TMSM

37 minutes ago, Canoeon said:

Great video and route. Though it's more correct to say in your video you went to the Boundary Waters, as you did not go to Northern Tier.

Sure - But we did go to Northern Tier (Charles Sommer) and toured the facility, we copied their menus, followed the advisor guide and used a route that was part of their documentation. We used similiar equipment, let the scouts lead, cook and make all decisions. We told the stories of the fur trappers, indians and voyaguers around the campfire. We didnt go through Northern Tier to outfit us and provide an interpreter but I think the scouts had a very similiar experience.

14 hours ago, 69RoadRunner said:

That video production is far better.  

But you guys cheated and did a shuttle boat.   

We did almost the same route but we went to Eddy Falls and decided to portage our way to Kekekebic from Eddy lake- taking the tow from Moose lake was a great way to get away from the motors as soon as possible.

Nice video you got some great shots. It would great if you added the lake name each time you were somewhere new. This would be of a great help to someone who liked where  you went and wanted to see which lake you paddled through. 

I always do a long version and a short version of my videos - here is my short version from our BWAC trip this year - 

6 hours ago, yknot said:

BSA is so caught up in its old view of what it is that it missed an historic opportunity this spring and summer  to recruit youth especially at the cub level.

Old view? like using the Patrol Method? Giving responsibilities to boys to lead boys? Duty rosters, tent mates, hiking together as a patrol and getting lost, making dinner, playing cards - all that is lost when you add family to the mix. Not sure Cub scouts works as a family event either. 

Here is the sash - http://www.northerntiertradingpost.org/sashes.html. Can you provide some context of how this fits into NT?

We did a DIY 2020 trek in the Boundary Waters this year. Being from Chicago area many of us had been before so easy to guide the scouts on building a plan, menu and route.

• Less bugs than usual this year. 90% less on Knife lake and very enjoyable.
• Cost ws $300 per scout including gas, food and Kevlar canoe
• I am not sure what we missed by not having an interpreter with us
• 4 of us hammocked but might have been able to do 1 more - no way we could have done more than 5
• scouts baked a cake, corn bread and brownies using white gas stove - they didnt share but heard it was good
• Northern Tier store was only open to crews - no outsiders
• met quite a few troops on portages - all great people
• some crews were faster than others at portages - thanks to those that let us jump ahead

4 minutes ago, Eagle94-A1 said:

 

ONLY if they are going to a council summer camp.  Any adult with SSD can administer the test for unit activities. But  for summer camp, they need to be credentialed. here is the link to the Aqautics Manual https://www.ncacbsa.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/04/bsa_swim_classification_test.pdf

Sea Base also requires Auquatics or lifegaurd training for the BSA test taken before you leave. 

I require all adults to take the SSD and Safety Afloat training if they plan to go on an aquatic outing. No one has pushed back yet and it makes it easier for me to explain the rules.

16 minutes ago, mashmaster said:

Scoutmaster can't sign off I believe it is someone that has the proper aquatics certification.

I know thats true for most summer camps but I believe the unit leader can administer the test using SSD guidelines for other outings.

Why not test them when you arrive? The SM can sign off on this. 

Its important to note that if they fail they go home. 

The other option is to find a scout friendly pool - hotel, private or lake where you could pre-test

Our scouts got shut out by Philmont (2018 also) so they decided to go to Northern Tier but asked to do this through an outfitter to save some money and to be more flexible with the date. I have been to the BW 6 times so I have no issues with idea but I cant seem to find examples of the treks Northern Tier will take you on. By providing examples it will be easier for the crew to make thier own plan. I can help them but am trying to stay back a bit, make them do research and voice their opinion.

So my question is from Moose lake where did you go and what was the route.

Our camp (Freeland Leslie) is open and we have 25 scouts signed up. They will be kept in groups (cohorts) of 40 and be moved to a new section depending on the day. Limited MBs, no leaving camp site, adults must follow and stay with scouts during the day.

11 hours ago, 5thGenTexan said:

No matter. the fact still remains he lacks follow through and almost never shows results. 

Do you have monthly committee meetings? Insist that you do. Help identify tasks needed to be completed (who, when) ask someone to be the scribe, review tasks at the end of the meeting, start the next meeting with task review. When CC is called out on missing items ask if makes sense for someone else to do it - assign and get a date etc.. 

I have a CC that can't/wont recruit new committee members or MBCs, uses the budget to buy things he thinks the troop needs and always seems to forget the things I say I need help with. The only way I have found to deal with this is to drive the committee meetings for him.

I do have a few boys that hate camping and most are pressured by the parents to stick with it. They are delighted with scouts the last 3 months and liking all the changed to MB and the ability to do tours virtually. I would prefer that they drop out of scouts so that I can have full patrols at campouts and less disruptions because they don't want to be on the campout. 

I am all for spinning off STEM scouts, you can still achieve citizenship, character building and leadership if you modified the program. You could build a STEM skills program with different ranks and reinforce STEM princlples in weekly meetings. But keep it out of Boy Scouts and stop wtering down the program. Polling parents that have no clue how/why scouts works is the wrong way to data to improve the program unless you are just looking for $$$$

Crew members that have different expectations because they come from different troops is exactly the reason we said no to 2 scouts wanting to join our trek. We are still locked down so no chance we can workout together but maybe your region is different. 

We have been doing gear/pack checks via Zoom and hoping that everyone is working hard at being ready so its great you can at least meet in person. Have you worked on bear bag hanging? Philmont cooking method? 

56 miles over 12 days is 5 on average so you should not have too many issues.

3 hours ago, 69RoadRunner said:

 

d.  Chow Hall will be run at 50% capacity and they are looking at having pre-packaged food for all meals.  So no one has to serve, or anything like that.    Yum, Yum!!

 

Maybe they should try patrol method cooking. They might actually learn how great this for summer camp.

1 hour ago, Eagle94-A1 said:

I am not a fan of family camping at all a the Scouts BSA level. I have seen too many problems result from adults interfering.  Last time a family camp out was announced in advance by a troop I was in, I skipped it. 

More importantly my boys are against it. They have seen the problems first hand because their old troop became "family friendly." The last 18 months they were in the troop, every single camp out turned into a family camp out, most without advance notice. 

 

Patrol Camping, or troops separated by BP's 300 feet rule, is the way to go.

Family camping is not a option for our troop and agree too many adults make it harder to have the scouts lead. We do what now seems to old school - Patrol Mathod, 100yrds away, 1 SM and 2 ASMs and maybe 1 other adult with 25+ scouts. SPL checks in on the Patrols and provides updates to us. We keep an eye and ear open for any signes of danger.

I can't recall anything our council has done for us. We would be just fine without them or national. If we could order our badges online we would never set foot into a scout shop. They only time we talk to our DE is to get them to fix whatever they screwed up in scoutbook.

We have altered our start date for summer camp for later in July. Most of our parents are techies and have been working from home, kids have been out of school for a month. If youth campgrounds reopen in June we hope to do patrol campouts to keep the group small. None of scouts or parents have been exposed or know somene who was but those at risk or have parents, siblings or granparents at risk will be asked to not go.

We are doing a shakeout trip in June in the national forest to get ready for Philmont. Small crews of < 10, no stopping for food or gas along the way. This will be mid week to avoid people and we will primitive camp in the forest.

Advancement is like a suntan Something you get naturally whilst having fun in the outdoors. Let the scouts drive thier own advancement, help the SM and SPL provide scout skills training in a fun  virtual way. 

Our Zoom meetings have been successful 5 total so far with 80% in attendance. I stole about 50 ideas from other troops, created a list and let the PLC pick the ones the wants, modify any ideas, create thier own etc. I see no reason why you couldn't create a similiar list and share with SM/SPL.

Example: Physical fitness contest - each zoom meeting all scouts do as many pushups as possible. After 4 weeks those that increae the most wins a prize.

Example: Show how to build a cardboard sit and reach box , everyone comes to the meeting with the materials needed and build the box live

Example: if you live in the same town, provide a 1 mile course and have each scout run it and then 4 week later run again.

If you make this fun Tenderfoot can just happen, if you make this like a job it will be ignored.

Good luck and keep helping your scouts.

We usually have 3 adults in our Zoom troop meetings but when we do a Patrol breakout, we let the PL handle that part of the meeting and just pop in and out to make sure they are not having any technical  issues. This is very much the same as our regular Troop meetings in that when they break into patrols there are no adults sitting in that with a specific patrol.  My two ASMs usually don't say a word and I only speak duirng SM minute. One of my ASMs is also the Eagle Coordinator so he may stay the older scout patrol when they breakout.

6 hours ago, qwazse said:

Right now I am thinking it would be better to close down the troop until September

Just a little frustrated. I spent 5 years getting the commitee to understand the value of the patrol method and to strictly follow the advancement rules. I ruffled a few feathers so I see this coming back at me sometime soon. I am in it for the Scouts but dread the drama that I might be in for.

1 hour ago, HashTagScouts said:

The only rebuttal I would give is the virtual "tours" for MBs. 

I am ok with other MBCs doing what they think is in the spirit of the requirement. If I am the MBC I won't consider it and scouts can look else where if they wish.

13 hours ago, MattR said:

 

@TMSM, I'd suggest figure out some fun activities, push for that, and ask the scouts what they want to do. They will likely give you good ideas. Good luck.

We did a 10 tree ID challenge that new scouts thought was fun(each scout went out by himself and took pics), Scout Jeopardy in patroll meetings was fun, broke out older scouts (Star +) and the met with the Eagle coordinator and was productive. We broke into ranks and worked on specific FA requirements. We were going to do a litter cleanup project but too many parents lost thier minds over this so we cancelled. 

I am thinking we could maybe deliver a troop tent to the crossovers and have their Patrol leader help them virtually to set it up. This would be a race to see which patrol could set up first. A few scouts are creating a Mine Craft flag ceremony and one of the scouts is creating a google survey to see what MBs are interesting to troop members.

I had the SPL invite the TLCs (all with PORs) and they really struggled to come up with anything, We are a hands on, outside, patrol method troop so they have no experience with making virtual fun. In fact Zoom meetings are making it seem like school. We don't all live in the same town so scavenger would not work.

I did invite a former Eagle Scout to do an SM minute and he talked about why the crossovers should stick it out and wait for their first campout and how how his first year changed his perspective.

I will not allow virtual tour to replace tours in any of my MBs

I will not sign off on Virtual Troop Campouts 

I will not allow sign-offs by anyone but me for scouts cooking in a family patrol

I will not sign off on the Triple Crown award for scouts virtually touring 3 HA sites

Right now I am thinking it would be better to close down the troop until September

15 minutes ago, fred8033 said:

The most significant difference is that patrol or troop members are not all in the same location.

Sorry - This is ridulous of National to say this. Its Patrol based camping and that means you are in the same place. What are they thinking? 

Its like taking a virtual tour of Philmont and saying you went to Philmont. https://media.boyslife.org/philmont/philmont.html

1 hour ago, Cburkhardt said:

To the SM thinking of leaving, please don't disband your Troop out of frustration over this.  If you can do things more rigorously in your circumstance, please do it. 

 

I have taken the advice to just keep these changes to myself. We are working on knots, First aid and gear in a virtual world, we even did 10 plant identification challenge (outdoors with cameras) Its the disregarding of the Patrol method I just can't stand. Mom and Dad are not patrol members, camping in the backyard is not a scout campout and planning a hike vs doing the hike is the biggest joke in the world.

I'll wait until a parent or the commitee demands we follow these new rules and then I'll offer up my resignation.

6 minutes ago, Sniktaw said:

This is a joke, right?

 

It's got to be. Is it possible those above don't know how scouting works?