Jameson76

7 minutes ago, FaithfulScouter said:

We have 10 Scouts in different stages of their Eagle Scout projects in our Troop.  At what point in the process do you allow your Scouts to reserve use of your Charter Org. meeting space for fund raising?  We want to be fair but of course everyone wants it for this summer!  Thank you in advance.

Just curious how much are they raising?

Our unit has an average of about 10 Eagles per year.  Average cost for the projects is about $500.  About 2/3 of that seems to come from family (parents and extended).  The remainder they request donations from unit, friends, etc.  The Eagle project should not focus on fundraising.  It could be a needed part but is not a requirement.  Several are self financed.

As for when they can or need to start, not until AFTER the Eagle project proposal is approved.

45 minutes ago, k80sill said:

This struck me as particularly interesting. Could you please elaborate more on this insight? 

The main selling point, the market differentiator is in fact the outdoor program.  That is the lab or classroom if you want to call it that where Scouting happens.  It does not happen at Merit Badge Universities or selling popcorn.  Scouting happens and Scouts grow when they are in small groups, a Scout is the leader, and they need to accomplish something.  Like cook meals, put up tarps, etc.  They then take that experiential learning and apply this as Senior Leaders in the troop and hopefully apply that as they work through an Eagle project.

The Improved Scouting Program removed much of this, became more individual based, and fundamentally altered the BSA program.  When combined with the BoyPower issues and fake member number and those that actually left the program, big hit.   The Improved Scouting Program relabeled Scoutmasters as “managers of learning” to reflect the new emphasis on emotional  support. The BSA’s attempt to reach new populations of youth in depressed rural areas and inner cities created an intense backlash from the traditionally conservative core membership of the Boy Scouts of America. Abandoning an emphasis on nature and promoting emotional support struck many Denmasters, Scoutmasters, and Explorer Post Chiefs as an attack on their leadership style and a softening of the BSA. 

Membership dropped significantly and many seasoned leaders departed.

44 minutes ago, k80sill said:

This is all very interesting, where did you get this information?

 

I was there as a Scout and recall this.  Still have a patch.  Most of this is a matter of public record if you poke around the internet. The faux membership issues are a matter of public record.  I seem to recall the SE in one council was on track to be the next CSE when the membership imploded.  He did not get promoted to CSE

Good report

Now if BSA can get 6,000,000 more Scouts to attend and they can make a net profit of $125 per Scout they can break even on the 3/4 of Billion Dollar Investment made

7 hours ago, Jameson76 said:

New members would be recruited through two efforts: establishing troops in inner cities and retaining older boys by allowing girls to participate in the special-interest, career-focused segment of the Explorers program. 

 

The inner city troop effort (which at it's core was a worthy initiative) led to the Improved Scouting Program of 73.  That was the birth of skill awards and the "NEW" path to Eagle that would in fact not require any camping, or actually going outdoors.  That pretty much halved the BSA by 1981 and they had to get Greenbar Bill out of retirement to revamp the program.

Between the BoyPower ManPower deal and the ISP, there was a double whammy during  70 - 81.  Pretty sure the Scouting program in the USA never fully recovered and found it's way again. 

National leadership kept looking for the golden ring, the next best thing, the silver bullet.  They never understood that they had the best program and that fun with a purpose was what kids wanted

On October 17, 1968, the Boy Scout organization launched a new membership initiative called “Boypower 76.” The ambitious program set national goals to be achieved by the US Bicentennial Celebration of 1976. Specifically,

(1) Expand membership so that one of every three American boys is enrolled. That would require adding 2 million new Boy Scouts by 1976.

(2) Double council budgets to a combined level of $150 million.

New members would be recruited through two efforts: establishing troops in inner cities and retaining older boys by allowing girls to participate in the special-interest, career-focused segment of the Explorers program. 

The national slogan for Boypower 76 was “America’s Manpower Begins with Boypower.” 

Membership Quotas

Councils were given strict monthly and annual membership goals to keep them on track to achieve the expansion envisioned in Boypower 76. 

The Controversial Collapse of Boypower

BSA canceled the Boypower program two years early, amid widespread reports of inflated membership numbers.  Articles in the New York Daily News, the Central New Jersey Home News, and many other newspapers enumerated the problems. The Chicago council was accused of selling one-month memberships for ten cents; other councils for inventing names to register. At least 13 major cities were discovered to have falsified records, involving some 30,000-40,000 “phantom” scouts.

Furthermore, only about half of the $65 million fundraising goal was met, and much of that was from long-time donors who directed their gifts to the national organization instead of the local council.

1 hour ago, PACAN said:

What are your thoughts about councils running Virtual Summer camps which are really MB events ?

Prices?   I've heard of $5 up to $25 per badge .  Also seen where they charge for Totem Chip and Fireman Chits and early scout skills.

A few other evening events such as a campfire and OA socials.

 

 

Not a fan...but then I've not like the merit badge universities either.

1 minute ago, AltadenaCraig said:

When a Texas realty group abandons the term "Master Bedroom", how long before references to "Scoutmaster" meet the same fate?

If that comes to pass BSA will have jumped the shark...

We as a nation have truly lost our minds and common sense.

One of the positions by National BSA is that National and the Councils are in fact separate.  Possibly yes legally as different entities, but are they really?

Then BSA National makes the statement on racism and Black Lives Matter (BSA capitalization), and in our Council the DE's read the statement word for word at roundtables and basically advised this was to be taken as gospel, no questions, we all need to get in lockstep and accept.  No statement or interpretation from the local council.

From a purely legal perspective how does the BSA (National and Council) resolve or justify the "separation" when clearly National makes policy and Councils implement.  Seems like actions may speak louder than words

Been involved as a leader for 40+ years.  Been with current troop for 14 years or so.  My son aged out 5 years ago, but still involved.  At the unit level.

Stay active at the unit level.  That is where you can impact youth and feel success.  I have seen many groups go through.  Seems like just as one group ages out and I think, man they were the best, another group sort of comes of age and I think, man, they are the best.

If you are the SM, maybe now is the time to transition to another role in the troop.  Life to Eagle person, Outdoor, etc.  Keep hands on in the program but not as SM.

There are always new challenges.  We are busy planning our own summer camp for July.  Something I would have never envisioned, but it will be an epic chapter in out troop's 40+ year story.

3 hours ago, ALongWalk said:

Adding this to the conversation: https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/why-im-skeptical-of-the-boy-scouts-new-inclusion-initiatives/2020/06/19/9f4da7a8-b26a-11ea-8758-bfd1d045525a_story.html

The writer is a former scouter and has a bi-racial son who earned Eagle. At the end of the day, if our movement is to thrive we have to help people to not be skeptical of the BSA’s desire to be inclusive.  That really comes down to each of us and our individual actions. 

An interesting anecdotal article.  Sorry for what happened in his experience.

From that one experience he decides to then paint with a very very broad brush

Too many involved in the BSA are Trump supporters, bullish on his foreign and economic policies, silent when it comes to his stoking of racial divisions.

So now we see the real reason for his article.  Not an honest comment on BSA and it's policies, but a soapbox to criticize the President.  And he has every right to, but if you are going to do that own that criticism and be straightforward.

Then he again makes a very very broad statement or assumption

Racism seems to be at the heart of scout leadership because racism is at the heart of America. I’m encouraged by the BSA’s change of direction. Still, I can’t help thinking that if scouting really were about “character and leadership,” as the BSA said in its earlier, inadequate statement, the organization would have done something about the racism within its ranks a long, long time ago.

That is a very damning statement and one that is not backed up by any actual data or realism.  That is like going to a chain restaurant and having a bad experience and claiming that all 3,000 locations are bad due to that one sampling.

Writer needs to be honest.  Yes he seems to have had a bad experience in one troop.  However if you assume bad intentions and look for the worst everywhere, you will likely find it.

22 hours ago, David CO said:

BSA doesn't own the councils or the units.  It is not their house.  

While I would agree, there are a whole bunch of lawyers that would beg to differ with that opinion.

9 minutes ago, Sentinel947 said:

I mostly use just a rain coat. I find the sweat and extra heat from the rain pants is rarely worth it. If I was going on a trip with a lot of rain in the forecast I'd bring rain pants, but on most trips I leave them at home and have rarely regretted it. 

Agree on the rain pants, rarely or never wear them

I have a Columbia rain jacket, cost maybe $50 - $60.  Has worn well.  Have some pants that I may have worn once, but it was rainy and cold and the wind was blowing.  Maybe it was also snowing and I had to hike uphill both ways.

7 minutes ago, InquisitiveScouter said:

They are poor initiatives.  Except for #4.

 

I would agree

Specifically I dislike the collective guilt expressed in the opening sentence

As our country reckons with racial injustice, we all must consider our role and our failures and commit to meaningful action.

That makes a lot of assumptions

Had notice today that Philmont refunds for 2020 would be sent in 8 - 10 weeks.  That is a much longer window than the 2018 refunds.

Trust they are not held up due to the bankruptcy.  That would be extremely complicated and detrimental

59 minutes ago, Ronmass said:

Massachusetts --Camp Squanto is planning on opening in July...One of the guidelines is there has to be 2 medical staff on duty 24 hrs per day ..Another guideline is NO out of state troops may come to the camp --that is very sad since we have a troop that fly's in from Texas and another that drives from CT ...NO merit badges for aquatics or shooting sports ..And their plan for meals is they will deliver all meals to the camp sites … All of this is contingent on the town of Plymouth giving them their permits  Comments ?  Opinions ?

What you are describing is what many camps had to consider and plan for, and many just declined to run this summer.

Once you take out the dining hall meals, aquatics, shooting sports, assemblies, and campfires...is it really summer camp?  Yes you are camping in the summer, but is it "camp".  Basically it is troops camping in the same area, but no interaction.  That is part of the fun of Summer Camp.  Seeing and being with the other troops.  Games in the fields, Ga Ga pits, trading post porch, etc.

Without all of that the expense and trouble is most likely not worth it.  Our camps cancelled and we are doing our own summer camp.  If the above had been the plan, we would have gone it alone anyway,

If Baden-Powell had had his way, the Boy Scouts might have formed close ties with the Hitler Youth. In 1937, he told the Scouts' international commissioner that the Nazis were "most anxious that the Scouts should come into closer touch with the youth movement in Germany." Baden-Powell met with the German ambassador in London and was invited to meet the Führer himself, though the war prevented him from visiting the Third Reich. But he continued to admire Hitler's values, writing in a 1939 diary entry that Mein Kampf was "a wonderful book, with good ideas on education, health, propaganda, organisation etc."

As an update we have picked the date (basically 2nd full week of July).  Camp will be at a State Park about 45 minutes away.  We have about 25 Scouts signed up right now.  There are T-shirts being made (Pandemic Summer!!) and other fun things being procured.  

The main program activities will be New Scout Programs, Merit Badge sessions (Based on what the Scout are interested in), Lake activities, Mountain Biking, etc.  We have parents working on meals, some will be brought in, some will be non-cook.  Cooking class will handle some.  We will have opening and closing campfires, movie night, cobbler luau night, etc.  Also the Scouts can ride bikes to activities.  

Working with current and former leaders, also recently aged out Eagles to provide support for instruction and activities.  Some are coming out for the day, some for a few nights.  

Our feedback to the parents is...if it seems like we are making this up as we go along, we are.  Basically we do 10 -12 two and three days outings annually.  This will be a 5 night 6 day outing.  Just like what we normally do, only a bit longer.

Sadly Philmont has cancelled for 2020

It is with great disappointment that Philmont Scout Ranch announces the cancelation of all remaining programs for the 2020 summer season.  Due to the Governor’s COVID-19 guidelines, and the State of New Mexico Health Department’s restrictions regarding travel, our efforts to secure a portion of the summer season were denied.

The safety of our participants, staff and community has been and will remain our top priority. The Philmont staff were relentless in pursuing all options and will continue to assist participants as they navigate their options.

Key Points:

• The Reservation Contact and Lead Advisor for each crew were emailed a survey to complete after consulting with their crew.  
• Philmont will waive the adult to youth ratio (if YPT guidelines are met) to accommodate Scouts who will “age out” by the time they are rescheduled through 2022. 
• Philmont Training Center, Family Adventure Camp Participants, and NAYLE participants will receive a call next week (June 8-12) to discuss rescheduling options or refunds.
• Individual Trek Participants were emailed a survey to complete.
• Staff have received communication from the Seasonal Personnel office. 

https://www.philmontscoutranch.org/coronavirus/

Rumor is Woodruff Scout Reservation for Atlanta Area Council will not operate this summer.  Neither is Bert Adams.  No formal announcement yet, but the council has not disseminated the National fee increase yet, so obviously communication with the minions and actual customers they are supposed too serve (Scouts and Leaders) is not a high priority

7 hours ago, 5thGenTexan said:

I sent my DE  the graphic and he called me today asking where I got it.  Council is ready to release tomorrow.  Going to be a huge shock to everyone that doesn't tune into the social media.

Got the same thing - "It's not official" and still no information from the council.  Apparently we will not hear anything from them until it's official.  I guess official timelines are different in different councils.  Interesting.

The call then turned in to an FOS discussion, told him to have a nice day

Agree that the key is local program and local fun and adventure.

Out troop is from what would be considered an upper income community, but we still keep it simple.  $100 per year for dues and registration.  We do no fundraisers.  We charge a nominal fee for outings ($10 -15) and camp 12 times per year.  Couple of summer camps, Scouts pay for those, and attempt to make it straightforward.  The troop does service projects and we do attend high adventure.

Key is to let the Scouts spend time with friends, have fun, hand out in hammocks.

With summer camp issues we are running our own camp and "shocked face" our cost is less than 1/2 the council camp