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Eagle94-A1

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Posts posted by Eagle94-A1

  1. From Wikipedia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boy_Scout_Memorial

    Quote

    The three figures represent various concepts. According to the National Park Service the Boy Scout "represents the aspirations of all past, present, and future Scouts throughout the world. The male figure exemplifies physical, mental, and moral fitness, love of country, good citizenship, loyalty, honor, and courage. He carries a helmet, a symbol of masculine attire. The female figure symbolizes enlightenment with the love of God and fellow man, justice, freedom, and democracy. She holds the eternal flame of God's Holy Spirit."[2]

    The sculpture was founded by Modern Art Foundry in New York.[1]...

    ....The sculpture sits at the location of the 1937 National Scout Jamboree, the first jamboree. It was dedicated on November 7, 1964 and accepted by Associate Supreme Court Justice Tom C. Clark who celebrated his 50th anniversary of being an Eagle Scout on that day.[2]

    Cannot find the info doing a quick search, it may be on the  hiking trail brochure we did in DC, but I read that the artist wanted a Neoclassical look on par with some other statues in DC.

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  2. 15 minutes ago, MikeS72 said:

    Your post kind of confused me, as that is not at all what I see in this statue.  

    I might have been inclined to leave off the wings and torch, but other than that this is a girl in uniform; merit badge sash, neckerchief and all.

    The full article goes on about the Valkrie look the artist was going for.

    Wings definitely need to go. Change the torch to a lantern. As for the sash, I had to notice it with a closeup to notice it. It looks like scalemail armor to me.

  3. I agree with  @AwakeEnergyScouter.  I would have skipped mythology and classicalism altogether, see BSA Memorial in DC for the reason. I think having representatives of ladies in the last past and present,  1940s Den Mother,  1972 Sea Scout and Explorer, 1989 Female ASM,  1998 Venturer, and today's female Scouts would have been better. 

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  4. 2 hours ago, Eagle1993 said:

    I'll add... You kill Cub Scouts recruiting you kill the entire organization in a few years. 

    THAT IS THE BIGGEST UNDERSTATEMENT EVER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ( Yes i am shouting so I can get the attention of any pros here.)

    My council has been unable to recruit in the public schools for 9 years now. My county went from 8 packs to 2 packs. <u old pack went from 60+ to less than 20.

    As for troops, we had 8 troops with the average of 28 Scouts. We are down to 5 troops with an average of 9 scouts per troop.

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  5. Some major donors, think Fortune 500 companies,  were being threatened with boycotts. Government agencies with Explorer Posts were targeted with lawsuits for violating the separation between church and state. Which is why career oriented Exploring went under Learning for Life, and more traditional outdoor Exploring became Venturing. Folks targeted the Dept.of Defense or Dept. of the Army (sorry do not remember which) for allowing the BSA to use Fort A.P. Hill, now called Fort Walker, for jamborees.

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  6. On 7/6/2023 at 10:52 AM, mrjohns2 said:

    Looking me up in the eagle database was the only way I could find mine. 

    At least you are in the Eagle database. One of my long time Scouters, whom I have seen his original certificate, medal, and photos, is not listed.

  7. My thoughts.

    1. I was promised back in 1998 that SCOUTNET 2000 would change this situation and everything would transfer as you move from council to council. To quote Vezzini...

    https://i.pinimg.com/originals/67/d4/9f/67d49fb880af3eac5e38450b1740c14a.jpg

     

    2. If there is a way to merge numbers, can someone please share the directions? I have at least 5, possibly 6 if national issues their employees ID numbers,  and I would love to merge them all..

    3. I know they go back as far as the 1990s. But again the numbers are council specific. So some council may not have used them. My understanding is a national database accessible to all councils didn't come out until 1998, and it was phased in. Some council got access to it in June, others November. And trust me it was a mess.

  8. 20 hours ago, skeptic said:

     Am not sure that we want to encourage that, as too often it becomes a problem.  Old guy being picky (?).

    Sadly almost 100% of the "rumors" I read here and elsewhere turn out to be spot on correct.

    What I find funny is when I cite documentation from national, or more specifically the court case documents, I get angry looks, and am told I am a rumor monger.

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  9. 1 hour ago, Ojoman said:

    My understanding is that the National registration fee has been increasing as part of the settlement agreement. Local councils in years past were not permitted to add to the registration fees  but as councils lost donors and income due to the National controversies with LGBTQ as they went after our donors and then the costs of the bankruptcy councils were allowed modest additions for things like accident/liability surcharges.

    Correct. a large chunk of the national fees is going towards the lawsuit. And yes, folks did target donors. My understanding is that even with the updated policies, those donors are not contributing again which is why councils can add fees.

    1 hour ago, Ojoman said:

    In more recent years those restrictions have been loosened and councils that do a good job raising funds have added little or no increases to the National fee while councils that don't do so well have tacked on higher fees... If a council lacks the talent or opportunity to meet costs they pass it along. Camps, staff, office facility, insurances and program expenses need to be covered. Popcorn and FOS isn't getting the job done. You can look up recent 990 forms for your council if you want to get a picture of where the money goes.

    Sadly my council is in the "lacks talent" category. Between professionals not helping units survive, i.e. recruiting; ignoring volunteers, especially your small business owners who are willing to pay for specific, needed things; and yelling and cursing out volunteers they disagree with, multiple incidents at all levels; FOS donations have plummeted. More importantly, you got extremely experienced, and knowledgeable volunteers who say "The heck with council, and quit. Funny thing is, if a Life Scout asks for donations for their Eagle Project, the small business owners who use to volunteer are the first ones to donate.

    In my neck of the woods, people do not do popcorn because A. it is way overpriced and most folks locally cannot afford it and B. those units that have done it  have had some "issues" with council in which council takes a larger cut than they are suppose to. And I already covered FOS.

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  10. 7 hours ago, BetterWithCheddar said:

    I'm putting together an email for families in my son's den that contains details on upcoming events hosted by our council. One such event is a "family scouting outing" at a local council camp. The cost is $45/person. So, hypothetically, a family of 4 would pay $180 to attend an event on a property owned by the council and staffed by volunteers. This does not even include meals.

    $180! 😬

     

    YIKES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    I know one event my council did for cubs would cost $30-$40/ person, but that included meals. I never went to that one.

    The one I went to was $15/ person, with a max of $60/ family. I had a family of 5, so I appreciated the discount. Meals were not included, and we did unit or family cooking.

    The last one they had, was the last event at the camp before closing. Since "family" was not defined, we had a lot of grandfathers attending and reminiscing about the camp.

     

  11. Regarding Scout History.

    Yes  the boys were acquiring his military Reconnaissance and Scouting book, especially after  the Boer War, and using his work for fun.  When he came back from the Boer War, he saw a need for boys to have some type of positive group, gangs were a big problem.

    He approached the Boys' Brigade to see if they would use some of his ideas for a Scouting division, and they didn't use it. He then did Brownsea Island in 1907, and Bob's your uncle, Scouting is born. He published Scouting for Boys  initially in a series of journal articles, and it was a hit.

    As for Girl Guides, Olave had nothing do to with it until after she married him in 1912. He started it, and had his sister Agnes as Chief Guide, and she edited BP's work to make it suitable for girls. She stepped down as president in 1917, in favor of HRH Princess Mary. And she continued as a VP until her death.

    Olave didn't get involved in Scouting or Guiding until 1913. But she got heavily involved and in 1918 became Chief Guide.

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  12. My thoughts:

    Summer camp needs to focus on fun and hard to do MBs: shooting sports, climbing, aquatics, etc. I always recommend Scouts taking needed MBs, do some fun MBs, and having a free period. I did summer camp for 3 years as a Scout, ages 12-14. 3rd year was a HA program at the camp and it was  blast. 

    I am glad that my sons decided to do the Frontier Action Shooting at the camp they are going to this.  Middle son goes to college in August, and I doubt he will be active until December. And this is more than likely the Youngest's last summer camp, despite his age, because he is burnt out. He got fixated on Eagle, earned it, and said he is done. :(

    Focusing on Eagle is slowly killing the program.

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  13. 1 hour ago, AwakeEnergyScouter said:

    This sounds super helpful! How wonderful that you did this!

    Even if you did a tad too much. It's a situation read and it's not easy to see what the exact right level of challenge for someone is. Catching yourself is the steppingstone to improving anyway! 👏

    I worked a summer in Europe, and the focus there is fun and adventure, not advancement. We had 8 weeks to plan, and those troops take anywhere from 6 to 12 months to plan their summer camps, and they go all out. I personally prefer their way of doing things because it is patrol and troop focused, not MB and advancement focused. I basically used ideas I saw them do: Bike trip = Belgians, Canoes = English, Wilderness Survival = Germans, Feast and BORs =  Scots.

    I would love for the troop to do this again, but they want MBs.

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  14. We started work on MBs: cycling, canoeing, wilderness survival, cooking, etc. But the focus was more on activities and fun, especially with COVID. And the Scouts were told in advance what they could earn if they did ALL (emphasis) the work. For cooking, bulk used it for cooking rank requirements, and we had 3 BORs on Thursday night as a result.

    This is where I did too much.🤨 I did all the activity  planning for the camp, brought it to the PLC, and let them add or subtract to it. I also made the schedule flexible enough in that if they needed to change things around, it could be done. Only schedule items I was adamant on was 1) Board of Reviews starting at 6:30 Thursday night because the committee was visiting and we needed to respect their time and 2. We WILL be stopping at an ice cream shop after the first bike trek. : )  They had no problems with that at all. 🤣

  15. 19 hours ago, SSScout said:

    This memory certainly won't apply to most , but here goes. 

     I had a unique Scout time, unique families, unique dads and moms, I guess....

    As a new Tendefoot, I didn't know any better, but looking back....

    Somebody's uncle/grandfather (who knows now) had some wooded property. We camped there regularly. It had a spring for good water that we capped with a big concrete pipe. Idea ! Let's have our own summer camp !  With the cooperation of a  dad who worked for the phone company, we got several creosoted telephone poles, drug 'em in with a Jeep and tractor, cut them up, built a three sided Adirondack cabin into the hillside. This became the Quatermaster cabin.  Cleared some areas on both side of the creek for Patrol Campsites. Dragged, carried in picknick table parts, built tables at the sites.  Suitable trees and poles and tarps, we had dining areas.  Stones out of the creek, campfire areas and grills for cooking.  American Chestnut down and dead, best firewood in the world, burned with a blue flame. Other "ordinary" wood for "campfire " in the evenings. "Baker" style tents, standard, but each Scout bought their own.  Dammed up the creek for a "swimming " (wading) hole.  Scouting Skills taught and learned . Meals cooked over wood coals, some of us were better cooks than others, some of us washed dishes better than others....  We did summer camp there " 759 Camp Freedom" , for a week for several years of my Scout career, and I went off to other summer camps, for comparison, I guess.  Each better or not so in some respects, but I do remember helping to build that camp.  Came back to it many years later, the cabin had all but returned to the earth, the capped spring had been dug out (county ordinance, I guess. It had been bought and , at least in part, turned into a religious retreat center.... 

    Sadly to many Adults and Scouts see summer camp as summer school. We did something very similar in 2020 when covid shut down camps.. While the Scouts had fun and enjoyed themselves,  when offered to do it again, they declined because they want those MBs. And one of my adults said doing your own camp is a waste of time because you are missing out on MBs.

    But I have some good memories, and so do the Scouts.

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  16. And when you tell the new BSA indoctrinated leaders how it should be, they do not believe you, make excuses on why it won't work, or tell you Scouting gotta change with the times.

    Sad thing is National seems more focused on Advancement, than building young adults physically, mentally, and morally. Just look at the questions on various social media about Boards of Review. Yes it is not a retesting. BUT it is a way to insure requirements were completed, and if problems arise a chance for them to fix it. But any appeal nowadays automatically gives it to them saying, "you do not penalize the Scout for the mistakes of the adults." They praise councils that did online MB colleges giving away thousands of MBs.  And I can go on.

    Yes, BP did not like professional cadre. Only professional I can think of that he liked was William "Green Bar Bill" Hillcourt, and probably becasue he was not only a Scout, but lived theScouting life, trying out his ideas with his troop to see what worked and didn't work. Just like BP did in 1907 on Brownsea Island.

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  17. Extremely heartbreaking. And I am glad he is Brave enough to answer truthfully.

    The answer we usually get to that question is that current YP policies not only treat 18-20 year olds as essentially useless, but also requires them to give up their friends outside of Scouting. They feel National has no respect for their abilities (I'd rather a bunch of 18-20 year olds ASMs to brand new, just crossed over former Cub Scout leaders), and to ask them to give the friends they have made in school, Scouts, church, etc is ridiculous.

  18. 58 minutes ago, InquisitiveScouter said:

    I'll reserve judgment until I read their plan for implementation.

    There is a chance (albeit a very slight one, IMHO) that national may have an elegant solution.

    I know, I know... I'm laughing at what I just wrote, too.

    A Scouter can dream, can't he?

    12534355.jpg

     

    17 minutes ago, MattR said:

    This is going to be an auto pay nightmare. Who knows when a scout quits? What happens if a scout misses a payment? I can't imagine what the service will be like. It was hard enough dealing with Comcast.

    Yes a nightmare. My questions include

    1. What if a Scout is on a council/unit scholarship?

    2. What if a Scout is part of an insurance program (1/2 my Scouts fill out a form and health insurance pays the fees)?

    3. What is a Scout pays the fee, but the unit does not reregister on time, or even drops?

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  19. 17 hours ago, dk516 said:

    The other big thing at least in our GSUSA Council: you go an volunteer for one of their program events, you pay nothing as a volunteer because you already volunteer your time and training and usually if your own kids attend, they get at least 50% off or most likely to attend for free as well. 

    Interesting. Back in the day when BSA stopped doing that, at least in the council I was in at the time,  I was told by the powers that be that United Way was getting on them because other agencies charged their volunteers.

  20. 26 minutes ago, AwakeEnergyScouter said:

    Right. Thank you for checking.

    So the documents taken as a whole do contradict each other if interpreted literally, but I think the very clear and explicit permission in the AAG ought to take preference because it makes sense to let cubs practice in gentle waters given the adventures they have, because it's so explicit and clearly not a mistake or mis-inference of a single word or something like that, and because official BSA channels keep transmitting the information in the AAG rather than the one line in the GTSS.

    If this used to be forbidden, then it seems likely the one line in GTSS is simply a leftover. 

    I check my sources, I check policies, and I keep current on training. I plan outings months in advance to make sure they are safe and well thought out. I even sew on badges ASAP. Because I'm prepared, as an example for the scouts. 

    The challenge will be IF there is an accident, and some accidents occur despite the planning, and lawyers get involved, insurance will be looking for ways to not cover you. Sad but true. And the GTSS is suppose to trump all other documents.

    Me personally tubeing OK as that is explicit, boating, I would stick to calm water.

  21. @AwakeEnergyScouter,

    Thank you very much for the links. I noticed that the publications and sources you are cited are 2020 -2023. THIS MAY BE EXCELLENT NEWS FOR CUB SCOUTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (This time I am shouting, in  joy ;)  )  I stress the may be (is bold better?) because the current, online  Guide to Safe Scouting stills says "Cub Scout activities afloat are limited to council, district, pack, or den events that do not include moving water or float trips (expeditions)."  Plus your sources do state:

    "• Cub Scouts do not participate in aquatics activities on moving water, such as river canoeing or whitewater sports." (2020)

    But the 2022 article states.

    "But what about canoeing, kayaking or row boating on still water — water that is calmer than Class I rapids? Yes, but Lions and Tigers are allowed to be passengers only."

     

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