Krampus

Respect in its many forms. From respect for authority, elders, each other, one's selt (obesity being in that grouping), etc. The common respect you used to see is gone; simply not there. Some call it old fashioned but looking someone in the eye, using their name, using Mr. or Mrs., shaking hands, etc. Just don't see that anymore....or rarely if ever.

Some localities will not allow camping without a tent. Odd, but true. But I suspect in some locations where west nile is abundant it has more to do with convenience of logistics not having to do a philmont fly + netting for 50+ scouts, as well as for health issues. To be honest I could go either way. I don't see a big deal about either.

Agreed. While there were instances of scouts coming out or scoutmasters being found out, I know my friends knew being gay in scouting was a non-starter.

I get all that. My questions was what criteria other than "I don't think he's ready because xxx" can be used? I ask because if there are no standard critera, such as are outlined in the GTA around what being "active" requires, then any scoutmaster recommendation (or denial) becomes arbitrary.

I highly doubt Scouters go around spouting gay hate speech in the course of doing their duty any more than they spout racial or religious hatred. Sure, there are likely those who feel that way. But I think most Scouters, regardless of their feelings on the subject, spout hate speech or actions in front of scouts.

Meh...you ae a bigt ont to throw people using tents or going on big trips under the bus, but when someone in a good spirited manner puts your own words back at you you get all a tizzy? MB is right, what a chip you have on your shoulder. You think nothing of diss'ing guys who have more than you. Weren't you the one who said certain jokes never get old when called out about "rich white guys"? It's a two way street brother. But understand something, those guys below were not making fun of you or being poor. They were using your anti-tent words against you in a fun-loving fashion.

Not for other awards like the Scouter Key, but I could see how someone would turn down a "purchased" knot. I know BSA says its not (or knot ), but when you donate money and they give you a knot, that's purchased in my book.

Tony for my money it comes down to a few things: 1) Be clear on what the boys will learn and make sure everyone gets through it. Completing TF and a good part of SC are important. Communicate that in your Leader Guide so that folks know what they can expect from your program. 2) Let the boys be hands on, go in depth on the skills taught and use EDGE. Don't just go through the motions. Make sure every kid can learn and demonstrate what they learned. 3) Be inclusive. Look for the kid who is shying away or trying to duck out. Make sure they have a buddy and are having fun. 4)

Was at a RT last month...saw a 15 year old Vigil member. I just had to laugh. Back in the day You could count the Vigil guys in our lodge on one hand and most of them were 17 nearly 18 and Eagles. There were 5, all barely 5ft, standing talking to each other. Trophies for everyone.

This sounds like it is similar to the "Scout Account" thread. There are issues about fund-raising and how that is accounted for and distributed. Since your unit is part of your CO you may run afoul of their 501©(3) status. Always best to run these ideas past your COR before you do them. If they don't know they certainly have an accountant who should.

My town hall was disappointing as well but mostly because leaders were reluctant to express their views in public. I think they may have been reluctant to "come out" on either side of the debate for fear of alienating friends and colleagues. The in-your-face fanatics on both sides have polarized this issue, and any decision, so much that whoever loses is going to feel slighted and oppressed. I have seen emails on both side of the debate. Some have been reasonable and some have been hateful. Par for the course.

Oh, I don't disagree at all. We have sort of a don't-ask-don't-tell policy now. I guess those who are against gays are somehow fooling themselves now that gay scouts don't exist and their son is not currently associating with them now. But given that current policy it sort of gives scouters an "out" if you will in that we are not supposed to ask or know if a scout is gay and, if he is, he has to leave. If this new policy goes into place that all changes and rises issues about what scouters should or should not do if they find out a scout is gay. [quote=MattR;n373527 I talked to my DE an

The only thing that changed was your undrstanding. To others it was pretty clear. This is a service he said his lodge provided but an adult who advises the lodge said no. What part about that do you not get? Let me make it easy on you. You drive to the scout shop and ask for a Tenderfoot patch. They tell you they have one but then the manager comes and says the badge is in the back and he does not feel like getting if for you. He's denied you a service the shop provides. Get it now? I'm done on this topic. You don't get it and that's fine. Have a blessed day.

Ok, I will take a crack at this. BD, you simply cannot read. Or maybe it is comprehension that is the issue. Did you miss the part where MB said that the unit-based service was something his lodge used to provide? Did you miss the fact that his scouts and he went through the proper channels to request this service? Did you miss the part where the scout in charge of the lodge said yes to their request by adult advisor said no? Did you miss the part where the higher level adult across all the lodges was also p.o.'d at the local loadge adult for not providing the service as requested? Did you mis

I'll point out the obvious: BSA is a private membership organization and the liability that adult leaders are exposed to is FAR more than that of a public school. Schools are covered by far more case law and statue than are private organizations. I have already heard of units with parents that have demanded that, should the policy go into effect, that their son be "kept away" from any gay Scouts. I have equally heard of other units where parents have said they will leave if the policy is not adopted. So with this polarization as a background, suppose a Scout comes out to a leader and says h

You act as if the RT leaders did this on purpose. What if they did a RT on water-based trips and your troop was full of non-swimmers? Would you feel equally indignant? RT is about disucssing topics of interest to units and sometimes that means discussing things that 50% or less of the units would even consider. Qwazse makes a good point of suggesting a topic of "budget memories" or perhaps something similar. But don't hate on other units because they are richer than yours. How would you like it if they hated on your unit because you weren't rich? BTW, love the "rich white boys" dig. Imagine

Agree with Wakib. Sounds like you did all you could and taught your scouts along the way. Well done.

Operationally this will be a nightmare to manage. What happens if the resolution is passed and now a Scout comes out? Do we disclose to the whole troop or keep it a secret? Do we tell the parents of the other Scouts in case they object to having their son sleep in a tent with an openly gay Scout? If we don't disclose to those parents, what liability do the adult leader run into in the event there is an incident? Passing this resolution without clearly guidelines on how to uniformly manage such situations leaves us the leaders open to all sorts of liability and political/social issues we a