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Eagle1993

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Everything posted by Eagle1993

  1. Eagle1993

    Scout BSA Uniform Survey (Girls)

    From FB link: Each of these uniform item samples has different specific features the survey asks about. It is not a simple 'Pick A, B, C, or D' survey, but rather 2 pages (front and back) of specific questions. The survey forms will be sent to National Supply for review and the next step of designing. Here are a few clarifications for these uniforms based on questions received: -Skorts: These will be the same color as our current Scout Pants. They will be the same length as Scout Shorts. The skorts also have dry fit/athletic style shorts built in to them. -Shirts: The shirts are a more fitted style and the curved bottom would be worn untucked. There is also a different vent in the back, just at the arms - rather than across entire back. The sleeves will also be a few inches longer. -Capris/Pants: These are the number one style sold by other outdoor retailers. In store, there are two pocket styles that you'll be asked about on the survey. -Womens Fitting: BSA has been working with an Expert Fitter to help redesign the uniform fit. They will also be focusing on Plus Size fit, youth fitting, and overall design.
  2. Eagle1993

    National, Religion, Membership, Oath and Law

    UK numbers look a lot better than Canada. UK is 1/5 the population of USA. Cub Scouts/Beavers UK: 286,218 BSA: 1,252,311 UK has 13% more Cub Scouts than BSA per capita. Scouts/Boy Scouts UK: 127,127 BSA: 822,999 UK has 23% less Scouts than BSA has Boy Scouts. Note the BSA number includes varsity scouts so that could drop a lot. I didn’t include UK explorers or BSA Venturing, Learning for Life or Explorers Now, with the UK apparently growing their numbers recently and BSA losing (especially after LDS exit) I wouldn’t be surprised if the BSA older program drops below UK’s. So, we should really look at the UK to see how they recovered while other scouting programs have and continue to drop. Also, we shouldn’t give up on LDS scouts. My father is a volunteer in a District that does have its fair share of LDS scouts and apparently many scouts and even LDS scout leaders have indicated they plan to continue in scouting into 2020. That could be wishful thinking (on both sides) but I do think the BSA should be aggressive in working with LDS scouts and leaders to see what can be done to keep as many as possible.
  3. Eagle1993

    Scout BSA Uniform Survey (Girls)

    I don’t get the skorts... I can’t imagine that will be more than a short fad with some of the early adopters, but I’m not an expert in fashion or clothing trends. The comment about the discussion of purpose of the uniform came from a review with an OA group. I don’t know if that was from National or scouts/leaders. I think (speculation) the point is that some of the changes (extra large pockets on shirt) could help if used in the field but doesn’t look as good in more formal settings. It sounds like they have both male and female uniforms out for feedback. There are discussions on what to use to close pockets (zippers, Velcro or buttons). One comment I did see was that the material felt better than the current uniform. Overall the FB comments are pretty negative but I think it’s tough to tell without seeing in person Personally, I would vote to keep current uniform with females able to get the same just tailored for women. I’m not a fan of B above... those button locations... @Eagle94-A1 What is the deal with Urban Outfitters selling weird BSA uniforms? These look like official uniforms that were modified. Given your history at National supply I thought you might have some insight. https://www.urbanoutfitters.com/shop/urban-renewal-recycled-tie-front-scout-shirt https://www.urbanoutfitters.com/shop/vintage-patched-button-down-scout-shirt
  4. Eagle1993

    Scout BSA Uniform Survey (Girls)

    Apparently there are 4 options. All have the fleur-de-lis. One is simply the current shirt that is tailored for girls. The other three are above. Yes, large pockets with zippers are on the front (I added another pic that shows that in more detail). Some are designed to be untucked. The debate within the council and National Supply is regarding the point of the uniform. Is it a dress uniform for more formal events or should it be functional for field use.
  5. Eagle1993

    Scout BSA Uniform Survey (Girls)

    When I talk with female scouters there are complaints that the shirts and pants don’t fit women’s bodies. They are cut for men’s shapes. One example I heard is on pants. Girls have larger hips after puberty. Breasts are also cause the tops to not fit in many cases. Many women leaders simply don’t buy the pants or buy pants at 3rd party stores that kinda match. Uniform shirts they just deal with. Finally, some religions require that women not wear pants... or so I’m told. That said I know Orthodox Jews don’t allow pants but they require full length skirts... so I’m not sure what religion would require skorts. To me the styles should be identical, but I’m ok with different sizes and fits.
  6. Eagle1993

    Scout BSA Uniform Survey (Girls)

    More options.
  7. Eagle1993

    Scout BSA Uniform Survey (Girls)

    Apparently there are several other shirts going around as well. Some include vertical zipper pockets. In some cases, the new shirts are designed to be untucked. These are the only pictures I’ve seen so far.
  8. Eagle1993

    Scout BSA Uniform Survey (Girls)

    They state we should ignore the color for now (it will be olive green). I think those are leg pockets on short pants... Agreed. I’m not a fan of the style. I don’t like hidden pockets or buttons.
  9. I plan to launch a parents survey to get feedback and help determine any changes we need to consider. This is an anonymous survey... not the talent one. I have a series of questions in mind but I thought I would ask if anyone had suggestions. I only plan to ask questions that could actual impact our program (so questions about Scout Me In or Scouts BSA name change won’t be included). Thanks in advance!
  10. Eagle1993

    Deterring thoughts of discrimination w/girls?

    Part of me thinks commissioners and executives should work with units to help coordinate this more. For example, in my town my Pack and Troop are adding girls. That means the other three Packs and Two Troops shouldn’t have any pressure to go coed if they don’t want to. Let all of the girls interested join the one Pack and Troop. I think it will help those units build up critical mass of girls while allowing other units remain Boy only without the negative comments. Over time, if there are a lot of girls those units may decide to go coed as well... but that may be years down the road (if ever). The other benefit is that any scouts in my Pack or Troop who want a boy only unit would have access to one. *I know it’s not coed but I hate the term Family Pack.
  11. Eagle1993

    When do the necker colors change?

    I was told they plan to use up the yellow ones before introducing red across the board. We will probably use yellow one more year....
  12. Eagle1993

    Deterring thoughts of discrimination w/girls?

    Here is the concern I am hearing. I would ask our forum lawyers for input if this is really a risk. Under 1 CO: Troop 111 boys has the best equipment, multiple trips a year, etc. Troop 111 girls has crappy equipment, rarely takes trips, etc. Let’s say the CO provides or is perceived to provide more help to the Boys Troop than the Girls Troop. Then a girl could sue stating discrimination due to gender. she would point out the equipment differences, the trip difference, the “favoritism”. I don’t see this as common as any CO adding a linked girls Troop should have plans to ensure no discrimination. That said this is the concern I have heard about the separate but equal plan. Given the funding and CO are typically not government organizations I’m not sure this is really a risk.
  13. Eagle1993

    National, Religion, Membership, Oath and Law

    Perhaps we need a parents scouting program at AOL crossovers. The youth cross the bridge and become Scouts and the parents cross a different bridge and become BSA4Adults.
  14. Eagle1993

    National, Religion, Membership, Oath and Law

    I can’t imagine all councils surviving. I would expect mergers at councils heavily impacted. Bryan isn’t stating mergers but he is stating some councils will be impacted. https://blog.scoutingmagazine.org/2018/05/09/what-you-need-to-know-about-the-lds-church-announcement/ “While most councils have some LDS membership, roughly 10 percent of councils have a significant population of LDS members. These councils may be affected more significantly by the LDS church’s decision.”
  15. Eagle1993

    National, Religion, Membership, Oath and Law

    499,989 left to go... My Pack has 11 girls now. 😀...............😥
  16. Eagle1993

    National, Religion, Membership, Oath and Law

    I think we have been seeing the changes already. LDS and BSA are tightly tied together. I’m sure LDS notified BSA of their long term plans years ago. I think it is likely BSA made the gay youth, gay leader, transgender youth and girls with knowledge that LDS was eventually leaving anyway.
  17. I wonder how many LDS scouts will remain in BSA after December 2019. Hopefully many will join other Troops, but I’m not sure if the youth would be interested in both scouting and their own youth organization.
  18. Eagle1993

    LDS leaving BSA?

    Interesting article from Think Progress that walks through the history of LGBT admission into scouting. While primarily focused on the actions and events that led to the changes in membership policy it does talk to some who have studied the Morman faith and seems to conclude it is likely that LDS will completely leave the BSA. It also states that the BSA leadership is likely aware and that could be a primary driver in opening up membership to females (to help offset the loss). While the article is written by a former member of Scouts for Equality and I don't agree that our membership loss was due to our admission policy in the 1990s through early 2000 (GSUSA also dropped during that time) I thought the article raised some interesting points and may be another reason BSA is looking to open up membership. https://thinkprogress.org/boy-scouts-lgbtq-lds-policy-changes-3b6f6fcdce4a/
  19. Eagle1993

    LDS leaving BSA?

    Bumping this thread as it appears the Think Progress piece in 2017 linking BSA move to include girls as they knew LDS would be leaving was correct (or at least partially correct).
  20. Eagle1993

    How will you talk about girls troops and packs?

    If they want to avoid seeing girls they will also need to avoid National parks, high adventure areas, public campgrounds and BSA camps. So, for avoiding girls/women it depends on how far they want to take it. Case in point, my Pack was just at our council’s camp while a Boy Scout Troop was there. Yes, those scouts saw the girls in my pack. I don’t believe it should have any impact on them, but if it does, they will have to avoid BSA camps as they can’t guarantee other units won’t be there with girls. I think the only way to really avoid girls is the LDS camps or boys only weeks at summer camp. Otherwise, most camps and locations will have women and girls present.
  21. Eagle1993

    Concerns with coed rules, leadership, liability

    For early adopter Packs the requirement is an adult female over 21 YPT must be present. So as long as one of the female leaders attend you should be ok. Going into next year the female ADL/DL will be required for every girls den. I don’t know if that means every female den leader must attend every overnight or if you can simply ensure some female den leader coverage. I think our pack will ensure we have female ADL or DL for every den and ensure at least 1 of them attends pack overnights to provide the YPT coverage... but I need to obtain my MS in YPT first before I can say conclusively.
  22. Eagle1993

    Webelos to Arrow of Light Ceremony

    We haven’t performed any ceremony for Webelos Scouts other than a short announcement and handing out rank badges. We do perform a simple ceremony for den advancement to next level. We would start with the Tigers placing their Tiger neckerchiefs on the Lions who are now Tiger Scouts. That same action would work its way up until Webelos place new Webelos neckerchiefs on the Bear Den Scouts. Generally we perform both at the same Pack meeting and combined it could be a ceremony.
  23. Eagle1993

    From National: Official Name

    I could see this more of an issue for girls turning 18 in 2020. Outside of those, I agree that there shouldn’t be a rush.
  24. Eagle1993

    Adding Girls to Pack

    Figured I would post an update. All of the girls have now earned their rank and will receive their patches at our next Pack meeting. We just had an overnight as a pack and it went very well. Yes, there were arguments (just like the boys), but overall it was a great experience. At times the girls would hang together, other times some boys would hang with them...They were just additional Cub Scouts. On a personal note, adding my daughter to Cub Scouts has helped us bond over the last 3-4 months. My son and I have already had a lot of shared memories in scouting and I can’t wait to build more with my daughter. I talked with various leaders and there is overwhelming support and/or indifference to the change within our pack of 85. Many people were asking about the name change and wondering why they won’t change the corporate name. Some thought our new name was Scout Me In... working through that confusion. We are planning a big recruiting push this fall to ensure all girls and boys in our school are aware of the opportunity we offer. I’m curious what interest is out there...
  25. So, we have started the process to add girls as part of the early adopter program. Still early in the process so we will see where this goes Requirements are similar to what you saw in the video. It is clear they want us to keep the boy and Girl dens separate. They want new den leaders for the all girls den(s). It was mentioned that if we have 9 boys and 5 girls in the same level, they could meet same time/place but should have separate leaders and be separate during the activity. This is an emphasis of the early adopter program. They do not want commingled dens. Minimum number of girls per Pack is 4-5. There is no minimum per den. We can combine girls in different age groups in the same all Girl den. This probably explains the pack with 5 girls. Right now, we are working on identifying girls that want to join and den leaders to cover their den(s). If there is not enough interest we will stop. Jan 15 is the official start date.
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