chrisking0997

I've alway wanted to wear them all at one time, kind of like having an arm band of the things, because why not? Not supposed to do it, though, and it seems to me a bit braggadocios. 

I ran across a scouter a few years ago at summer camp that did just that.  Guy had at least 8 of them going up his sleeve.  I really should have taken a picture but I was too stunned

at the risk of getting ripped a new one, let me just add to the general consensus that it would be best if you release whatever attachment you have to your unit number, along with the less than $50 and camping/fishing gear, and move to create a new unit elsewhere with the members and leaders you have.  Hemming and hawing is wasting valuable time...you are NOT going to be able to change this situation with your current CO.  That may upset you but its just the cold hard truth.  and yes, its very unfair.

while Im offering opinions I wasnt asked for, I think you were a little hard on the Beaver, Ward...

my son is having his ECOH in a week and a half....part of it will be an OA ceremony (consisting of the team leading him to the stage and reading an OA ceremony script that includes the meaning of eagle, candle lighting, etc).  All other aspects of the ceremony are troop related, such as master of ceremony and honor guard/flag detail, etc.  In our troop, each ceremony is different based on the boy's wishes and they borrow bits and pieces from each one to make their own unique

I feel your pain...in the same boat as we speak.  Second time doing this for summer camp and made the mistake of thinking the adults would take responsibility for their own while I take care of mine.  So now with two weeks to go I am chasing parents to get it done ASAP.  I can only say hopefully you learn lessons and develop a process that makes your job easier next time

lifes gonna hit these kids hard if they think taking 10 minutes to fill out an app and 30 minutes to take an online course is too much of a hassle and is taking the fun out of everything.   Or are we saying theres more to their complaint than that?

Beyond the adult tendency to take charge, BSA presently has no training that discusses even half of the Patrol Method or has as its objective that the trainee learn what makes up the Patrol Method.  The results are hardly surprising.  

 

However, there are people in the upper echelons of BSA who are advocating for the Patrol Method and for training in the Patrol Method.  

agreed.  Maybe national could find the time to create meaningful online training for the boys instead of seeing how convoluted they can make adult training.   And no, I did not manage to type that out with a straight face

I wanted to inspire some conversation about this, and you guys did not disappoint (I love this board).  I left the details out because I didnt want it to sway the debate.   So heres the deal:  scout was taking the Personal Fitness MB.  He's an active kid and has no problem with physical activity, but has no interest in sports or any career related to fitness.  His first attempt at answering the question (via written correspondence since the MB counselor is rarely available...a pet peeve for another time) was woefully inadequate, and included the "not interested" comment.  Scout was advised to go back and try again.  I advised him similar to some of the feedback here, to expand further on his answers and to pick a career that he could come up with reasons why it might be interesting even if he had no interest.  He did so, but expressed to me that his "im not interested" answer was true so why should he have to expand further.  It got me to thinking as to why that part is even on the requirement (why not just leave it at researching the education and training needed), and why we would require a scout to answer that question differently if we are not supposed to add or subtract to the requirements.

My personal take is that the answer was valid, but I would have probably engaged the scout to understand why he gave that answer.  After all, it is basically asking him to give his opinion on the subject.

As a merit badge counselor I would not accept it.  From the cooking merit badge which I counsel that has such a requirement:

1. Food-related careers. Find out about three career opportunities in cooking. Select one and find out the education, training, and experience required for this profession. Discuss this with your counselor, and explain why this profession might interest you.

I would make the scout have a full conversation with me.  But mostly I would not accept it.  If scout is absolutely not interested in that career at all, why did he select it out of all the possibilities for a career in that field to spend his time researching?  If he did research.  (Read that as skeptical.)  I find sometimes the scouts will test to see if I am a pushover or not.

 

In school this type of work is a "F or D".  Teachers don't put up with it.

interesting so far.  Im focusing specifically on the "explain why this profession might interest you" part.  If the scout did all the previous portion of the requirement with the counselor, and the scout believes he is answering honestly with "it does not interest me", is that good enough?  After all, the requirement does not state "find out about three career opportunities, at least one of which interests you" or "hypothetically discuss with your counselor why this career might interest you".  Further, if the scout has zero interest in the subject, why is his honest answer not good enough?

Is "It does not interest me" a valid answer?   curious as to others thoughts on this

thanks

We use TroopMaster and Mytroop in one of my troops, Scout Track in another.  My previous pack used Packmaster, and Im still deciding what the pack I just started will use.  The more I look at the options, the more I feel that there isnt one cookie cutter solution out there, but rather many products that fill needs based on the dynamics of your unit.

I did just check the Scoutbook site, and I appears BSA has been busy rebranding them since the acquisition.

BSA didn't already have 80 years' worth of files on women who had sex with Scouts when they made that decision. 

and, strangely, the previous policy did NOTHING to prevent those 80 years of files.  I dont recall reading anything that says sex with a minor is now an approved activity, or that it will be treated any differently than any of the other cases in those 80 years of files (in fact, the policy changes of the last 10-20 years make it likely that those incidents will be dealt with as harshly as they should be)

A gigantic meeting is grandstanding and unnecessary, and will become a circus when half the parents that show up are actually on Grizzly Mama's side.  It's just ill advised.

obviously mom needs a timeout and the troop (boys and adults) need to see that behavior like that will not go unaddressed.  And rude boy prob needs to be counseled in some way too but that probably should have happened during camp.  So no excuses all around.  That said, if a gigantic meeting is ill advised because there may be parents that are on crazy mom's side...well, then there might be some truth to her complaint about how the troop handles bad behavior.  So my advice to the OP would be to have a good self-examination of the troop (after the camp issue is dealt with)...seems like something the PLC should tackle at their next meeting

Ive tried to type out several replies, and find myself uncomfortable with every one.  I truly do not wish ill for this man...if his claims are true then he has my sympathy.  I dont mean to question his motives, but rather what a sastisfactory outcome would be.  He doesnt seem to just be in this for the money, as far as I can tell from the article.  If his claims are true then I hope he gets what he wants as thats whats really important here.

I get the statute. I don't get someone not saying anything given all the time that they had.

 

As for this guy I don't get waiting two years after the statute change to file. Case prep maybe?

the cynic in me agrees with your suspiscion of the timing.  I can understand the law's intent of getting justice for victims...just not sure how justice can be served in a case where no complaint was made, no record of the incident was made and the perpetrator is dead.  Moreso, Id imagine most of the leadership of that council and even BSA from 40 years ago are either dead or close to it.  Its generally agreed that BSA had its issues with this subject during the time in question, but theyve made great strides in working to eradicate abuse from the organization.  Other than money, Im just stumped at what the expectation of justice is in this case.  Im extremely sympathetic, but not sure what this will accomplish

this issue definitely highlights how terrible the structure of the BSA organization is. 

my thoughts reading this is, why did the SM, CC and DE let those ASM's go on as they did without asking them to rein in their attitudes and not make it a contest to see who can break all 12 points of the scout law first (by my count, they only had "Thrifty" left)?  With that many ASMs who are clearly NOT there for the boys (sounds more like they are there for THEIR boys) and a neutered SM/CC/Committee, you are going to better off anywhere but there.  The unfortunate part is that it sounds like they are not going to let this go, and I will be surprised if this is the last you hear of them making trouble for you.  Good luck...youre gonna need it

 The forms/calendars/etc. I have created for the boys are Excel Spreadsheets that they can readily modify.  If they put their patrol ID in a certain cell, it populates the form with all the boys from that patrol, etcl  They pick a menu item ID, it populates a shopping menu, etc.  I just keep adding to the forms as I have time.  I used to do that sort of thing for work, now I do it for fun.

 

For all the boys that don't have Microsoft Excel, Open Office Calc works just as well, and that's free software that will work for any computer or smartphone..  Basically the boys put in the patrol ID, the menu ID and the number of boys going and it produces a shopping list for that meal.

kinda OT, but you just blew my mind with that spreadsheet example.  Imagine...the boys not having to recreate the wheel (meal planning in your example) every month...wow

not to nit pick too much, but the OP doesnt mention the ECOH....s/he says "Eagle advancement".   COH was mentioned as an example 3 posts later.   Not that I think it makes too much difference (who in their right mind writes what amounts to a blank check from an account that is not theirs with no receipts or accounting of the costs??  That way lies the dark side) and its probably a good assumption, but it would be nice to know if this is indeed for a COH or if they are actually saying to pay project costs, etc.

Like I said, its shouldnt matter though...you dont write checks for something without having some sort of accountability on what the money was used for.  OP is rightfully uncomfortable with it.  Id recommend advising the CC that going forward receipts will be required for expenses and that they can either abide by that sensible and ethical request or find someone else to fill the position.  "we've always done it that way" is not an excuse for doing something wrong (isnt it amazing that this is an argument you should be having with the boys, not the adults?!?)

thanks to everyone who chimed in on this thread so far.  I was hoping it would spark some spirited debate and was not disappointed.  Im still not sure where I fall on the issue as I can see both sides.

not your average birds and the bees talk.  Just wondering: who generally fills out the paperwork for Knots/adult awards?  My logical guess would be the committee chair, but are committee chairs supposed to keep track of how many roundtables you attended so you can get your Knot?  Is it wrong or bad form to submit the paperwork to the CC yourself? 

My humble self says yes.  Ive more than fulfilled the requirements for the Training Knot and as well I recently lead the creation of a new Pack, but I dont feel its my place to apply for my own awards (Im the CC of the new pack, so again not going to submit my own paperwork).  But I cant help but wonder how the 3rd World Generals I see walking around from time to time managed to accumulate so much flair without doing so.  Not that Im necessarily pineing to join that club, but part of me still feels that adult recognition is a good thing.  It just makes me wonder: why have adult recognition devices when its met with so much indifference? 

Unless they had a real good excuse (sudden death' date=' hospitalization, etc) That kid would not go camping with me again. The risk of being accused of something, or ending up in a bad situation is too great. You have to protect yourself. Plus, you are being used as a babysitter.[/quote']

 

this. BD, you seem to have some problem parents in your troop, not sure if its the usual suspects for all these issues. Regardless, Id say its time for a come-to-Jesus meeting with those parents, the CC, COR and you.

However, they are really into the Indian stuff --- mdancing, button blankets and such. Personally, I consider that a waste of time, at least for me. So I'm no longer considering being a volunteer.

 

Personally, I think OA should be based on providing service of any kind, and drop the Indian associations.

so, dont want to volunteer for service because they honor their traditions? not sure you get the concept behind OA. It almost sounds to me like you are offended by the NA "stuff", but I dont want to put words in your mouth.

Agree with ScoutNut...go to the Cubmaster and CC and get them involved.

this entire thread has me smackerdoodled

agreed....well said NJ. However, the fact remains that people do mix them up (I even realized just now that I mixed the terminology up, even though I knew what I meant but may have confused others). Perhaps I will retake the YPT course just to see what it says. Most likely, its a case of adults erring on the side of caution...I guess a little confusion is better than the alternative.

Im wondering though if the leader in the OP has gone camping with the cubs yet? Pretty sure a great number of cubs share a tent with their parental unit alone, and thats usually their bathroom buddy overnight. Wonder what they'll say about that.