Jump to content


  • Content Count

  • Joined

  • Last visited

  • Days Won


Everything posted by Eagle94-A1

  1. OUTSTANDING! And don't worry about it being "impressive." If they are in regalia, and the team knows it's lines, it will impress.
  2. While my document is out of date, it is posted on a BSA website. I do not believe yours is a BSA website. Don't you love BSA's attention to detail? Reminds me of when BSA banned Dodgeball, stating it has never been an approved activity, yet one BSA website still listed Dodgeball, and its variations, as approved games.
  3. Actually the national OA committee, when they made the decision to no longer allow Native American Themed Arrow of Light and Cross Over Ceremonies consisted of 63 people. Only 3 were Youth. The rest were adults. The 3 consisted of the National Chief, National Vice Chief, and one other youth. So only 4.8% of the committee were youth. And when one of those members was pressed to comment on the changes, he stated "No Commented." and walked away. I don't think the youth wanted the change.
  4. Considering the National Supply Division, the ones who sell the uniforms, is still stating that Webelos can still wear the Blue Uniform, I think that the new rule will be overruled with the next handbook printing, which the way things are going will probably be in 2022 or 2023. https://mediafiles.scoutshop.org/m2pdf/6568_103111_Web_UniformInspSheet_R11.pdf
  5. I would not worry about it. As @The Latin Scot stated, the change to Webelos being "required" to wear the tan and green uniform is extremely recent. It went into effect August 1, 2018, when Cub Scouts went coed and the new books came out. And it has been ignored because there is a reason why Webelos had the option for either uniform since August 1, 1984. here's the story Somebody at National actually got it right. Families were complaining about Cubs out growing uniforms by 5th grade (at the time Cub Scouts was 3 years. Tiger Cubs was a separate program for 2nd graders). They were spending a lot of money for a new uniform that may be worn only for a year. There were enough complaints that national decided to give Webelos the option of either uniform, in an attempt to save families money. August 1, 1984 was when the policy went into effect, although "Dink and Duff" stated advertising the option in the June issue of Boy's Life if memory serves. I remember that because I was in the first group to wear the tan and green. As others have stated, "vintage uniforms" are still authorized. Heck my sons wore my old Carolina Blue Webelos hat.
  6. While NA regalia is still allowed, there is a push to do away with it. I loaned out my regalia to my chapter when I was CA, and let them continue to borrow it. But since we only had a AOL and Cross Over Ceremonies Team, and the youth decided that they will not use thd new ceremonies, I got my regalia back.
  7. Trust me, I love revenue neutral. When I do training, that is my goal. Part of my problem is that I took over events that were going in the red every year. And I don't mean a few dollars, but hundreds of dollars. I am surprised the person who was in charge remained in the position as long as they did because they always went over budget. I found out other events were subsidizing ours.
  8. We have been told, and I do agree to an extent, to budget 10% of actual cost for emergencies/last minute unexpected costs. Last minute things do come up. We will go into it if needed, and it gets council off our back. Until you have major emergency/last minute unexpected costs. Because of our DE, I had to not only use all of the emergency funds, but I went into the red for an event I was running. First he didn't order the patch numbers I requested, and a second order had to be done. if he would have ordered what I wanted, the price per patch dropped, AND he would not have to pay shipping twice. So the costs were significantly higher than budgeted. Worse part is I got the patches 6-8 months AFTER the event. Second, he didn't order all of the custom supplies I needed, and didn't tell me about it until the last minute. So I was making calls to find the stuff I needed, and having to pay a premium to get it made in time for the event. So those budgeted items cost twice as much as planned. The last thing he did was put a third event at the camp the same weekend as mine. Neither I nor the 2nd events chair wanted the 3rd event as A) it would take up space needed for the first 2 events and B) it was so extremely poorly advertised that when I contacted the office about the event being on the calendar, no one knew about it and I told them to take it off the calendar AND told my Cub Scout folks it was a misprint in the calendar as the camporee was scheduled for that weekend at the location. A week before my event, I sas told very firmly the Cub Scout event would be going on despite both event chairmen saying there was no room for the event.. So I had to go and buy a bunch of supplies the day of the event to mark out parking areas for Cub Scouts and the camporee/ training folks, Signs to designate Cub Scout and Scout areas of the camp, create an off limits area around one campsite a troop would be using that was smack dab in the middle of the Cub Scout event that I could not move, etc. Ironic part of the Cub event was only 4 people showed up because of the poor advertising, and 2 were there with the Scouts.
  9. That's because most units go to summer camp, and need in order to have a swim test qualify for camp IF THE AQUATICS DIRECTOR APPROVES (camps for emphasis) ADs can reject the form if they desire. But a unit can perform a swim test for their own unit activities.Hence the BSA's Aquatics Supervision book which is the reference for the Guide to Safe Scouting policies. As for having SSD and SA as the bare minimum, that is one reason why their is a push for the Aquatics Supervision courses to become the new minimum.
  10. Summer camps have national standards that they need to meet in order to be accredited. If memory serves, swimming ability certification is part of the process, and the guidelines to meet the standard are set by national. Thus any camp that allows for pre-camp swim tests has to use the national form i posted. Units do not have to follow those standards, but they do have to follow SSD and SA guidelines. The NCABSA link is the chapter on Swim tests coming from this book. https://www.scoutshop.org/bsar-aquatics-supervision-guide-2019.html this book is the recommended book for units to use, and it has everything needed for the Aquatics Supervision courses. CURRENTLY SSD and SA are the bare minimum required for units to do aquatic activities. I have been told both times i took the Aquatics Supervision courses, in 2014 and in 2019, that national is considering making the Aquatics Supervision courses the bare minimum needed.
  11. Any adult with Safe Swim Defense (SSD) training (which is online) can administer the test. Plus that training is required to do any aquatics activity. Personally I would want a certified Lifeguard of any age or anyone of any age with the Aquatics Supervision Safe Swimming there as well. I would say 95% of all of my rescues I have ever done were during swim tests. Someone with actual water training is a must IMHO. And since this is a boating activity, Safety Afloat is needed as well, which is also online. EDITED: But I would prefer some folks, Scout or adult, with kayaking experience, including rescues be present too. NO. Not only do the Scouts need to be classified, but every parent and sibling present must take a swim test. Some of the things I have seen done is doing the swim test in at a local facility meeting requirements, basically deep enough so that it is over their head, and they have to make at least one turn. I have done it in a inground backyard pool that was six feet deep, but the Scout was under 6'. And they had to do lots of laps AND not touch the bottom. ONLY if they are going to a council summer camp. Any adult with SSD can administer the test for unit activities. But for summer camp, they need to be credentialed. here is the link to the Aqautics Manual https://www.ncacbsa.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/04/bsa_swim_classification_test.pdf Here is the link to the summer camp Swim Test Form that national published: https://filestore.scouting.org/filestore/outdoor program/aquatics/pdf/430-122.pdf What I find ironic is that for a unit swim test, an adult with SSD can do the test. BUT for summer camp, a certified Lifeguard, Swimming Instructor, or BSA Aquatics Supervisor: Swimming & Water Rescue can do the test. I was a lifeguard and swimming instructor at 16.
  12. If this is a Scouting trip, then EVERYONE (emphasis), Scouts, parents, and siblings must follow Safe Swim Defense and Safety Afloat rules. Since everyone will be solo in a kayak or paddleboard, YES EVERYONE INCLUDING PARENTS AND SIBLINGS MUST BE CLASSIFIED AS A SWIMMER! ( bold and caps are emphasis). It does not matter whether it is a BSA outfitter or not. If your troop is putting it on you MUST follow Safe Swim Defense and Safety Afloat. https://www.scouting.org/health-and-safety/gss/toc/
  13. I remember when a Lifeguard Instructor was classified as a Non-Swimmer because he did not go to summer camp that year, and thus did not take a swim test in time for the troop's canoe trip. No annual swim test, no longer classified as a Swimmer. Luckily at the time, non-swimmers could still do boating activities with a certified Lifeguard. So I rode with the 16 year old Lifeguard I had certified prior to summer camp. And there is a reason for doing swim tests annually. I know that after my first accident, the one where I was in a leg brace for 3 months and gained 60 pounds, I could not pass a swim test if I had tried. And the only thing that allowed me to pass the swim test after the second accident was the 6 to 7 months of physical therapy.
  14. I think that is one reason why the council is failing. We have folks going to out of council shops because we get better service or have more customer friendly hours. Plus they are tired of orders "not arriving at the office" or being lost. Best example of that is the Eagle application that was mailed and "never received." I know some folks have stopped giving FOS not only because of the increases in National fees, but also they are not seeing any benefits. They never see their DE, we are unable to get in the schools, which the DE should be working on and hasn't, When volunteers try to do their own recruiting, they are told to stop. In fact multiple events have been interfered with when the pros intervene (basically saying "No you cannnot do this" and "yes this will happen despite everyone's objections", etc as opposed to actually being there. And the interference is causing longtime volunteers to quit and/or focus solely on their units. Which has caused a lot of problems i.e. training, putting on events, etc. I think that is why only 35% of the units go to the council camp. The staff's attitude is not customer friendly, like campers are an inconvenience. Equipment and supplies are wholly inadequate. I have seen rescue equipment fall apart while used for training lifeguards and Lifesaving MB, not enough boats for everyone to do boating activities during their time, and not enough supplies that the Scouts paid for to the point that Scouts are "sharing" kits needed for various MBs. As for program, well it's a MB giveaway. I had Scouts earn MBs that could not do the skills, and 1 Scout earn a MB that he never went to class because he switched on Sunday to another. Folks have complained for years about the problems, and nothing is done to make the situation better. Sadly I wish my council realized I and my Scouts were their customer.
  15. Would you mind editing my post too? Change the name I used to zzzzz.
  16. This letter is so much BS and zzzzzzzz should know better. He was a SE in a council in which his immediate predecessor did retaliate against those who questioned him. One district level volunteer was placed in the Ineligible Volunteer Files, not for any YP violation, but because he questioned the SE. Zzzzzzzz know it happens.
  17. In my professional opinion as a former lifeguard instructor and swimming instructor, I think they should be EXTREMELY RARE (emphasis). I taught swimming to physically and mentally handicapped kids. It may be more difficult. they may not make "First Class, First Year," but I have seen kids and adults with these handicaps do it. Anytime we try to "shortcut" advancement, we are not helping the Scouts.
  18. Yep, Sea Scouts were officially Sea Explorers from sometime in the 1960s/early 70s until 1998. However, in my ship we still called ourselves Sea Scouts, every "Sea Explorer" I met outside of my ship called themselves a Sea Scout, and if memory serves, Sea Scout was used in Sea Explorer literature. Both the First Class Anchor and Exploring Anchor (below) were used. During the Sea Explorer phase you had traditional ships that used the traditional Sea Scout program, and non-traditional ships (like mine) that did they own thing like Explorer posts. the unofficial terms Blue Fleet and Red Fleet to describe the two types of ships. The Small Boat Handler and Qualified Seaman badges were developed for the non traditional ships. Advancement was still around and anyone could earn it, but it was a lot harder to earn in a non-traditional ship. I only got as far as Ordinary before diving into the OA.
  19. My council is in a similar situation financially, and are looking to sell properties. I did not attend the town hall meeting last night, but I had friends that did. One of the slides was the 2019 cost per camper for the 4 council camps. Let's just say the data is HEAVILY skewed against one local camp. They included a $50,000 new road into the camp in "Maintenance" when it should have been a capital expense. The old road was washed out and caused the camp to be inoperable for 6 months. Second the council only used the 2019 camp attendance. Since that camp was closed for 6 months, there were no day camps, weekend camp outs, or district camporees. So the attendance was much lower than usual. Council is trying to make it appear the camp is burden.But what is ironic is if they used the past 3-5 year data, the camp is the most used, and least costly camp. In fact the camp brings n more money than needed to support itself. It is the only council camp that Cubs can go boating at since the other camps are on rivers. And because of its location, a major metropolitan area is within 45 minutes of the camp. It's just the metro area is in another council, for the moment.
  20. My council has a history of not following national policy. For a very long period of time, NO ONE was trained in the nationally required training for volunteers to run district and council cub scout weekend camp outs. They have allowed Cubs to go canoeing in the rivers at 2 of the councils camps. And they have never published an official guide where Packs cam camp at. So many packs use the OA's "Where To Go Camping" book to select campgrounds outside of the council properties.
  21. My Council is truly screwed up. We are having a series of Town Hall meetings to go over the challenges we are facing. They have mentioned they may need to sell properties. Looks like they are trying to argue that the oldest camp in the council, the only camp that Cubs can do boating activities at needs to be sold. They are using 2019 data to show that it cost almost $60 per camper to operate the camp, whereas the other camps cost $16-18 per camper to operate. I love statistics While there stats are correct, they are missing some important factors. 1. the camp was shut down for 6 months, so no day camps, camporees, or weekend camping was allowed. and 2. the road was washed out and had to be rebuilt costing $50K. Instead of being "maintence" it should have been part of "Capital" since the repair was a one time expense. taking out the $50K, the cost is about $10.50/ camper. I am so fed up.
  22. Let him cross over and get him to swim lessons! Summer camps have good swim lessons. I was one of those Scouts who could not swim. I was terrified of the water because I did in fact drown. One minute I am jumping into a raft and missing it. landing into the water and not able to stay afloat, and the next I am in the house, on the floor coughing up water with someone over me that was doing CPR. I had enjoyed Cub Scouts, and was looking forward to Scouts. And my Mom gave me an ultimatum, learn to swim or get out. Swim lessons at the YMCA were challenging until the swim instructor worked with me during his break between classes, and got me swimming. Swimming is a life skill that is needed.
  23. Councils are suppose to support units, not units support the council. Focus on your existing Cub Scouts and families. If your council is offering online signups, make sure someone in the pack STAYS ON TOP OF YOUR COUNCIL!!!!!!!!!!!!!! There was 1 year where the DE did not coordinate with the packs, he did it all for them, and it was a major charley foxtrot. Compounding that issue was A. a minor hurricane that caused packs not to meet and B. a major district Cub Scout event called Cubmobile. Cubmobile is the first event these new Cubs went to, and no one knew what packs they signed up for. We had Cubs signed up with one Pack, and ended up actually joining another pack they met at the Cubmobile. Charter that year was a mess. Can you meet outside? What about dens meeting at folk's home? And Webelos Dens, with properly trained adults (Pre2019 WeLOT and BALOO or 2019 BALOO) can camp with out the pack, and that is something I recomend: camping by den to get them use to Scouts BSA. Most families understand things beyond your control FORGET JOURNEY TO EXCELLENCE AND FOCUS ON KEEPING THE PACK ALIVE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (Emphasis) While JTE is used to judge qualities of units, districts, and councils, this not a normal year. It is more important that the pack survives
  24. We did our own program. We did an activity based program instead of MBs. Activities included Canoeing, Cycling, Emergency Preparedness and Wilderness Survival. We were super flexible. Our emergency preparedness drill and survival shelter building took a lot longer than planned. Cycling 22 miles wore them slammed out, and the afternoon was spend chilling out, advancement sign offs, and SM Conferences (5 total). #1 complaint was no showers, they had to use spigots in the campsite. The PVC shower they created fell apart while the first scout was in it. So far no problems.
  • Create New...