T2Eagle

I'm curious, who's decision is it/was it to shut down. BSA's or your CO's. Except for the actual lockdown period our council camps have been open for activities. We haven't thought it was prudent to do all the things we normally do, but that's been our call not BSA's.

We've been meeting outside most of the summer. We started alternating in person and zoom, then when we saw it was working we went all in person. Always masks, always social distancing. We've been doing day trips that are working well: biking, kayaking, fishing, lots of hiking, but camping is proving challenging. We only had a small group attend the very limited council mini summer camp. We are trying to get a campout in but the logistics are tough. We're limited to 10 people per campsite, we have to maintain social distancing, and we still have community spread going pretty strong here so

One of my Eagle scouts is part of the team!

The only possible reason I could think to not do this is if your troop currently has a uniform hat that everyone wears. Even then I'd probably give the nod to the patrol. But since very few troops, including it seems yours, actually have a troop approved hat then yes enthusiastically help them get those patrol hats. By the way, I would not take this to the PLC, patrol decisions aren't the bailiwick of the PLC. After all no one would think the PLC needs to approve patrol flags or yells, right? With any luck the other patrols will see the new hats and will want their own patrol specif

Distasteful as it may be to have something like this, it's probably prudent. There is going to be a tremendous amount of litigation eventually about Covid as the bills for treatment come due, especially if there are, as there is some indication of, long term consequences in addition to the initial illness. Our current health care system, fragmented and disjointed in its financing, is simply not designed to pay for a pandemic. Everyone's health insurance premiums are going to skyrocket next year. Lots of people are going to be out of work and therefore without health insurance, but als

I agree. You can't separate out possible/probable problems caused by Covid with the financial implications of those problems. A lot of money would need to be spent now and in the coming months, both at the local and national level, for an event that just doesn't look like it could safely be held a year from now. I'm also on my Council's Jambo committee, and have chaired it in the past. We were way behind in recruitment compared to previous years, and I don't think we ever would have gotten to where we wanted to be in number of participants. As a nation we need to get our act

I'm always skeptical of anything I don't see in writing, so I'd start there. Was anything put in writing announcing this? Second, no one in the world knows what the council or national structure will look like in December 2021, so again I'm deeply skeptical. I believe that we are part of the council and therefore have a responsibility to put forth reasonable efforts to support the organization, but reasonable is just that, reasonable. Make the pitch for FOS, or allow council to make its pitch for FOS and let your families decide how much if anything they can contribute. If you wan

Ehh, let them waste their money targeting us.

That's the multi-million dollar question. The plaintiff's position is that councils are not separate entities and so all properties and funds, national and local council, are fair game to fund compensation of victims. Obviously BSA's position is that councils are wholly separate. Both sides can make solid legal arguments for their positions and it is unclear what the combination of facts and law would lead to if it really does wend it's way all the way through the court system --- a process that would take years. What's driving most of this right now is that some states have expanded t

it simply isn't true that the law is clear on this, and that use of these accounts within reason is a clear violation of the law or IRS regulations, or is contingent simply on the idea that one won't get caught. I hold a law license, I asked a friend who is a tax practitioner to take a hard look at this, and their conclusion was that individual accounts, at least as we use them and as most troops do, are not a violation of either the letter or the spirit of the federal statutes and IRS regulations. As Fred8033 said, ask a different tax lawyer and you can get a different answer, I would bet

Is this a process issue or a substantive issue for the SM? It might be he's just trying to bang them in to Scoutbook and without names and contacts he's bumping into issues. I would explore with him what he's really trying to accomplish. These things almosy always work out, but when things are done in a way that's different from previous processes (as is everything these days) it can take a bit longer. If he's concerned about the substance or quality of the merit badge completion that's a different matter altogether.

BSA's position is consistent, and honest, that the the councils are separate legal entities. But that doesn't mean they aren't related for purposes of a lawsuit. Three separate legal entities approved my membership as a scout leader: my chartering org, the council, and national BSA. If I commit a heinous act against one of my scouts all three entities may face civil liability, and all three will be sued together. Whether the councils are independent will likely not ever be settled as a matter of law, that is it's unlikely that that issue will be decided by a judge and then definitive

This seems like an overly broad characterization. Just because we as scouters are used to doing things a certain way doesn't mean that's an innate preference. Lots of youth organizations have either tighter or looser controls from their parent organization, but I doubt you would find much difference in personality or motivation between the median volunteer in any of them. A strength I do think the CO system brings is continuity and institutional knowledge. Many, probably most troops that survive their first 10 years or so build up a coterie of scouters who remain with the program past

I wanted to comment on just this topic. The idea that BSA is going to NOW develop some IT platform that will replace the crap they currently have is laughable. They have demonstrated zero ability to do this in all these years when the need was obvious and resources were available. The idea that they're going to emerge from bankruptcy with the expertise resident in the organization, plus the money necessary, to accomplish something they haven't for decades is just incredulous. If they were capable of doing in this it would already be done.

It's doubtful that any FOS money ends up going towards a settlement in any meaningful way. In the vast majority of councils FOS is part of the current operating budget, it comes in and goes out the same year. What's going to go into the settlement is endowments and sales of real property.

Weird little factoid, the owner of the failed Boyce Hydro dam is a man named Lee Mueller, who appears to be the son of a socialite named Virginia Boyce Lind—and the grandson of the newspaper magnate who founded the Boy Scouts.

This type of restriction has always been true. Want to take your kids skiing without helmets, no problem, want to take your scouts skiing, helmets for everyone. Does your state require that everyone in any kind of watercraft wear PFDs all the time? They don't, but the scouts do. Any law anywhere say you have to have a buddy to go swimming, or have restrictions about the depths of water based on a swim test? We have lots of safety rules that are more stringent than the law, following them is nothing new. Your state may have decided that the costs of increased exposure caused

I'm still a bit confused as to how so much of the council assets can be brought into this. The councils are separate legal entities, domiciled in their own states; that's a hard vale to pierce. For instance, I live in Ohio, no change in the statute of limitations in other states affects my council's liability. National does not have the authority to order us to turn over assets to it, and so neither does the bankruptcy court. The power that National does hold over us is the charter, which really boils down to the copyrights. So the real drop dead question for us would be how much ar

My therapy advice to you would be relax, you're worried and thinking and planning a lot for it, they're not, and they're probably right. You have the age and experience to understand how many things could go wrong, how hard it could be for you personally, and how challenging it could be for everyone; they have the invincibility of youth, and believe, again probably correctly, that they'll be fine and everything will go right. "My son does cross country this should be easy" is an objectively accurate statement. Any reasonably fit teenager with good boots will be able to handle the trek

I find it interesting that no one is publishing their plans for what happens if someone becomes symptomatic and/or tests positive while at the camp. What happens if Johnny scout spikes a fever on Wednesday? What if he spikes a fever and starts coughing? Is there testing available? What kind of test is it, the kind that is readable that day or the kind that takes a three day turn around? Does his troop all go home? Do they go home in individual or all together packed six to a car? What about the staff members who were in direct contact with him? Who goes into two week quarantine, wh

Pioneer Scout Reservation, Erie Shores Council, is doing 1/2 week troop programs. "Each camping session will be limited to 10 groups per session. Each group must stay in separate campsites. No campsite sharing will be permitted. Group Size Group size will be limited to 10 total people per group (number subject to increase with state and local health orders). All groups must have 2 deep leadership so there is a limit of 8 youth max per group. Troops with group sizes larger than 8 youth will have to split into multiple groups. One group per campsite, no sites will be shared."

One of our troop leaders runs a small manufacturing facility of essential goods. Here's what he's found he has to do in his workplace in order to maintain safe social distancing. Take all the chairs out of the break room. Until he did, inevitably people would sit close to one another during meals and breaks, no matter how much tape, marking, and prepositioning of chairs, etc he did. Buy a bunch of six foot tables to place between work stations, without that people again moved closer to each other to talk, help, examine work product, exchange material, etc. Institute a strict schedulin

We had a committee meeting the other night, and there was a near unanimous consensus strongly opposed to doing any group camping this summer. Many, maybe most, of the people in the meeting were themselves or a spouse already working in essential work places, and they were already uncomfortable with the risk that put themselves and their families. Adding to that risk just wasn't in the cards. We're going to look for some creative ways to maybe get together for some smaller parallel activities like a fishing meet up or something similar. But it's highly doubtful we'll get together as a group

it would not be wrong for your son to raise the issue with the MBC, since he is part of a class where these photos are available to the members of the class. the key to this is to do this very diplomatically, make sure he frames this as a matter of bringing information to the MBC, not a matter of being accusatory. provide the facts, don't characterize what the facts might mean or what conclusion someone should draw from them. Further he needs to understand that the decision about what to do about it is with the MBC and not with anyone else, and that neither he nor you will likely ever know

I like being an optimist, but I just don't see this happening. Let's say everybody's fine and looking good when you start your trek. But day 4 or 5 someone starts coughing, spikes a fever, and tests positive for Covid, assuming they can even get tested. Everybody on the trek and every staff member that came in close contact with that person now has to go into a 14 day self quarantine. What does that mean? Are they all going to stay at Philmont, because it sure as heck doesn't mean they should all get on a plane or train to travel home. This doesn't look like a plan to move forward