numbersnerd

Our Pack had instituted RR as some summertime event where boys got the balsa wood kit the day of the event and went at it right there and then. By the time we got around, it was usually 4-6 boys participating. If you even knew it was happening. Very dispiriting.

I changed it to the first Pack-wide event after recruiting was done. A way for new and old to meet and introduce people. But the kits were problematic. So we did away with them. Donated pool noodles cut in half length wise, approx 10" long serve as hulls. Bendy Straws and foam sheets are masts and sails. Pencils and dowels make the holes in the materials. Stickers and markers personalize the craft. And they all fit in the actual gutters we use.

Multiple revisions ensue throughout the day. No organized races, no trophies, no awards. Just boys building, experimenting, competing against one another. They make up the agreed upon "rules" of the day. They decide who and how they race. Nobody walks away unhappy. The thrill in crafting a boat that floats and can be propelled down the raceway is the goal. Learning from and comparing to other boys adds to the fun. It's a great start to the program year and involves none of the hassle and officialdom that dominates PWD.

Confusion on some part exists due to the program name and the rank name being the same. Ranks are ranks and requirements need to be met to receive them, it's not a participation patch. Wolf program year is not a guarantee that the Wolf rank will be completed. Likewise, crossing over into the next program year is NOT contingent upon completion of the current program rank.

Our Pack does it this way:

• B&G is an event, not a deadline. I have spent several years dispelling the myth of rank completion by this event. Yet every year there are a few (especially new families that Google stuff) that go from 30% done to complete in the two weeks prior to B&G. Aside from the obvious pencil whipping, how much has the Scout gotten from the experience? Very frustrating.
• AoL can and usually is complete by B&G, helping perpetuate the "ranks by B&G" myth. An AoL ceremony and bridging ceremony at B&G bores the pants off of everyone and drags the night out. I have had AoL dens finish and bridge in December or January. This moves a lot of the ceremonial agony to a smaller group.
• We attempt to have ranks completed by spring camp out. This gives us the opportunity to do an outdoor ceremony around the campfire, making it more memorable. Those that complete it well ahead of that time have the choice of receiving it at a regular Pack meeting or waiting for the campfire. None yet have opted for the Pack meeting awarding.
• The last month of the program year is either electives or recovering material helping boys complete their rank requirements. Gives boys that have covered material a chance to help/lead/tutor others as we go through the activities. The teamwork, pride, accomplishments, and relief(!) are very gratifying for everyone.
• Crossover is done at the end of the school year. Merely acknowledging the passage of time, the end of the year, and the beginning of a new one. They shed their neckerchiefs and receive new ones. It IS confusing for some as we DO have a ceremonial bridge that they walk across. Is it bridging or crossover? We say crossover and save bridging for Webelos to Scout.
• For record-keeping purposes we advance all Scouts to the next program year around June 1. If you haven't completed it by then, it's unlikely you will anyway. Summer activities, if any (such as day/resident camp) count for the next program year.

4 hours ago, Col. Flagg said:

What was so disrespectful in my response? Really?

Must have been mine as it was deleted. I asked if someone was willing to have their son sell popcorn outside the gentleman's club. Why it was deleted is beyond me as long as we are dealing in hypotheticals and trying to determine just where the line of acceptability is going to be drawn.

Heavy-handed moderators at their best.

The first thing you need to do is have a discussion with your CO and find out if they support inclusion of girls in their unit. Any activity before that is potentially a waste of effort.

14 minutes ago, Tampa Turtle said:

I was a reluctant Tiger leader but my 2nd week in I was at the grocery store and one of my boys pointed me out to his mom "That's him! My Scoutleader!". I was hooked. I felt like a rock star.

Ditto. Went to the school one day for something and it was lunch time. I got waves and high fives all down the hallway.

Most AOL ceremonies at B&G tend to drag on and bore the audience outside of the families of the boys receiving it. Candle after candle. Then add on the bridging. Removing neckerchiefs, walking, pausing for photos, putting on new neckerchiefs...ugh.

Now, AOL and bridging combined together in itself is not a bad idea IF the logistics of Packs and Troops works out. Watched a simple night outdoor AOL ceremony (5 min) with symbolic arrows and the AOL sign. Just the Webelos and their families and some Troop leaders. Then it was time for bridging. The boys walked across a land bridge (~100 yds) between ponds with torches on alternating sides. 12 of them. Can you guess the next part?. Next to each was a Scout holding a sign of each point of the law, announcing it as they passed. The parents watched their sons disappear into the night one by one as the Scout Law was repeated for each one. Very symbolic and touching. And yes, there were a few parental tears, but the right kind.

When they joined their sons on the other side, it was to see them being congratulated by the Scouts and already wearing huge smiles.

2 hours ago, Pselb said:

I'll take this as a sincere question.  Aside from a full time job and full time stay-at-home mothering, we are very busy with our children.  With three, they all have their own interests that need to be encouraged and supported as parents.  Our son happens to be interested in Cub Scouts because we are an active outdoor type of family.  Homeschooling i the areas of science and history take my summer vacation time to the limit where we do camping, fishing, nature hikes, plant identification, swimming conservation, etc. in the setting other than a traditional classroom.  Museums, historical places, and such fill up our history "lessons" with on-site learning from the docents.  With that in mind, we use the programs to enhance their home-schooling.  Socially, our children have church, youth programs (that they are interested in), independent educational programs, (nature conservancies, etc.) that they are meeting other people and interacting with them.

As far as us volunteering? Would it be suffice to say that if do not have an interest our children do, why should we volunteer?  We have OUR interests to pursue as well and volunteer elsewhere.  As my father used to say, We "do our own thing."  We have our interests and they have theirs and as a family we work out the details.

At our Pack level, my son has not been "short changed" in anyway because we as parents don't volunteer.  His den leaders don't ever comment that our lack of involvement has stiffed his getting out of the program what it has to offer.  If he has a question that we as parents need to address we do so, but that is very rare.  He seems to enjoy what he's doing and we get no complaints from the program leaders.  Does his involvement affect our family?  In many ways, our daughters have fun sewing onto his shirt whatever awards he might get.  If there's a family invite to the annual banquet, we as a family attend to support his involvement.

With the discussion on this forum tending to be rather negative towards the program, fortunately our son has not felt any impact with it.  I got on the forum when he started and only recently began to post.    With home-schooling on the rise in America and everything else in the youth world tending a downward spiral, it begs the question why?  I left out video games and cell phones as the only exception that is growing at an astounding rate.    As a teacher in a public school, I hear the comments from the schools and from forums such as this and constantly wonder why I want to jump into the fray.  Thus in the interest of my family and my responsibility towards it, I don't.

You make it sound as if those who DO volunteer have ample time on their hands and few outside interests and lives of their own.

3 hours ago, NJCubScouter said:

I didn't see any seedy characters outside that building in the picture.  All I see is a girl selling cookies.  The police are probably watching that place like hawks.  It's probably the safest place in town.

In response to your previous post about Scouts doing things "against federal law":  Nothing she is doing violates any law, state or federal.  She is selling cookies, presumably not the kind of cookies they may sell inside.  At most she might have been violating some rule of the GSUSA, but the story seems to indicate that she wasn't even doing that.

So popcorn sales outside a liquor store, smoke shop, or adult book/movie store would be good in your book?

Legal commercial activity? Yes.

Fitting with the program? No.

We have done items like this in the past. Having other leaders and scouts sign it on the back adds a special touch.

Plaque ideas

4 minutes ago, cocomax said:

Can everyone at least agree that:

When male Scouters are treated differently from female Scouters with regard to YPT, that is unequal. And unfair.

 

 

As simple as that sounds. it is evidently not.

It is one thing to disagree. It is entirely another to be purposely obtuse merely to further one side of an argument. As leaders I expect a bit higher standard than I have seen on display from some here. If this is the future of Scouting, I am deeply saddened.

1 hour ago, NJCubScouter said:

Hopefully they will come up with something brilliant.

Are they doing a wholesale replacement of management at National?

Maybe it's just curious timing, but I thought that things weren't going to change once girls came aboard?

Someone needs to turn on their sarcasm detector...

3 hours ago, CalicoPenn said:

Who is the source of any of these quotes and ideas?  None if it is coming from National.  National says there will be single gender Troops - they specifically said there would be no mixed gender Troops.  24 hours later, there's "reporting" all over the place that the BSA is going to have mixed gender troops, and maybe even mixed gender patrols.  Where did that come from?  Scouters speculating like wild because they can't seem to take what National has said at face value and they say they can't take what National says at face value because they don't trust them.

Trust is a two-way street - A Scout (and a Scouter) is Trustworthy.  As you continue to repeat these rumors, as you continue to state that you don't trust National, ask yourself just how Trustworthy you are.

 

This might carry weight if none of the rumors ever came true. But they continually do. So to say those who hear and pass along rumors are not trustworthy is a non sequitur.

1 hour ago, RememberSchiff said:

@NJCubScouter sounds like the Pit of Misery.

Just one of the program areas at Camp Dilly Dilly.

It's also possible that it is a long-running game between the two other Scouts. Who wants to stop down their grudge match?! More tact could have been used in their response if that was the case, but it's still a possibility.

"Congratulations on attaining the rank of Eagle Scout. Check, cash, or charge?"

Just now, NJCubScouter said:

Ok, but it still seems curious that when the shutdown ended they did not call the volunteers back in and reopen the park.

It also seems odd to me that the availability to the public of a federal park would depend on volunteers rather than federal employees.  If you had asked me who lets visitors into federal parks, restocks paper products, etc., my assumption would have been that it is done by Department of Interior employees, not volunteers.  But I guess I just learned something.

As for the shutdown of the moment, it appears that a deal has been reached in the Senate but will still have to be voted on in the House, to keep the government open for another 3 weeks or so.

We thought all the same things and got the same education. Seems that the COE didn't give them a choice. Property to be closed in 24 hrs. Get out ASAP and they locked the gates. Is it any surprise it was difficult to find anyone willing to commit to that afterward?

Then again, this was when they barricaded areas that were normally open 24 hrs anyway, so nothing should really be a surprise.

We've had some join in 4th, but none lately join in 5th grade. Actually, the largest group for the last few years has been 2nd grade. Modestly sized Tiger dens blow up into big Wolf dens. Then the conundrum is do we split into separate dens, and if so, how? I can see related issues with the membership requirements changing, influx of me scouts, dissatisfaction with it all, and lots of swizzling and requests to combine girls and boys when numbers bounce around. What a mess. And of course many solutions will be reactive instead of being planned in advance. So much for promoting a strong program and plan...

1 hour ago, NJCubScouter said:

It seems strange that the people did not go back to work when the shutdown was over.  Isn't that the whole point of trying to end the shutdown asap, so the people can go back to work?

I forgot to mention that the caretakers are not paid. Basically volunteers that trade labor for camping slots. They set their RV up at reserved areas close to the office and handle admission, stocking paper products in the restrooms, etc. I think they do it on 6 or 12 month stints. Not that it makes any difference to park visitors. Closed is closed, no matter the reason.

Or any park run by the Army Corps of Engineers. You just don't realize how far those Federal tentacles reach...

We've been hit with it before. Sad part is that the shutdown had been over for months. But the caretakers weren't there to run park operations because they were told to leave when the shutdown started. They didn't have anyone else come in after things were supposed to be open again, so the park remained closed. 

Just now, cocomax said:

What is the name of the new BSA girl's program?

90 days and counting, still waiting on the details. And the broad points.

11 minutes ago, Sentinel947 said:

It's a culture war item, Culture war articles drive clicks. 

The end justifies the means, the victims are of no consequence.

“But – to put it brutally – you can’t make an omelet without breaking eggs.”   Walter Duranty, New York Times reporter, on Stalin's genocide and forced collectivism.

Temperature varies depending on which part you're in. But overall I don't think heat would be an issue.

Slightly thinner air would probably require operator adjustment.

I would think the wind in a mountain range would be the most problematic.