council spends on professional salaries, are the units being served? Are the youth being served? Will the youth be allowed to camp on the front lawn of the new service center? Your situation is very similar if not the same in many other councils, including mine.

     

     

  13. BSA and local councils had no obligation to report such cases, and usually mostly has gossip to go on as evidence

     

    Frankly, I'm not interested in reading the accounts of the details, so I'm going on comments made in the press and on this board

     

    ...It's not at all clear to me that BSA has any LEGAL obligation to report SUSPECTED cases of child abuse

     

    I fail to see why BSA employees have such an obligation, especially when they probably have little or no direct knowledge or evidence in their possession

     

    Ah, but when you read some of the reports, is becomes clear that the BSA did in fact have knowledge and evidence in their possession. But one has to read the reports to see it and believe it. The BSA was indeed culpable in many cases.

     

    How about a person who admits to you that he molested a child? Some of the files from my council specifically have the signed statements from the perpetrator themselves - a confession if you will that they admit to doing the crime. By not reporting this to the authorities at the time, it makes one an accessory to the crime does it not? And even just from the ethical and moral standpoint - if an acquaintance tells you personally that he did something like molesting a child; raping an adult; committing homicide; etc. just to get it off his chest, dont you feel that you have an obligation to report this to the authorities? If you choose not to and the guy continues with his deviant behavior on others, were you right to remain quiet? I dont think so. And what if a Scout wants to confide in his leader that he did something pretty bad. Should that adult leader ignore it? No.

     

    Its a shame that the BSA finds itself in this position. But those at the corporate level have made these decisions and now the situation has come into the spotlight. The BSA has already admitted it made a mistake. What more is needed that the BSA was wrong in this situation it now finds itself in?

     

  14. As I posted before What district committee meetings? Don't have them. What roundtables? Don't have them. Things are far different in my neck of the woods. Though your suggestions are notable, many just dont apply in my council. And I am willing to surmise the same thing can be said of many other councils.

     

    What we do have in my district is allegedly 46 units serving purportedly 750+ youth. One would be led to believe that there should be plenty of adult volunteers to serve on the district level. But alas, my district doesnt have district committee meetings as there is really no district committee to speak of.

     

    In order to have district volunteers, you have to have units in the district to serve and I am not talking about the alleged units that are supposed to exist in schools or in county housing complexes which make up the bulk of my districts units. You need active traditional units.

     

    Again SP, perhaps in Seattle, things are done correctly in your neck of the woods. Perhaps the Seattle council wouldnt stand by as 30+ traditional units were allowed to die because instead of supporting the traditional units, the councils efforts were spent putting together paper units to inflate the membership to make it appear that the council has viable districts. Sustaining traditional units means work and in my council, the pros are more interested in easy membership management than actually serving the units.

     

    The Seattle council is just one council in this great big USA of ours and in case you havent realized, things are considerably different outside the scope of your own council. Some cities are quite poor and have broken school systems and Scouting suffers because of it. I am glad that in Seattle Washington, your city is thriving as the same with traditional Scouting.

     

    Now I do know where a lot of volunteers can be found. Its getting them active on the district and council level that is the challenge. In my council (and I am sure this is the case in other councils), we have a plethora of woodbadgers. They like to meet annually and have a big dinner. All these volunteers come out of the woodwork to break bread together and pat themselves on the back. Many are no longer associated with individual units. These folks just seem to keep their membership current so they can still wear the uniform. The dinner brings in some good $ for the council. Perhaps in other councils, this resource is more willing to be active.

     

  15. those are some pricey merit badges. A scout going to this rec center for his merit badges will cost anywhere from $150 to $200 for the needed 21 merit badges. Nice. But then again, American Fork UT is a nice little town where the average household income in 2007 was $79,200.

     

    I know in my area, MB counselors don't charge Scouts.

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