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Jameson76

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Posts posted by Jameson76

  1. Let me guess, if we paid more FOS, then all of the system issues would be resolved.  

    Local council staff wandered by a recent meeting, showing the colors I guess.  They did get around to asking about when they could do the FOS song and dance.  I asked about the council salary structure (available from IRS 999 form), I asked what real value the council actually brings at the unit level, and beyond building the bank of money the council has, what would the FOS fund?  We don't have a DE and not sure what they would do and what value they would bring if we had one.

    Crickets

    • Like 2
  2. 1 hour ago, PACAN said:

    Just wondering...2 scouts that need to hurry on this?    Cit in Society becomes Eagle required 1 July.  Any scout who has completed all the Eagle Scout requirements by then does not need to earn CIS for Eagle rank.   Tenure, MBs POR, Eagle project, SMC.  

    My understanding is Beginning July 1, 2022, the Citizenship in Society merit badge will be required for any youth seeking to achieve the Eagle Scout rank.  If a Scout has not had their EBOR by then, it will be REQUIRED for Scouts having their EBOR after 7/1/2022.

  3. 45 minutes ago, Eagle94-A1 said:

    Does anyone remember when they  went from 3 camp outs to be First Class to 6 camp outs to be First Class, and folks were so ticked off that about the increase that 19 months later they change it back to 3 camp outs? January 1, 2016 was when 6 camp outs were required for First Class. August 1, 2017 was when they changed it back?

    I always am intrigued by the discussions on Scouts having trouble getting 20 nights camping, and why oh why can they only count 1 summer camp.  That seems to be such an easy thing, summer camp (6 nights), that leaves about 5 nights camping annually over 3 years.  And you can include ANY camping you do. 

    The goal is not to check boxes, goal is to have fun.  If Scouts don't want to go on outings, figure out why, not game the system

    • Upvote 1
  4. 6 hours ago, Eagle1993 said:

    My question ... does BSA see the future as online MBs, day events and heavy classroom based Eagle requirements OR outdoor, open play to gain skills (and thus advance).

    From a risk perspective they love the online, day events, heavy classroom.  No outings no YPT issues of chance of an injury.  Also this meets the STEM (STEAM / whatever) that some feel they youth want.

    Agree that we are now dealing with kids who do not play and roam outdoors.  We did not do a biking outing as so few of the younger Scouts rode (or knew how) to ride a bike.  It is very hard, especially for those of us that grew up in the old old days of scouting.

    Back then

    • Second Class - Take 3 hikes on a different day, not less than 5 miles each
    • Second Class - Follow another scout that knows you are stalking him fore 1/2 mile without being seen
    • Second Class - build a fire with no more than 2 matches, cook a meal without utensils
    • First Class - point out 5 constellations
    • First Class - send and receive 20 words using morse code
    • First Class - on one of your overnight campouts carry your gear on your back for at least 1 1/2 miles

     

    • Upvote 4
  5. 5 hours ago, yknot said:

      I think the Eagle Scout rank has been both a blessing and a curse for scouts. 

    Very true.  The Eagle Scout rank should be the OUTCOME of a quality Scouting program at the unit level, not the GOAL of the program.  Many of our Scouts are 16 /17 and realize, wow, going to camp and outing lo these many years, and doing some of the troop offered MB classes (scheduled before the regular meeting), I've pretty much completed this Eagle thing.  Just need a few merit badges and the project. 

    Now, if you could get a 17 year old to not procrastinate on the final items to wrap it up.....

    • Like 1
  6. This is pretty much how we run our program.  No advancement focused outings (though we do things on outings that shockingly can be used), and time for unstructured activities.

    At summer camp we have them do the MB classed in the morning, after lunch, go have fun.  Every summer we have to talk some parents down off the ledge that summer camp fun is measured by completed merit badges.  That's not how this works (or shoudn't)

    Typically some activity in the morning, like hike a gorge, kayak, wide game, etc.  Afternoon are options to continue, nap., go beat on stuff with sticks.

    Non structured play is almost a lost art these days

    16 minutes ago, Eagle94-A1 said:

    Reason why I say that is we had a lock in with no plans except dinner,

    For our lock-in, kids bring TV's, games, etc and they have at it all night.  We only have (as scheduled items) dinner, second dinner, dodgeball, dodgeball again and that's about it.  The rest is open fun.  They play video game until we kick them out at 8:00 am

  7. Moving to remote work has helped with vacation / time off

    Setup a hotspot and work away in the morning while the Scouts are out and about.  We also advised that if they need something, to please come over and quietly asked as some of us may be working.  Most of our Scouts understand the remote work process.

    When we had our own camp in 2020 the price was about 30% of the council camp costs.  Of course no staff (volunteer leaders) and some parents did not seek reimbursement when they provided group meals.  That being said, it was a lot of work.

    Camps can be pricey, but if your Scout is there, think of the food costs savings at home.

  8. 45 minutes ago, ThenNow said:

    I am not at all surprised, based on my limited knowledge. Anyone have salary figures for the big Local Councils? I randomly know a couple top execs are near $500,000. I guess they would be considered to be running significantly large companies. 

    I would disagree.  My council is large.  But the budget (IRS 990 for 2019 is the source) shows revenue of $14.2 MM and expenses of $13.5 MM with assets of $77.7 MM

    Compensation for the SE / CEO is $459K (W2) and $159K - other

    The Income and Expense is definitely not a large corporation.  

  9. About 3 weeks ago our troop was heading out camping when a possible snow / ice event was coming to our area.  The unit was headed south several hours (long weekend) and no issues expected, the weather should have passed by the time we headed back.

    Most of the leaders took some time for preparations for families left at home.  Stoves, generators, lights, etc. were checked out and prepared.  Ended up being a non-event but all of us understand the need to be prepared.

    Also we had a great weekend

  10. 9 hours ago, SiouxRanger said:

    Are Council financial statements prepared in compliance with GAAP?

    Anybody seen council financial statements prepared in compliance with GAAP?

    I have not. 

    Look for your councils IRS Form 990.  That should have the wealth of information.

  11. On 1/15/2022 at 2:59 PM, SSScout said:

    He chose a 5 D cell Maglight.   It went on ONE campout.  Then, he realized why dad only took little AA pocket lights....

     

    Had a newer scout that was lugging the 5D Maglight around.  I asked him why he didn't get a headlamp or pocket flashlight.  His answer was one could not hit a bear over the head with pocket flashlight.  

    I could not argue with such sound logic

    • Like 1
    • Haha 2
  12. On 1/12/2022 at 10:41 AM, InquisitiveScouter said:

    And please, for the love of all that is Scouting, make him pack his own gear! 

    Oh My God, that is so true

    Had a Scout come to the leader area on an outing, his challenge was no sleeping bag.  We went to his tent, sleeping bag was in fact in the bottom of his pack.  His comment "I guess dad put it in"

    Chatted with parents on Sunday on the importance of the Scouts packing their own gear, being responsible for their gear.  Assisting and guiding is great, but THEY need to OWN it!!

    • Like 1
  13. 1 hour ago, fred8033 said:

    I always though the membership number problems of the 1980s/1990s was marketing to FOS and United Way to get more donations.  I never connected that to CE pay.  

    Metrics are important.  There must be the right metrics to review CE pay.  For example, common accounting requires reporting numbers a certain way.  Perhaps, membership dues revenue could be used as a factor toward CE pay.  

    On the flip side ... business in turbulent times often have trouble with pay / salaries not being scaled right.

     

     

    The big one was Boypower Manpower that started late 60's early 70's.  Plan / stated goal was to have 1/3 of age eligible boys to be registered.  Much pressure on the professionals to "make the numbers".  I think Chicago Council was ground zero for all that but it was widespread.  Joke was that many units were meeting at the cemeteries as that was where the names for the registration came from.  The eventual correction of that debacle and ISP, the Improved Scouting Program, rollout in 73 pretty much decimated the membership rolls looking at 1980 compared to 1970.  Roughly a 32% drop

    You are correct that the inflated numbers in the late 80's and 90, and even up to 00's was in order to position the program as larger than it was and garner more UW and more FOS local contributions.

    • Upvote 2
  14. 9 minutes ago, MattR said:

    When push comes to shove, CE's probably need donors more than camps.

     

    Agree.  When the UMC (and still is a charter issue lookin) challenge and with lack of direction from the council staff on recharter we assumed that the council ran / modeled the numbers and figured they could still be "Scouts" and maybe not worry about the pesky units out in the woods

    No need to worry the donors about such trivialities

  15. 29 minutes ago, fred8033 said:

    My question would be ...   Perhaps council charters should also have a line saying executive salaries will be re-adjusted if membership numbers drop.  ... example ... a scout exec should not earn half of council funds.   

    Well, they did in fact try that, and it led to multiple membership scandals and the push for "inner city" scouting where they sign up youth in large groups and many do not even realize they are in the BSA

    Did not end well for the councils and some of the professionals.

    • Upvote 2
  16. Pretty sure my council is a 100 level, assuming that is the larger ones.  SE base compensation is maybe $362K and total compensation is $622K.  That's a bunch.  4 others over $100K

    Also the council now has 68 staff, but only 16 appear to be directly working with districts or Scouts (DE types).  

    • 16 DE types
    • 12 Program specialists / Scoutreach
    • 9 Development staff
    • 4 Middle Management
    • 4 Camp rangers
    • 13 Admin
    • 3 Executive
    • 7 Marketing

    Really nice office that seems to be about 25% of the budget.  They continue to run the operation like a business in the 80's.  Top down management, very structured.  There was an issue at summer camp, the exec team was on a call, then they had another call, then they asked the camp director what he wanted to do, then they deferred and sort of left it open.  Nobody wants to make a decision, classic corporate problem solving.  That is they don't actually solve it and put their name on a solution.

    No real leadership.  The council advice and direction during covid was nothing.  Massive marketing staff and not sure what they may actually be doing.

    They continue to be successful at raising money, but their support for troops is non-existent.  They seem to be able to play on the memory and cache of the BSA and not showing what the current state of affairs may be.  Hardest information to find is how many youth are being served in actual units.  With the recent (and ongoing) rift with the UMC there has been no direction or input from the council.  Cast of many and cares of none

    • Upvote 1
  17. 1 hour ago, SiouxRanger said:

    Yesterday, I learned that our scout executive's salary plus retirement fund contribution, for last year was just shy of 50% of the Council's budget. (The retirement contribution was HALF of salary.)

     

    Could start a whole thread on the way councils spend their money.  It's not pretty.

    All volunteers should look at their council's 990 IRS form.  Gotta scroll through the pages.  One section details total compensation of any staff member over $100K,  Can be interesting.  Also the first page shows the income and expense.  Then the expense is detailed. In our council boatloads of money spent on the office expenses and occupancy (literally 23% of expenses).  

    When you see the compensation levels, then do the math, the whole "fair share" selling point for FOS is really what they need.  In our council less than 25% of the staff are unit facing.  The rest are management and overhead.  Maybe if they tightened things up be more receptive to that.  Personally, my money stays local in the troop.  Not really convinced the council are great stewards of the money.

    • Like 1
    • Upvote 1
  18. 1 hour ago, skeptic said:

    The law does not appear to allow for them picking up already printed individuals from other mandated areas, such as teachers.  I had to be printed as a credentialed teacher, in order to work.  So you would think that file could be appenede, but currently they are looking at a separate method.  Seems not only poor planning, but also it is annoying, as there is of course an expense involved.  Fingerprints do not change normally, so why not just marry the files, especially ones like mine that allowed me to teach for two decades or so.  What do I know, other than governmental processes are often bloated and poorly designed.

    The Fingerprinter's Union lobby is a powerful group.  They are always looking for new revenue streams.  Govco is paying off it's supporters 😁

    • Haha 2
  19. Not sure what vespers are (other than an evening prayer).  Assume they are some sort of benches, worship area?

    Sounds like neither Scout has gotten a project proposal developed or approved. 

    2 possible options. 

    1 - Does the work entail enough that is could be two projects?  If benches or a worship area, maybe one Scout does the front X rows and the other Scout expands the project and does the back X rows?

    2 - First come first serve

    • Upvote 1
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