Brewmeister

I wasn't asked to write one for my son' date=' BUT parents are always called in to EBOR's to talk with the Board in our District.[/quote']

 

And in our district both I and my wife wrote letters for our son, but we were not allowed in the EBOR. Not a lot of standardization on things it would seem.

Having looked at it a bit, I kind of liking the Superior Hiking Trail. It doesn't have the fees and difficulty of access of Isle Royale, and the group size is more flexible.

The boys are supposed to be leading the planning charge but it's always good to have a few ideas to give them to start with. They chose Pictured Rocks last year and loved it, and Superior seems like it would be a similar experience but unique in its own way.

We'll see what they decide!

Any more ideas keep them coming.

We'd like to find a place where we are backpacking to a different site every day, and my impression from having researched Devil's Lake and Black River is that they are plop-camp, then day-hike.

As the title says...something that would constitute a multi-day backpacking trip...4 or 5 days of actual hiking.

We've backpacked in the Sylvania Wilderness, Porcupine Mountains, and Pictured Rocks national lakeshore.

The idea of Isle Royale has been tossed about.

Looking for any other suggestions to toss out to the boys to chew over, that they/we might not have thought of.

One time my son, then first class, met an older scouter who asked him his rank (he had a jacket on). When my son told him, the scouter asked the boy if he had read all of his scout handbook. My son said no. The scouter said, "How can you be a first class scout if you don't know the handbook?"

Or something to that effect...it wasn't said as bluntly as I have written it. But, it made an impression. He has since read the handbook cover to cover, several times, and puts what he has read to use--occasionally correcting me. :-)

Update #2 on this thread.

Another year later, and another backpacking trip in. 5 days this time. Again another small group (6 scouts) but interest is there.

Most encouragingly is the impact on the way the troop camps. The boys chose to do a walk-in (one mile) weekend camp last spring instead of plop camping because they wanted to try out all the "cool backpacking stuff." Even the troop trailer hans't been hauled out of the shed for a weekend camp for over a year. Everyone agrees it's "just so much easier" having each patrol take a tote out with their gear, and not setting up the giant dining fly. Not to mention that no one likes hauling the trailer anyway.

At our last committee meeting we decided to sell the massive two-burner camp stove with the 20lb propane tanks because "nobody has used that in 2 years."

There's still a lot of progress yet to be made but the boys have taken to the model, in large part because they realize that the most fun happens when you're away from the parking lot, as evidenced by the stories that get told at troop meetings by the boys who were off hiking in the wilderness for a week.

 

Wow, really? I wonder what new Leadership lessons he learned in his third year in the same POR?

Maybe he learned how to get really, really good at it, and was so effective at it that his Den was thrilled to have him around for 3 years. Maybe he encouraged other scouts in his troop to be Den Chiefs as well. Maybe he was instrumental in helping those boys bridge over to the troop too. Maybe he even earned his Den Chief Service award, which takes more than a standard "6-month POR" to earn. Just maybe, eh?

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I think the OP gave up after not getting 100% of people to validate his/her position

LED lamps are very durable and battery-friendly. Plus, they do not light up a campsite like a NFL stadium.

There are a lot of good ideas in here. As CM and DL, I always stressed to the boys and the parents that Cub Scouting was about fun and family and that they were going to "advance" at the end of the year. When we had our crossover at the end of the year we did it for every rank and all boys got what they earned, and the Pack also provided the new neckerchiefs and books. We tried to hold this at a park with a bridge. So a Wolf scout would cross the bridge to being a Bear and receive his necker and book. If he also earned his Bear badge he was recognized for that as well. So, all scouts were recognized for their individual achievements, and all scouts that participated in the program achieved something.

I told the crew that it was a "dry" trip (adults and youth) since we are a US scout troop, and nobody questioned it. Sometimes you can overthink things, but it's good to be prepared, so to speak.

I already responded to the duplicate thread created by the OP but having read this one...

HOLY COW!

KarenMcV, I've had parents like you in my den. Never happy about anything, constantly complain, aren't there when decisions are made, then grumble some more.

It's easy to complain. It's hard to actually make a positive contribution. So try making one--go help the DL if you think you can do it better or cheaper, but if you approach him/her anywhere like you've approached the people who ANSWERED YOUR QUESTION here, don't be surprised if you get a frosty response....

It's higher than our den dues when I was a DL but not out of line. And even though we charged den dues to cover supplies (which, has been pointed out, rarely did completely, and I spent $100s out of pocket), we also needed to charge for "special" supplies, such as building model rockets.

It sounds like the DL discussed this with parents in attendance and didn't simply make a unilateral decision (which he certainly could have).

If you have further concerns about it, possibly you could offer to be the supply coordinator or treasurer, or help shop sales to keep costs down.

 

BSA has the double edged sword of not only respectful of others' religion (reverent) but also the duty to God in the oath issue. That is a focus on the scout himself.

 

Stosh

And that troublesome Pledge of Allegiance thing too.

It's kind of funny that, for all the complaining that goes on in these forums about boys supposedly not really practicing all this scout stuff and pencil-whipping their way through the program, it's all okey-dokey to kinda sorta overlook all this messy God stuff just to get folks in the program. OH NO! Please don't emphasize any of this "Duty to God" stuff even though it's right there front and center in the Oath! As long as we say it really fast and scouts are kinda sorta ok with it even if they don't really believe it that's just ok and we won't really bring it up too much in case we annoy people or lose our meeting space.

We should just go down the line of stuff and take out all the objectionable bits:

"Honor" and "Doing my duty?" No way, we don't want to scare kids off with all that honor and duty stuff. And "Duty to Country" really sounds militaristic...scares off all kinds of people and might not appeal to certain demographics. Let's start talking about "rights" instead.

"Helping other people at all times?" Meh, that's so old-school.

"Physically fit." I guess we better stop complaining here about all the overweight scouts and scouters, and so?

"Morally straight." Well, we've already shown that morality is malleable in the program. As kids like to say, "Don't judge."

There, wasn't that easy? Now we can recruit all kids of kids. It's gonna be awesome!

I've been involved with many cub round ups in my involvement in the district. In every one of them, we say "Scouting is a faith-based program. You must believe in a higher power to be part of this program." Perhaps we lose some scouts because of it but so be it. The program is what it is and pretending it is something it is not is disingenuous, as I stated. To hide the "Reverent" part of scouting, and the "Duty to God" that is a clear and unequivocal part of the Scout Oath simply to gain access to facilities and recruiting would indeed be a "bait and switch."

Scouting includes duty to God as a core component. To hide that duty under a rock just to gain access to a meeting place would be rather disingenuous. It's really not a matter of "debate."

I have a question as it relates to a Venturing crew that is doing some international travel. If it matters, on this particular trip we happen to have 1-to-1 parent/youth ratio. (Each crew member has exactly one parent along.)

The BSA guidelines on alcohol consumption are clear--"It has no place in the scouting program." However as you know, different locations outside the US have different attitudes toward alcohol consumption and some countries have lower drinking ages, etc.

Just in case any questions come up about this, I was trying to figure out how to answer them. In doing research I found some documents at different councils that recognize the situation and that units in other countries may operate differently but don't provide any guidance.

I see "no place" in the G2SS as being clear--we're a US-based Venturing crew so nobody should be doing any drinking, adults or youth even if legally allowable. Thoughts?

If the rest of life ran the way that some people here believe scouting should be run, we'd all have to turn in our high school diplomas because we no longer remember 100% of high school geometry, and nobody would ever graduate without getting perfect marks on all their tests in every subject. Scouting advancement is about displaying a broad-based competency in a variety of different situations. It's ok to forget stuff, and to need to consult and re-consult the handbook from time to time.

I have to admit that I had a different sound in mind when I read the title about "old goat music."

Biblical themes and references occur frequently in Peanuts comic strips. Examples are pretty easy to come by. Correlation does not necessarily equal causation, but...

It's funny because my counter keeps going up' date=' yet there are no new messages in there.[/quote']

 

Same here...one time it showed a "1" and when there was nothing there I assumed that was just the default icon for the message feature. But now it shows "3." They must be messages in another dimension.

My message counter (upper right corner) has a number in a red box that seems to imply a message would be waiting, but no messages are there.

????

If the committee, leaders, and CM are all on the same page, your problem is 99% solved. Just make the program what you want. Take charge. Particularly since you don't have a bona fide CO that the CC can go complain to, the problem will most likely take care of itself.

I was in a similar situation as a CM years ago. Dealt with a do-nothing CC and everything came to me as CM. So, I focused on the program and had all the den leaders (who I or the previous CM had recruited) on board. Started calling monthly leader meetings. Anything that wasn't "program" that needed to be done I put in her lap. Friends of Scouting? "See the Committee Chair." Question from the bank? See the committee chair. Communique from district? Forward to the committee chair. Etc etc etc.

Eventually the CC said she didn't have time to do the job and needed to resign. We presented her a nice service award at the next Blue and Gold. Everybody was a winner and she went out on what she thought were her terms.

Most of the people and groups doing the public baying have little or no actual involvement with the program and have almost no concern for the actual unit functions.

Most of the people doing the public baying have a visceral hatred for Scouting and would simply like to see it go away. Always look at the big picture. Evil is very, very patient.