Zahnada

Fred, Your purpose for posting this article is truly misled. I don't see how this offers any insight into BSA's opponents. I could go to a dozen hate sites, find articles that scream that all gays should be rounded up and executed because they defy God's plan. These sites would also offer up as evidence that AIDS is a biblical plague sent down to cleanse the Earth of the gay infection. But should I post such articles and say, "This is to remind us what the supporters of BSA's membership policy think"? Of course not. And anyone who does try to post such trash will be ripped apart by this f

About the "Banana/Bandana" skit, I don't know how it's performed where you are, but it was also banned in my parts. The reason being that the skit relies on a misunderstanding about whether the "magician" is talking about a banana or bandana. How was this misunderstanding created? Well, often, the boys made the "audience participant" into basically a retarded child who keeps messing up. I can see how the skit is offensive when it's performed in such a way. As for hungry scouts, I can't believe that's actually the rationale.

Depending on the ad, some companies can get their spot listed as a Public Service Announcement (PSA). Those are generally spots that are about a non profit (such as scouts), but they end with a "This message was brought to you by __________." If your council wants more TV advertising, I would suggest going the sponsored PSA route. It's great because your council gets an ad, the TV station gets money from the sponsor, the TV station also gets to help meet their requirement for showing PSAs, and the sponsor gets to attach their name to scouting while getting an ad and a tax break for donati

I get it! I get it! I've been trying to twist my head around what answer is actually being sought after, but now I get it! This isn't about rules or laws or civil disobedience. This is about hypocrisy. It's a hypocrisy that's inherent to the Boy Scouts because, try as we might, it's impossible to live fully by the Oath and Law. As humans, we are flawed and we will occasionally stray from the path. Scouts are held up as the pinnacle of moral integrity in our society. That's why the public finds it so fascinating when a scout does something atrocious. So let's return to the actual que

I used to play basketball quite a bit. I also coached a youth boy's team for several years and even refereed as a paying job for awhile. I officiated boys and girls grades 6-12. Moving without dribbling the ball while it is in your possession is against the rules. It is called travelling. If you break that rule and are caught, the ball is awarded to the other team (or, for those half-empty types, you are punished by losing the ball). Basketball is a confusing and challenging game to officiate because it's so fast paced (much like life if you want the analogy spelled out for you). N

If we're talking about people who didn't wear the correct uniform, we must not forget Five Star General Douglas MacArthur. I'd say there were probably sentimental reasons that he liked to wear his trademarked outfit. And he wasn't much one for following the rules either. Well, I don't know if it was a rule that he wasn't suppose to bomb bridges on the Yalu river border between North Korea and China. Or if there was an actual rule that he wasn't suppose to antagonize the Chinese by marching towards their border with an army of UN troops. If not rules, he certainly wasn't one to follow ord

I think Bob is dead-on with this issue. I would like to add a word of caution when resolving the situation. As a new scout, the last thing your son needs is for the other boys to have the impression that he's "ratted them out" or something. It's a tough and awkward age to survive in and if your SM decides to yell or lecture, it may only make life in the troop tougher for your son. I think the real lesson here is for your son. This is one of those issues that is best dealt with when it happens instead of after the fact. I actually think this will be a very important life lesson for

Bob and Ed, Here's how I interpret both of your positions in regards to the recent "be prepared" posts. Please correct me if I'm wrong (as I know both of you will Ed, I believe you're saying that as adult leaders, we must always be prepared for a variety of situations. Not only does it set a good example, but it's what any responsible scout or scouter would do. So, having some extra food and some spare matches or a large trash bag that can be converted to a poncho is helping keeping the boys safe. Just an extra precaution. Bob, I believe you're saying that we're not teaching th

Wait a minute. I'm all for learning experiences, but where's the line drawn between a "learning experience" and just "letting them fail?" We don't want the boys to fail. We want them to learn. Sure, we learn by our failure, but we also become upset, disinterested, and turned off to scouting by our failure. One outing of bad food and bad weather can make an 11 year old say, "Forget this! Video games are much more fun!" Now, am I advocating holding their hands? No. Do I expect that life should work out perfectly and everyone will be happy and content the whole time? No. But these comm

You're killing me, Packsaddle. You're killing me. Very well, I shall relent. I was wrong to use the term "thought experiment" because such an experiment lacks the usual criteria for being a "good experiment" (lack of control group, testable results, hypothesis, etc). I do apologize for any confusion wrought by such careless use of wording. Perhaps "thought game" or "thought experience" would be a better choice of semantics. I must say, I am surprised that you are the one getting into a war of wording with me. I just expected it from other people on this forum, but not you necessarily.

Dug, The problem with using logic to understand God is that God is not obligated to conform to our logic. Let's just take the belief that God is perfect. Meanwhile Man is not perfect. In fact, Man is so far from perfect that we cannot even begin to comprehend the state of perfection let alone the thought process of something that is perfect. It is beyond our mental capacity to interpret what God wants or does not want or what God is or isn't. A brief thought experiment to help my point. Try to imagine a new primary color. Just sit down and visualize a color that does not curren

I would also like to point out that while it is possible that during the expansion into the Red Giant phase, the Sun will consume the Earth, many physicists feels that instead, the physical changes brought onto the Solar System by such a transformation will actually jar the Earth from its orbit, thus causing it to skim off the edge of the Red Giant Sun and thus enter deeper into space as a frozen, burned crisp of a planet. Luckily for humanity, during the Red Giant phase, some of Saturn's moons will be raised to a temperature that should be suitable for human life. This will only last for a fe

"Do you think a gay rights group that had a member who didn't support their values would allow that member to become their leader?" Bob, I guess that's the question that some of the posters have been asking. Is engaging in sexual, same sex acts against BSA values or is being homosexual against BSA values? This distinction becomes an issue when dealing with teenage boys who question their sexuality. If they tell you (or someone else in scouting) that they are gay, even if they have done nothing morally wrong except be physically attracted to another man, then the rules say they

Bob, I can think of many interactions where a person can admit their sexuality. To harp on this point is to neglect the purpose of acco's post. But I shall answer your question so you can move on to discuss the validity or nonvalidity of what acco said. Certainly, a BSA official will (hopefully) never walk up to a scout or scouter and ask "Are you gay?" Nor will this (hopefully) ever find its way onto a form for joining. Now, what can happen is honest conversation. "Do you have a girlfriend?" "Mr. ____, are you married?" etc. Certainly, the person is free to answer a simpl

I would like to venture a hypothesis about shrinking Cub Scout enrollment. I feel the issue is mostly indirectly related to the Boy Scout's stance on gays. Ever since the Supreme Court decision, the BSA has been bombarded with lawsuits and bad press. The information reaching parents of prospective youth isn't "Eagle Scout saves brother's life" or "Boy Scouts reconstruct trail" or "Scouting collects cans for donation." Now, it seems that a large percentage of media coverage consist of the headlines that Merlyn posts here. This is the image of boy scouts (stemming from the gay controversy)

Bob, I think the point that some are trying to make is that there will be some sort of fallout against BSA for this incident. And this is regardless of any sort of culpability on BSA's part. As for lawsuits, I doubt anything will come of them, but I'll never underestimate people's desires to get rich quick through the court system. I'll leave it at that. But you can't deny that this reflects poorly on BSA even if the organization had absolutely nothing to do with it. This man was a representative of scouting. Let's look at your analogies. You use Clinton and Ted Kennedy. But did

Whether it's logical or not, this type of bad press will come back to haunt BSA. It doesn't matter that BSA has nothing to do with this. The headlines already read to the tune, "Boy Scout Executive Found with Child Porn." It doesn't say, "Man With Child Porn." However, I don't feel the danger here is with lawsuits or the ACLU. What is taking a beating is the public perception of BSA. Some parents will see this as proof that scouting is not a safe environment. For others, it will be the latest in a string of controversial coverage. I believe fotoscout said that this will cause diminished

I'm still confused on what the problem is. Wasn't Hunt's original post a simple explanation of where one can go to make suggestions for uniform changes?

A lot of people are pointing the finger at National for not having a strong advertising campaign. This topic was somewhat covered in: http://www.scouter.com/forums/viewThread.asp?threadID=84963#id_86114 I'll reiterate some of my major points from that thread. I have worked on a television advertising campaign for Boy Scouts and discovered just how difficult it is. To put it simply, there just isn't the money for a major television advertising campaign. Remember, every extra dollar that goes into marketing must be taken out of summer camp maintainence, camp staffing, administrat

I think we all have to come to grips with the fact that times are changing. It appears the ACLU is on a decent winning streak and I believe they will continue to win these battles over the relationship between public entities and the Boy Scouts. Do we want to waste money battling these decisions in court? Do we want to waste time complaining about how the ACLU is out to get us? Do we want media coverage of scouts to center around court rooms instead of service projects? So instead of fighting the losing battle, lets find a battle we can win. Start by delivering the best program you can. M

I agree with all of you that betting with chips is an innocuous activity. But the question I was trying to ask with the bacon comment is what do you do if a parent doesn't want their child engaging in this activity? I've known some parents that would probably take such a position (either for religious of personal reasons). So what do we do if a parent directly says, "I don't want my son gambling even if it's just with chips"? Where's the line? Do we not let any of the boys play? Seems harsh. Do we not let this particular boy play? Seems exclusive. Do we turn a blind eye to the activity?

Although it's easy for us to euphemistically title such an activity as, "simply keeping score while using valueless plastic chips as tally markers", the boys will see it differently. If you ask them, they will say, "We're gambling." Does that make a difference? It's also important to consider that while many of us have been to Vegas or a dining room poker game with friends, there are also many familys and religions who view gambling as a horrible sin. This kind of brings up the question of where is the line between parent and boy responsibility? (ie. Should you let the Jewish boy in

To play devil's advocate, it's one thing to advertise so a child forces his mom to buy an unhealthy cereal because a cartoon bird said so. It's another thing to advertise so a mom forces her son to join an organization that promotes morals, mental strength and good fitness. It seems like that's the easier sell. Otherwise, BSA advertising needs to 1) Convince the child that scouting is cool. 2)Convince the child that scouting is an activity worth nagging a parent about and 3) Convince the parent that scouting is a worthwhile investment of hundreds of dollars. So enough of the advocate.

I actually worked in commercial production. I once had the assignment of producing a public service announcement (PSA) which is basically a 30 second spot that stations donate to nonprofits. Stations are required to show a certain amount of PSAs each quarter. Now, the problem here is that so many of the PSAs you see today are sponsored by a larger corporation. "This message was brought to you by Glaxosmithkline." To pay for television advertising at desirable times is outside the budgets for many councils. Right now, so many councils are struggling to find funding to offer a quality prog

The first movie takes place only five years after the last episode? Wow, Scotty sure didn't age well. And by the way (I only say this because we're in the Issues and Politics forum) the first movie was HORRIBLE!! Meanwhile, the Wrath of Khan is one of my favorite movies of all time. It's great! And who ever suspected that ending? It's very "Enemy Below" but in space.