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SeattlePioneer

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Everything posted by SeattlePioneer

  1. <<BSA is their own worst enemy in that the process is cumbersome, redundant and time-consuming.>> I agree completely. BSA and councils are choking on all the paper work and requirements. There isn't enough paid staff to administer them properly and it creates huge burdens for volunteers as well. ]\ Frankly, I'd tear out about half of each Cub Scout den book as well. BSA is following all the fads and fashions, and layering them on top of the last set of fads and fashions, and the ones before that.
  2. << one lasted 6 days (guess Cub-O-Ree was too much for him). >> Heh, heh! I can understand that!
  3. <<I actually got in trouble when I was a DE because I camped a lot. In addition to district and council camporees, I did OA events and IOLS training, or whatever the outdoor portion was called at the time. But I was single at that point. Like ProScouter06 above, once you start spending 12 to 16 hour days, longer if you are assigned summer camp duties, you need time to away from Scouting. Especially if you have family.>> Excellent idea! New Webelos Den Leaders often need support and encouragement to get started promptly with an outdoor program.
  4. <<I actually got in trouble when I was a DE because I camped a lot. In addition to district and council camporees, I did OA events and IOLS training, or whatever the outdoor portion was called at the time. But I was single at that point. Like ProScouter06 above, once you start spending 12 to 16 hour days, longer if you are assigned summer camp duties, you need time to away from Scouting. Especially if you have family.>> My personal aim is for district volunteers to do all the things they can do, so the DE only has to do the things only he can do. My theory is that
  5. <<I apologize if I came across as saying you were dishonest. I don't know you and can't make that judgment. I was reacting to what I sensed was an "I'll ignore the law if I don't agree with it" attitude. I realize that you were ignoring my advice which you didn't think had much weight coming from an anonomous Hedgehog on the internet. That's understandable. >> One of the reasons for lengthy threads is that people may actually start understanding one another. It's pretty common to wind up talking past one another repeatedly! <<1. All funds are in kept the un
  6. << My understanding is that although the recharter computer system will accept the input of a new leader's information it is not finalized until the council receives and approves a paper application. A part of the application process now is also that a registration isn't compete or final until the new leader completes YPT --- that is probably what your DE was referring to.>> I took in the Adult Leader paperwork for a new adult leader --- Dave. The council lost Dave's paperwork. Dave completed the paperwork a second time and it was submitted with our recharter, a
  7. I collected our Pack recharter packet at Roundtable last Thursday. Today I knocked out the on line rechartering in about an hour. Tonight I got our Institutional Head to sign off on the recharter. Monday I expect to have the Cubmaster and Pack Committee Chair sign off on the recharter. There are a few loose ends to tie up, but not many. My basic strategy for a quick and easy recharter is to recharter with those Scouts and Scouters who have completed the requirements they need to continue in Scouting for another year ---such as completing Youth Protection Training for adults and
  8. A couple of years ago I registered a new adult leader during recharter. The next year, he wasn't listed as a current adult leader in the unit. We recently had our erecharter packets handed out and the DE explaining recharter methodology. Someone else mentioned that they had had an adult leader dropped the same as I had. The DE suggested that this was probably due to lack of some kind of training requirement. The council will simply drop someone as a leader without notifying anyone. Anyone else heard of this kind of thing? Personally, I consider it outrageous! If the coun
  9. << SeattlePioneer, on 11 Oct 2015 - 3:00 PM, said: After 22 years of practicing as a tax litigation attorney, I've learned never to think I know everything. >> Well, that's the first time I've heard your claim to real expertise regarding taxes. I respect that, but I don't respect the pieties you've handed out, implying that those using Scout Accounts were being dishonest. That line is like the Scouter who dons the mantle of the Uniform Police to badger other people over trivial issues. The tax angle isn't trivial, but it can be overdone as well.
  10. <<As far as a scout is obedient, I am not blindly obedient to every rule out there when it runs counter to my running the troop right.>> I agree. There is also ---- "A Scout is thrifty. He pays his own way...."
  11. I always liked den flags and find them useful in developing den spirit and solidarity. Pretty frequently, I had den opening ceremonies where each den member had their left hand on the den flag, helping to hold it up, while doing a Cub Scout salute with the right hand and repeating the Cub Scout Promise or Law of the pack. So I looked for ways to USE the den flag during activities. At out June Pack Overnight camp, I promoted den flag making as an acticvity during the camp. Each den made a new den flag to go along with their new den level. Our district day camp made den flag
  12. << Local time: 02:53 PM 277 Excellent @Mention Posted Today, 02:27 PM SeattlePioneer, on 10 Oct 2015 - 12:10 PM, said: My concern with the issue has less to do with the idea of "getting caught" (an IRS audit), than with doing the right thing. I know that my unit will probably get away with it, but it's still the wrong thing to do. What lesson do I want to teach the scouts?>> My concern is that you guys know less about paying taxes than you think you do, and loudly proclaim your self righteous ignorance. I have a practical job of managing a Scout unit to d
  13. << SeattlePioneer, on 07 Oct 2015 - 1:20 PM, said: Oh, when you add in all the thousands of prizes, gift cards and such a council pays out in a popcorn sale, I'd say it amounts to as much as a typical unit pays out in the typical Scout Account. And while most Scout Accounts are related directly to paying for Scouting activities, the council prizes are usually unrelated to Scouting. I continue to suggest that your concerns are exaggerated. Thousands of Scout units across the country have been managing Scout Accounts for decades, and critics can't point to a singl
  14. <<. We currently have no CM, the PCC has wrangled the grandpa of one of the scouts in his den to be the CM but I get the impression that he only agreed because he was asked in front of the whole pack. The PCC is planning and running the pack meetings and 5 days before the second pack meeting he had not even thought about what to do.>> Having quality pack meetings is important! That means having FUN, exciting pack meetings. What you seem to be describing are people who don't have a clue how to organize and conduct a pack meeting, and aren't motivated to figure out ho
  15. I again note that my council has a prize for the family selling the highest dollar amount of popcorn, which prize is sending the whole family on an all expense paid trip to Disneyland. Plus MANY other prizes for Scouts who sell popcorn. The only difference between these council prizes and the way most ISAs are run is that NONE of the council prizes have anything to do with Scouting. Most Scout Accounts run by units require that expenditures from ISAs be Scouting related. In short, I think that concerns about ISAs are exaggerated.
  16. No solutions there that I see. Just proposing to double down on stuff that already isn't working, is what I see. The biggest problem I see is a GROWING inability/unwillingness of volunteers to step forward to support Scout units. Lots more children are interested in Scouting but have parents who aren't or have competing activities. Plus, Scouting is getting ever more complex for leaders and youth. Too complex, in my opinion. Cub Scout den handbooks can be 200-300 pages long. WAY too much reading and programs that are way too complex. And Scouting seems to be chasing ev
  17. Ummm. I think it's useful and terrific when units do things "by the book." It's usually a good way, and often the best way. But units often get by with compromises because they lack sufficient skills and leadership. That sounds like the situation described above. In my opinion, the most serious problem you describe is that pack meetings are of indifferent quality. That IS important! The Cubmaster is supposed to manage the program and the pack meetings, perhaps you can offer to help the Cubmaster plan and present the pack meetings. If the annual meeting plan is a good one,
  18. Take a look at the personal benefits council settle upon those selling popcorn. Games! Prizes! Gift Cards! The top seller in my council gets a FREE TRIP TIO DISNEYLAND, all expenses paid ---- for the whole family! I again suggest that the exagerated concerns some people try to sell are just a form of troublemaking, like those who try to make trouble by being the Uniform Police. If you have a concern, state it. But this practice has been going on for decades without significant objection by councils or BSA. I've never seen anyone who can point to IRS action taken against BSA,
  19. In all parts of Scouting you find people who want to impose their own exaggerated ethical standards on others. An example are the uniform police who carp and criticize people over unimportant details of uniforming. For unit treasurers, this is often expressed by those who want to impose their own exaggerated Scout Account concerns. Personally, I pay no attention to these people who have a burr under their saddles. They are best ignored. Our council, unit and our boys benefit hugely from Scout accounts. In our low income area, it means that those interested can have th
  20. It's a lot tougher to plan a den meeting than it is to conduct one. I'd identify one person who is willing and able to organize den meetings, and another couple of people who will present the den meeting program to two dens. The person planning the den meetings could conduct one of the program meetings if they wish to do so.
  21. << Not sure if it is a national requirement or not, but having one WFA trained adult is required for all backcountry outing in our Council. I can't imagine any parent letting their child go on a backcountry adventure without having someone appropriately trained and I can't imaging being responsible for the safety of a group of boys without having that training. We have at least 4 adults in our Troop that have WFA training -- typicaly two of them go on every outing - backcountry or not.>> Fine, for your troop. But it's pointlessly burdensome for a lot of troops
  22. Our new Webelos Den Leader was also an excellent Wolf and Bear Den Leader. I got him the new Webelos handbook and Program Helps for Webelos, and he asked how he could get through all the material in the new program. That has been my concern about the new program too --- it seems like FAR too much detail is expected of Cub Scouts and Den Leaders. In my view, the heart of Scouting is to learn to live by the Scout Oath and Law. Boys discover that if they are going to go camping, they NEED to live by the Scout Oath and Law to be successful and avoid killing each other out
  23. << true, but you'd hope that you'd not be run off from the campfire discussion with other scouters before you end your scouting "career" >> Oh, no one is running me off. I'm looking for graceful ways to separate myself from activities I've done in the past. Unfortunately, the pack doesn't have the depth of leadership needed to replace me, so more gets dumped on the Cub Master, who can only do so much. It's sad to see.
  24. The real bottom line is that everyone quits sooner or later.
  25. <<Sadly I have seen a significant shift in all scouting forums that I don't care for and simply will not stand for without speaking out. I see scouting moving from it's middle class base to the rich suburbs. Requirement short cutting, eagle chasing parents, High dollar trips and Family adventure being the norm. >> The packs and troops I have worked with have all been marginal units in lower middle class to poor areas. Unfortunately, they are marginal units because of lack of interest by a lot of the families living in those areas, while rich suburbs recruits scads
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