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Secret DE

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Posts posted by Secret DE

  1. One has to wonder if we are using the Scout "Oath and Law" for their intended purposes or just to pass judgement? For many years the National Council has really not focused on adult health and that is changing. Applicants to the 2010 Jamboree will have to meet Philmont weight requirements and rumor has it that the BSA is about to get very serious about these requirements going forward.

     

    As a former smoker I understand who we as a group tend to protect the rights of those who smoke. It is an addiction I would not wish on any person. That said it is legal and some people need to do it. That does not mean that I won't advocate those people quit. I just do it differently.

     

    As for being overweight in this day and age any unit casting off a youth or adult for this should be really cautious. After All Scouting is about self improvement. That could be the unit's opportunity to help people change. I have never read anything in our program that says we should force people out because of their health. A better idea might be for a group of peers, be they youth or adults, reach out and help that leader make a change.

     

    We all have the power change lives. Scouting is not just about changing the lives of youth. One of the greatest Scoutmasters I know will tell you that to this day he does not know who got more out of Scouting. Even while his sons advanced in rank and grew a youth the program challenged he way he did things and made him a better teacher and Doctor.

     

    Great Scouting!

  2. Aquatic,

     

    I am not a camp school guy, so I could not tell you what class would qualify you. I think Aquatics, COPE, Admin. Anything that is a week long course, but don't take my word, I have never been to Camp School. Also you would have to do those classes while a professional. They will not count stuff outside of your professional tenure.

     

    There is also a Master's Degree program offerred through Murray State University. That program will give you Master's Degree Credit for PDL1,2 and 3.

     

    SDE

  3. Basically today all new hires for Executive (professional slots) attend PDL1 within three months of hire. This is two weeks in Texas. When I went through in 2007 it was different than it is now. The decided to revamp the program to make the process more responsive to what actually happens in the field. The team leader for the Center for Professional Development is a great guy and he was really a driving force in this redesign.

     

    PDL2 is attended 12 or more months after PDL1 and its major focus is on volunteer recruiting, team building and finance. There is a project required for this class that you must work with your field supervisor on prior to attending the class. This class is delivered regionally. In the northeast we attend at the Tuscarora Inn and Convention Center in Portland, Pennsylvania. You may also attend a session at Philmont or Sea Base, but most councils will not pay for your travel to these locations.

     

    PDL3, which I have not yet attended, is again in Texas. This is a one week training course that is focused career development, sales marketing, finance and membership management. This class is usually attended after 30 to 36 months of employment with a local council. Technically to attend this class you must be promotable to a position of Senior DE or higher.

     

    Once an Executive (Professional)completes PDL3 they are considered to be trained for their position. After that time you can earn the Professional Training Knot by attending Woody Badge or Camp School for a Administrative position (only one counts for the knot), Take one advanced leadership course from the center for Professional Development and one additional 15 credit course that applies to your job. A professional may apply for and receive the Professional Training Knot after they have completed these classes and 4 years of professional tenure.

     

    The purpose of the Professional Training Knot is to give Professional Scouters a training goal and standard that they can follow in their career. It is important that we are just as committed to training as the volunteers are. It is also a way for professionals to show volunteers that they too have a program and path to follow for training in their registered position.

     

    I am sure I missed some stuff and probably got some stuff wrong, but that is the basics as I seem them some 27 months into my tenure.

  4. This award is far from a give me. The people I have seen nominiated for this award all all major scouters who are Vigial Honors OA members, Silver Beavers and District Award of Merit recipients. I have signed off on three since I have been a designee and all were big hitters in both the lodge and Scouts.

     

    SDE

  5. As a Master Mason and the professional designee in my council who handles these awards this is a fairly easy process. First and formost the individual must be nominated by another master mason.

     

    Step one is that the nominating Mason fills out the form indicating who he is nominating and gives his information.

     

    Step two is that the Council Designee verifies that the nominee has met the Scouting Criteria for the award. If they do, then the sign off on behalf of the Council stating that they agree with the nomination and verify the nominee's service record.

     

    Step three is that the nominee's lodge signs off on the verification of masonic service (ie. that the nominee is in good standing)

     

    Step four is the sign off of the Grand Lodge. Because I am a Master Mason I usually personally attend to steps 2 through 4 personally. Ultimately this is not an award that is for the the Lodge to grant or deny. It is intended to recognize the contributions of Masons who actively support Scouting. The final decision ultimately rests with the Grand Lodge of the nominee's and the Gl of Pennsylvannia's Youth Committee.

     

    SDE(This message has been edited by Secret DE)

  6. ""District nominations are between either the District Chairman or the District Executive to make the nomination. The Chapter Adviser approves the nomination, by signing the nomination form.""

     

    That is not true. The District Chairman and District Executive have the abilitiy to nominate District Level Scouters for the OA, each in their own right. There is no either or. All Council professionals are allowed to nominate adults to OA membership in thier own right. The District Chairman and the Council President are also afforded the ability to nominate adults for OA membership because of thier positions. Also all professionals are "ad hoc" members of the lodge in the Council where they work even if they have never taken an Ordeal. The Lodge Advisor or Lodge Adult Selection Committee approves those nominations. This is spelled out in the Guide for Officers and Advisors.

     

    My Chapter Advisor and I are very close, like family close, and we often talk about which District level volunteers would be best suited to help the Lodge, but when I nominate someone, I sign my forms and they go straight to the Lodge Advisor. In my two years as DE I have only submitted one nomination and my District Chairmen have submitted none.

     

    As for professionals being the only adults to be nominiated by the Supreme Chief of the fire, that is not true. That process is usually reserved for board members, council level scouters and new professionals as a way for them to better develop relationships with volunteers and youth within their Council and Districts. I cannot nominate someone who is a unit Scouter. As a general rule you only nominate at the level of your participation. The Supreme Chief of the Fire is a Council Scouter so it makes sense that they would only nominate the people I have mentioned..

     

    SDE(This message has been edited by Secret DE)(This message has been edited by Secret DE)

  7. "You guys have that special in."

     

    That is a load of puckey. The Scout Executive can do that for anyone, not just a professional. In fact the Guide for Officers and Advisors lays out in plain english that all members of the professional service are ad hoc members of the OA Lodge in their council just because they are professionals.

     

    So what about the adult leader who volunteers with Scouts and builds a career before in Scouting and the OA before he or she 1) had kids or 2) their kids were old enough to be cubs? That is just one more scenario where a cub leader is an OA member as an adult and could then later become a cub parent.

     

    All I am saying is that there are lots of scenarios out there that could allow a registered Cub leader to be an OA member without having done so as a youth. Another would be a Cub Camp Director. Because the OA does so much service to Council Camps, it would make sense for the Council or District to nominate them for OA membership.

     

    SDE

  8. '"As cub scouters, the ONLY way to join the local lodge is to have been elected to the OA as a youth"

     

    It is possible that a Cub Scouter could be nominated by the district, not likely but possible.""

     

    What about the guy like me works for the BSA? I was nominated for membership by the Supreme Chief of the Fire. WHat if I leave my job. I still want my son to be a Cub Scout? That would mean I would be involved in the PAck. There are lots of adults in the cub program that were not youth OA members. THere are also lots of scenarios for that possibility.

     

    SDE

     

     

  9. I would have a hard time with this. Especially because many crossovers in my district happen on school grounds. I am not sure the ceremonies team guidelines allow for a firearm, nor am I sure that carring a firearm, fake or otherwise, is a good idea for OA youth. Not because I am anti-gun, but rather because I worry that society is so ignorant that the situation will cause more trouble than it is worth. And think of all the nightmarish PR possibilities.

     

    SDE

  10. I am not really going to site any of the threads where I have picked up on this particular item, but I do want to express me dissappointment when it comes to Scouters and their feelings about the Silver Beaver. Just because a Scouter does not work directly with youth does not mean that they don't perform service to youth. Would anyone argue the Waite Phillips who has been dead for years no longer does anything for youth? I mean afterall he ain't working with the Kids, but we put plenty of them through Philmont Scout Ranch every year.

     

    Those guys and gals that work behind the scenes in your Council to make sure salaries are paid, bills are taken care of and planning and endowment development take place are all working for the same things Scoutmaster's and other adult leaders work for in the field. Some of them may have already done their time, while others may not have had kid, but either way those people feel so strongly about what you do for kids that they bust thier butts in the community asking for money to make sure you have the camps, the equiptment, and the staff to make the program work for you.

     

    Say all you want and complain all you can, but realize that in many cases they do what you won't and vice versa. Service can take many forms and not every Scouter can work with kids. Just because someone does not work directly with our youth, dosen't mean they are not serving our youth. I am sorry that many here don't seem to feel that way, but in many cases you are biting the hand that feeds you. Afterall they think enough about what you do with our Scouts to go out and ask for money and raise money to enable you to deliver the program.

     

    Secret DE

  11. There is a tin of Trail Mix that Trails End makes that all Scouts can sell during the popcorn sale. I believe that there are two or three flavors. A group of Venturers also reached out to Trails End and asked them why they did not custom a product for them to sell? So Trails End did some research with Venturers across the Country and came up with a 9 oz bag of trail mix product that is for Venture Crew Fund Raising. I will be trying and sharing the Venture Trail mix at a major Venture Event this weekend in my District.

     

    Secret DE

  12. GW,

     

    I understand you question. Have you ever served as a Chapter Advisor, Lodge Advisor or member of an election team (youth or adult)? From what I can tell the biggest barrier for our Chapter Election Teams getting into a unit is how the Scoutmaster feels about the Order of the Arrow. In many cases if the Scoutmaster is not a fan of the Order, an election is not likely to happen.

     

    I know, you can always argue that the Committee can force the issue, but you and I both know that many will not. Often times getting a unit's Scoutmaster involved can and does make a big difference in whether or not a unit will hold an OA election. This is also a golden opportunity to prove that the Order of the Arrow is about strengthening the units. Afterall what group of people to expose a Scoutmaster to, than OA?

     

    I am sure that there are better and worse ideas that can be had for selecting unit leaders for membership in the Order of the Arrow. I am not going to be the one to tell anyone here that their idea isn't right. What I am saying is that in my Council we have found that Scoutmaster's who participate in the Order of the Arrow are more likely to promote the OA to thier unit youth.

     

    Secret DE

  13. SWScouter is correct. Somehow in my explaination I got used standard for District Award of Merit for OA unit adults. My bad, I jumble a lot of numbers and ratios for work.

     

    The Lodge Advisor and the Scout Executive as a team may waive camping requirements for non-unit Scouters. Once the Adult Selection Committee meets to approve Adult selectsions, they are forwarded to the Scout Executive for sign off.

     

    In many Lodges the Scout Executive will defer, sometimes greatly, to the Lodge Advisor. This is an important item to understand as the Lodge Advisor and Scout Executive have a very interesting relationship. The only volunteer that the Scout Executive has the sole authority to appoint is the Lodge Advisor. So in many cases the Lodge Advisor is the last word by virture of his relationship with the Scout Executive.

     

    Secret DE

  14. Lisabob,

     

    I am sure you are going to get a whole lot of opinions on this question, but to me it is a no brainer that the Scoutmaster should be first on the list. After that I would look at who has the ability to help the not only the Order, but also your elected youth understand their role in the unit has members of the Order of the Arrow. When in doubt listen to the election team and select your Committee choice based upon those criteria.

     

    Secret DE

  15. First off, Adults are selected to become members of the Order of the Arrow, not as an honor, but rather for what they can do to help the Order and its members. Each Troop Committee that holds an election is authorized to select one person from the unit that can be selected each year. At the unit level there are a few considerations. The ratio is actually one adult per fifty youth, so a unit with 51 youth can nominate 2 adults, 76 you can nominate 3 and so on and so on. These nominees must meet the camping requirements just like our youth.

     

    At the District and Council Level the District Chairmen, Council President and any Professional (excluding the Scout Executive ==> he is the next category) can make nominations to the Order for District and Council level Scouters. The Professional or District Chairman is not allowed to nominate someone from a unit, only a District or Council related individual. These people generally must meet the camping requirements, but at the discretion of the Lodge Advisor they can be waived.

     

    All nominations from unit committees, Professional Scouters, District Chairman and the Council President are subject to the review of the Lodge Adult Selection Committee. This is usually made up of the Lodge Advisor and other Adult OA members.

     

    Now the Scout Executive is a completely different matter. The Council Scout Executive is the Supreme Chief of the Fire. As such he is allowed to nominate any adult he wishes to membership in the Order of the Arrow. This is how I became a member of my Lodge. The Supreme Chief of the Fire's nominations are not subject to review. You basically get a letter congratulating you on your selection and you choose an Ordeal of your liking.

     

    That is adult selection in a nutshell. I hope it helps.

     

    Secret DE

  16. This is a fairly standard policy and for quite a logical reason. The paperwork trail that each boy maintains on his trail to Eagle must be verified by the Council when it comes time for his Eagle Board of Review. The mandatory advancement report requirement makes sure that the each youth's record accurately reflect a Scouts records. It also allows the council to measure the success of our youth's advancing through the program to make sure that the program is being delivered properly.

     

    This policy in no way, has an impact on instant recognition. Might I suggest some alternate ways to recognize Scouts for their accomplishments until you can get a report to council and present the official badge of rank. Present the youth with a rank pin to borrow until the you can present the badge. Collect old ranks from Scouts who have moved up in rank and loan them to the newly advanced Scouts until they get theirs. Immediate recognition does not always have to man immediate badge presentation.

     

    The DWC Council has a great staff who support some amazing volunteers. This policy is there to help the youth. As an example, if a boy's parent's house catches on fire and his records are lost, he has a lot of recreating to do. If that same information is logged in at the Council, it is a matter of obtaining a printout of his record. Without the mandatory advancement report, this would not be possible.

     

    Great Scouting!

     

    SDE

     

    BTW, we also do this to prevent anyone from just walking in off the street and buying a rank. This is really important when it comes to Eagle Badges.(This message has been edited by Secret DE)

  17. If you look at the OA Guide for Officers and Advisers it clearly states that unit adults must meet the camping requirements. District adults can have the camping requirement waived. This year I am having my Chapter Advisor nominate one District Level adult for membership and he has all of his camping time.

     

    I have only been a DE for about 19 months, but from what I can see it is rare to have the camping time waived. In my case as a DE I was nominated by the Supreme Chief of the Fire because he felt that OA membership was an important part of Professional Service.

     

    SDE

  18. As a professional, let me explain a little about the BSA Uniform or professionals. All professionals my own a BSA Class A uniform and a Dress Uniform. The BSA has always required this. My best man's grandfather was a national staffer and even in the 50s and 60s there was a Dress uniform with pocket emblem that professional scouters had to have.

     

    I personally have the following in my Scouting uniform inventory.

    2 pair of switchbacks

    1 pair of regular BSA Uniforn Slacks

    1 pair of regular BSA Shorts

    2 BSA Unform shirts with all the proper patches

    1 BSA Action Shirt

    four pair of calf length cotton socks

    1 crew lenth pair of socks

    1 xwool pair of socks

    1 Council Windbreaker

    1 Council Camp Raiin Jacket

    3 BSA Ball Caps

    1 BSA belt olive green belt

    1 Blue Blazzer

    2 White Dress Shirts

    1 paor Gray Slacks

    1 BSA Tie

    10 or more BSA Tshirts

    1 BSA Blazer pocket emblem

     

    I want to add a venture uniform to the mix, but I currently cannot afford to buy the pants, shorts, belt and socks. Unlike a volunteer I am only allowed to wear BSA clothing. I cannot find alternatives and wear them. For the most part that is adhered to at all councils in the nation.

     

    The professional uniform is what we wear in the community to business meetings, public speaking engagements, Council Board meetings and the like. Our council policy is that we only need to wear a suit, but we are all required to maintain a professional dress uniform. No exceptions.

    When we are out in the Volunteer world with our units and leaders we wear out Class A dress uniform. Roundtables, Univeristy of Scouting, Unit Meetings, Camporees, Events and such. We must be in 100% BSA uniform with the exception of t-shirt and underwear.

     

    I have no complaints about this. The uniform is very practical and on days when I need to wear it, I wear it. If that means I eat lunch at the mall, I am in uniform. I shop in uniform. I am proud to represent the 800 volunteers and 3000 youth that I serve.

     

    Uniforms as pretty expensive for me too and I wear them all the time. some weeks I wear a uniform every day of the week. That adds considerable wear and tear. Again I sugest two things for people who cannot afford a BSA Uniform. First and foremost, your council has a stockpile somewhere of uniforms that people havwe turned in over the years to help people in need. Your DE can and will help Leaders who have situations like that. Second all units can and should start a uniform bank. If a youth leaves scouting or outgrows their uniform encourage them to pass it to help keep the cost of scouting down for boys in your unit. Where there is a will, there is a way.

     

    Secret DE

     

    PS. Money is tight for me too. I am a fairly new DE with a wife and two children under the age of 5. That means I still buy diapers folks. My wife is a teacher and I work as an entry level BSA Executive. My oldest recently started youth soccer and I gladly paid $50 for enrollment and a t-shirt. I gladly give a sizeable gift to FOS (relative to my income) and have been known to buy the occasional Boys Life subscription for youth I know who cannot afford it. We are not rolling in the dough and we make it work. As I said above, where there is a will, there is a way. The BSA is the best Program with a purpose going and I participate at the level that ask my volunteers to. They should expect nothing less than I do.(This message has been edited by Secret DE)

  19. The high cost of a uniform is actually just a little bit of a cop out. When my 3 year old son signed up for Soccer this year we paid $50.00 for his membership and a t-shirt. How many parents complain about the cost of a Scout uniform, but spend big $$$ on hockey equiptment or football gear? Did I complain about the fact that I was buying a $40 t-shirt? No.

     

    Besides, and most leaders should know, if a child is truely in need of a uniform, your DE has the resources to help. Most Goodwills turn over Scout clothing to local councils for just that reason. If that is not an option, I know many Scouts and Scouters who are willing to donate a shirt. I even know of some units and districts that have a uniform bank to help Scouts strech the value of a dollar.

     

    SDE

  20. It is all in the approach. I know that I make it a point to be out in public in uniform on days when I have roundtables or other events or meetings that require one. If I need to go to the store, the mall, or just out in the community I am proud to represent a great organization. Keep in mind that I took a fe beatings in elementary school for wearing my uniform.

     

    Now do I get some strange looks? Sure. Do I get some great questions and positive support? Yes. The bottom line is youth or adult their reactions to my being in uniform are about them, not me. This is a difficult thing for most kids to understand and many adults have problems with it too.

     

    I am proud to be an example to my adult volunteers and youth. I am proud to represent them and wearing a uniform is just one of the ways that I am able to do that.

     

    Tony

  21. Might I suggest a little team building. Scouting is a game with a purpose and all things don't come naturally to all people. Contact your District Executive and see if he can connect you with someone who is COPE trained and have them come into a meeting and do some initiative games. That can be a big help getting the Scouts to work together and understanding how everyone on the team is dependant on one another. Then get them signed up to take the Council COPE Course (High and Low)and watch them grow.

     

    This is a case where you just need to give them a chance to work it out themselves. I would start with that approach first.

     

    Tony

  22. The G2SS is a great set of guidelines to help adult leaders run a program that we hope will be safe and fun for all. Absent specifics, it might be wise to gather those specifics and have this discussion with your Council Scout Executive and the Regional Staff.

     

    S DE(This message has been edited by Secret DE)

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