Reaper

I wonder if they end up with typical indoor Cub Scout fare (songs, games, skits, Promise, Law, and macaroni crafts); will they will ever Cross-Over to Boy Scouts ("They fooled me once with that promise of outdoor adventure...").

To answer your question: YES they do!

Our Pack routinely crosses over nearly all of our Webelos into several area Troops. Our graduates come back to serve as Den Chiefs and they serve in various leadership positions in their respective Troops. Our graduates serve as volunteers in District events. Our graduates, even as older Boy Scouts, look back on their time in our Pack as some of their fondest Scouting memories. Our graduates strive towards Eagle and they "get it." They LIVE the entire Scouting experience! No macaroni crafts here, buddy! Our Cub Scouts camp twice a year, Webelos maybe three times . . . just enough to whet their appetites for monthly Boy Scout camping.

And, if the whole "setting up a tent inside for recruiting" was your idea or maybe you're responsible for sharing it with the masses, thank you very much! Great idea! Sorry if others have used it to ruin Scouts by luring them into macaroni crafts!(This message has been edited by Reaper)

Received several personal messages about the Not Much Time (rope demo) thing discussed above - so I figured that I'd just post it here. I've seen something like this using a yardstick. And as I said before, I inherited this basic idea from a previous Cubmaster, but I've added to it and tried to build up the drama - surely, this could win you an Oscar or at least a bunch of new Scouts!

Not Much Time

Materials:

80 rope (we use a blue and gold nylon rope available at Home Depot or Lowes), pre-marked with marker at 6, 13, 21, 50 (cut rope is used in other Scouting projects, knot tying, etc.)

Scissors (large, make sure these can easily cut through your rope)

Three other people: Two parent Volunteers to hold ends of rope and a Pack Leader to collect and take away the cut pieces

Script (usually done by Cubmaster CM):

I need two volunteers to help me and I promise they wont have to dress up like little Bo Peep. [Have the two volunteers hold the rope about chest-high, stretched out full length, either across the stage or, even better, from the stage down the aisle through the audience to the back of the room I like this because it seems so far away!]

Again, I ask, When during their lifetime do we have an opportunity to influence our child?

This 80 foot rope represents life span of typical child, from the time that he was born, here near _____ [introduce volunteer], all the way back to _______ [introduce other volunteer, usually done by screaming], all the way back to ________ , when your son will rest in peace.

1. The average parent here is in their 30s or 40s. Lets assume youre about 36, on average. Your son is around 6, for 1st grade Tiger Cubs, so youre about 30 years older. So we can assume that we probably wont be around for the last 30 years of our kids lives. [CM holds rope and cuts off last 30 feet; another Pack Leader is there to take away cut rope; CM holds rope while the volunteer at the end comes up to hold the new end . . . this gets repeated for each cut.]

2. Like I said, your son is now around 6 years old, so we cant influence him anymore for those years, theyre already gone [Cut off first 6 feet].

3. About 15 or so years from now, your son will be grown up and gone off to college or a job, and wont be at home, so you wont have much influence then. [Cut off from 21 foot mark to end]

4. Were left with about a 15 section of our sons life, and heres where hes at today [point to front end]. However, if you talk to a typical Junior High School Teacher, they will tell you that by the time they are a teen, they are much more influenced by their peers than they are by their parents (this usually gets agreement from any teachers in the audience!). [Cut off from 13 to 21], so you really dont have those years either.

What we have left is this short period of time (Im usually holding the rope myself now, stretched out over my head Im tall!) . . . the time period from age 6 to 12, which is the age span served by Cub Scouts, Webelos, and the initial part of Boy Scouts.

I believe that Scouting is the type of program that you want your son (and you) to be a part of during these formative years.

Our dates are set by the district, usually a choice of two. We usually only recruit at our CO, an elementary school.

We set up a booth at the Meet the Teacher Day, usually a few days before school starts - pictures, flyers, PWD cars, Pushmoblie, etc.

Flyers go out in all boys take home folders a week before and the day before our SNTJS.

The morning of SNTJS, we set up a campsite on the stage in the caferteria (tent, fake fire, flags, etc; looking for a sounds of nature cd to add to it this year and now gonna look for a smells of nature air freshener and auto spray, too - thanks!). We got the campsite idea from another Pack - this went over HUGE!!

On the day, Pack leaders (CM, CC, DLs) do Boy Talks in classrooms of all grade levels; it's great when we come across one of our Cub Scouts - they really help "sell" the Pack. And, we pass out another SNTJS flyer and a Cub Scout pencil or some type of some gift-type thing.

At SNTJS (in the school cafeteria), we have everyone sit at table by age, and for the Tigers, we have them sitting at three tables, with friends sitting with friends for the most part. We do a quick intro and then play a game where we quickly break everyone into teams (basically, the teams are already set - each table is a team) - the teams are given a bunch of newspapers and have to create sometype of costume for one of the kids on the team. Then, after 10 minutes or so, one of the adults tells about the costume. Good fun, but what's really going on is that our Pack Leaders are watching for the take-charge types of parents that usually present themselves in these types of situations. We later recruit them as new leaders.

We then break out the kids to the school library, where some leaders and the Webelos sing songs, play games, do skits, teach the Promise and the Law, and teach about the sgin and what "signs up" means etc; the parents stay in the caferteria.

The CM and CC and other leaders talk with the parents, starting with the Not Much Time rope presentation (I inherited this from a previous CM). We have a rope that's about 80 feet long, held on each end by volunteers. "This rope represents your son. We live about 80 years . . . " Then we cut pieces off: "he's about six or seven years old now, so those years are gone" (cut off six feet). We continue cutting the rope down ("parents pass away, son goes to college, kids don't really listen to parents when they're in high school, most teachers say that kids don't really listen in middle school"); we end up with a piece of rope about five feet long, saying "this is about the length of time you have left to positively influence your son - and, well, whaddya know . . . this is the same length of time as the Cub Scout program!" I've had mothers in tears by the end of this presentation . . . it REALLY moves people! (It is a lot more polished than this quick description.)

We continue on with talks about Scouts being fun, developing character, and all the stuff we do! We use the points of the Purpose of Cub Scouting here. We talk about costs, time, and even set up Dens and recruit leaders (because this is really already done from the newspaper game we played before). The parents fill out applications. The new leaders fill out applications and get directions on the fast start training and YPT online, and pinky-swear to complete those either that night or the next. We do a Pack Leader Meeting, with new leader orientation, a few nights later; by then the new leader apps should be good to go (now that YPT must happen before the apps can be submitted).

We bring the kids back from the library and the parents are amazed at how their loud and unruly boys go silent when the CM just holds up two fingers! I love that part!! The boys sing the song they learned and recite the Cub Scout Promise.

The parents turn-in completed applications with payments and the new Den Leaders receive packets of info. There's a district rep there to take new apps to council.

The boys are happy and excited, the parents are excited, the Pack has three new Tiger Dens, with six new Tiger Den Leaders, a healthy sprinkling of new Cubs of the other ranks, God is in his heaven, and for that brief moment . . . all is right with the world!!!

Hi Y'all,

This question is not really a fan/not-fan of the new delivery method, but more of a practical application question. (My thoughts on that are that the Den Meetings are pretty good, but the Pack Meetings are weaker and will need a heaping dose of pizzaz added! Anyway . . . )

I'm starting to schedule out the next year's Cub Scouting dates, actually writing the Den Meetings on my calendar . . . (Webelos) Den Mtg #1 - 12 Sep, #2 - 19 Sep, #3 - 10 Oct, and so on.

I've noticed that the new guide has the Webelos building Pinewood Derby cars in April. This timing also shows up in the Base Plan of the Webelos Leader Guide. I looked at Bear, and they're building PWD in March/Apr as well (saw this by counting two meetings per month - not sure if there's a Bear Base Plan to check).

The Pack Meeting Resource Guide shows the Pinewood Derby is "supposed to be" in January, which is when most Packs have traditionally had the PWD. Am I missing something here? It would seem much more logical to be building PWD cars just before the Pack's race?

Anybody else notice this? I know we can move things around, but this seems like this part would have been more streamlined, with it being such a major event in Cub Scouting.

Any thoughts here?(This message has been edited by Reaper)

I know you were asking about Estes bulk rockets in your OP, but one very inexpensive event our Pack just hosted was to build and lunch badminton birdie rockets. I think it was about a dollar for each Cub Scout (main cost was the engines), because we had several launchers and hot glue guns available.

The birdie rockets didn't go up very far and were simple to make and launch; shoot 'em up, they float down. Still valuable lessons of flight, safety, etc. This might be an option if space and/or money is a concern.

We did this as an "all-Pack" activity - Tigers thru Webelos - and no one had problems making these . . . of course, your Webelos might wanna make "real rockets" by using the Estes kits.

Update - Campout is now done . . . The parents in question were "able to rearrange their plans" and Dad was able to take the Wolf on the campout. Dad even told me that he (the Dad) "really didn't want to miss it!"

Looking at this from a bigger-picture view (and a bit of Monday morning quarterbacking thrown in): We did not "short-change" this Cub Scout . . . I'd say we actually "strengthened his relationship with his Dad." Cub Scouts is a "Family Program" (various definitions of family are available, of couse). I don't know if this was a pure Baby-Sitters of America case (parents using Scouts as a babysitting service), but people are gonna do what is most important to them; and since Dad was actually there in the end, I guess "Family" (and Cub Scouting) wins out! Hooray!!

PS - Still no response from National ;-)

Jeffrey - He was saying Tigers couldn't camp parentless (answering my original question).

ALL - My Council has agreed with my thoughts (still waiting for National's response) . . . The Scout (a Wolf) cannot go parentless because of "Family Camping" part of the GTSS (as posted by Scoutfish), I guess taking the view that a parent must actually be there to be responsible for the supervision of their a child [but, this should be "clearer," so the other family member is not a baby brother!].

A Webelos Scout could go parentless because of the blurb in the Age Guidelines of the GTSS (Webelos parent can approve an adult supervisor).

Thanks for the discussion.

Please forgive my late response, just now reading through these, looking for some jems for our upcoming campout.

Hey whereyat Eagle92?!!! Regarding your dead horse on Tchoupitoulas story . . .

My Daddy always told me that the cop said, "Hey, y'all help me drag this thing to Camp Street."

Which is kinda funny, 'cuz EVERYBODY knows Camp is two blocks from Tchoupitoulas!!!

;-)

Can a Cub Scout go on a Pack Overnighter without his parent/guardian?

A Cub in our Pack has registered without a parent for our upcoming campout. The parents were going to let another Dad be the Cub's adult for the campout. Looking beyond the Cub Scouting is a "Family Game" issues (and we could even handle the two-deep issues), is this OK with the BSA?

In GTSS, Pack Overnighters says parents should supervise their Scouts. This sounds like a "YES." But, Family Camping says two members of a family and one is a BSA member. That one sounds like a "NO."

Thoughts??

Our BGB is in our CO's (a school PTO) cafeteria, but food catered by a popular hamburger and hot dog place (Scouts eat free). We have a Fellas Cake Bake (give awards for best Scout theme, tallest, etc, and then that's our dessert). This year for program, each Den is presenting some portion of the History of BSA (BP, Unknown Scout's Good Turn skit, Addition of Cub Scouts, etc.). Craft table at gathering to make a papertowel tube Cub Scout as centerpiece. Webelos I's are being presented their Weblos Rank Badges. A few announcements. Good time!

If this has been answered, please point me in the direction of that answer. Otherwise . . .

One of my Bears is working on his Outdoor Activity Award which at the Bear level requires a Cub to earn the Leave No Trace Award. We all earned LNT last year as Wolves. Does he have to "re-earn" the LNT Award to get his Bear Outdoor Activity Award?

Thanks!