pchadbo

Well, get your scouts who know the acronym, ask them to tell you what each letter means, in their own words.  Determine what percentage of scouts mention a book, manual, or even online app. That percentage will tell you how often "reference" is understood to be part of the method.

 

If it's not the "end all, be all," why bother requiring it?

First of all, if the Scouts do not understand how to use EDGE and that it includes reference material as part of the Explain portion, whoever taught them has failed. Any time you are teaching anything you should always be able to refer the students to something for additional material even if that reference is "it is in your Scout Handbook". 

As to why it is being taught if it is not the end all, be all, nothing is a magic bullet, It is a comprehensive, easy to remember technique for transferring knowledge that is better than most.

Let us not make perfect the enemy of good. 

Where in the EDGE method does it state that you cannot use a reference?  OK I am going to show you how to tie a bowline know, found on page x in your handbook, this knot is used for, A B & C, this is how you tie it, now you can try it, yes that is right, now practice a few more times, Great job!

All four of the Edge steps, with a reference.  Problem solved.  Just a good teaching method, not the end all, be all.

I would suggest simply laughing at the childish actions and moving on with your day, knowing that she was thinking of you.

 

Already in place ... shared between the

1. OA National Chief and
2. President of the National Venturing Youth Cabinet.

 

And for those who are neither eligible for, or in, the OA or Venturing?

Now, THAT is a paycheck worth worling for!

Moments like that make you wonder where all the dust in the air came from. . .

So satisfying when the game with a purpose shines through.

 

On the other hand, monies raised under the assumption of a charitable donation, should not be going to individual scouts' benefit.  Charitable donations are for the organization holding the tax exemption rights.  A scout who "earns" money/monetary benefit through his own efforts should be reporting this as personal income.  People can not make a charitable donation to an individual who does not hold a legal tax-exempt status/permit to do so.

 

However, if a parent makes installment payments to the unit to cover the cost of an activity, it is still the parent's money being held in trust so that such payments can be made at a more conon-profits (nvenient time for the troop and should not be counted as a CO donation.

Yes, I see this distinction, and we could go on about the individual accounts, charitable donations and IRS regs on non-profits (please, lets not), however that does not change the fact that if a Unit has a checking account, the account should be using the CO's Federal Tax ID Number, and therefore, any monies in that account "belongs" to the CO, now they also own any liabilities as well, owing individual parents refunds for pre-paid expenses, outings or events comes to mind, and that is something addressed if and when it ever comes up.  But as a general CYA position, everything should be run through a single account, with at minimum dual controls and transparency to all.

Fred, I am not arguing that the dens cannot and should not have their own "budget" I am just saying by law and right, any monies that the den or pack has in it's trust, is legally the property of the Chartered Organization as they own the pack and all it's assets and liabilities.  As treasurer in this situation, or Unit Commissioner, or Committee Chair or Chartered Org representative, the best practice would be for all funds to be placed in the Pack bank account and individual den ledgers or "accounts" be created to readily track all expenditures. 

A  not unreasonable scenario involves  the Chartered Org being audited, by It's parent organization or the IRS and they want an accounting of all the funds that have been handled by their organization.  At $75 dues per Scout times 90 scouts that is $6750 per year plus other expenses is quickly going to be $10 - 15,000.  This could be a significant portion of the CO's budget. If you are not able to account for that money, in detail, they may face repercussions and the Pack could be harmed and/or need to find a new Chartering Organization.

The thing to remember is that NONE of this money that gets passed to the Den or Pack belongs to the Den or Pack in a legal sense it is the CO's.  So we must be Thrifty and be good stewards of money that does not belong to us.

I personally, as a Pack Leader, would not be comfortable with 3 - 5K "floating around" with no one other than the Den Leader having knowledge or responsibility for these monies. 

That is my opinion and it is worth what was paid for it   ;-)

Welcome to the Forum!

A couple of points of clarification from the Unit Commissioner in me (and former Pack Committe Chair).  First the pack DOES NOT OWN ANYTHING (caps for empahsis). Any money that the Pack or Den collects belongs to your Chartered Organization.  They should have an interest in making sure that the funds are handled in an open and trackable manner, as they bear the financial responsibility for THIER money.

Second, I agree that putting controls in place is a great thing, and am curious as to why anyone would object to covering thier own behind by making sure they were not solely responsible for large amounts of money.

Third, if the fight is too contentious, and those leaders are unwilling to change, in your position, I would say Thank You, but please find another treasurer, as I will not be held responsible for funds I have no control over.

Like the timing, Last night was the last meeting as a youth for our current SPL.  He turns 18 Friday.  We too do the Mr ______ thing for all the aduts, and have had several boys transition in the last year from youth to adult.  Some have adjusted better than others, but all are developing their own style and niche.  fun to watch them sitting on their hands itching to "go fix it" but knowing that is no longer their job.

Service project/yard sale.  We spend 4 or so meeting nights picking up yard sale items from donors in our town and store them in a donated storage trailer, or somebody's garage, or basement or wherever we can find room, then we hold our yard sale and at the end of the day when we are done selling, non-profits can come get the "left overs" or they are put into dumpsters provided by or town (we are cleaning out the houses to make it safer for the firefighters after all, the genesis of the yard sale).  We typically make 8 - 10k from the yard sale with all hands on deck, our 50ish Scouts and parents. Dues are $120 a year to cover all advancement and camping except summer camp, $60 if you participated in the yard sale.  We also sell popcorn and "camp cards" discount cards produced by the Council.

Big production, big results. big options for trips and adventures.

I am firmly in the fun camp.  As evidenced by my son, who now 13 is coming up on 3 years in the troop, and has advanced all the way to Tenderfoot. (this is not a debate as to why that happened, suffice it to say I am comfortable with how he got there and place NO blame on the Troop. you can lead a horse to water. . .)He has however gone camping 30+ times including 4 Weeks at summer camp(s) is looking forward to being a CIT for his local Scout camp next summer as well as possibly going to Cub Scout Camp as a Den Chief. 

I am proud of the young man he is becoming and the skills he is learning.  Advancement, well he will figure that out eventually, or not. . .

Welcome to the virtual campfire! Grab a cuppa, keep your sense of humor and have fun!

The latin Scot,

Hey John, great to see another Scouter from DWC here.  Great Story!

Paul Chadbourne

Unit Commissioner

Wannalancit District

I used to be a staffer N1-330-15 & N1-330-16-2

Got flack from my oldest venturer coming on the next outing:  "Why can't we go on the shorter hike with the rest of the troop? And, why do you add an orienteering course to it?"

 

 

Not to be the Nudge here, but why are you, the adult, doing anything other than being a safety officer in a Crew?  This is THIER program not yours.  You should not be planning or "adding" anything to their program.  That is the job of the Crew President and officers.

;-)

Growing up in Canada there were very few scout/guide camps and they didn't offer programs like the BSA or GSUSA run for their scouts here. If we used a scout owned camp the unit provided the adults and the program. It was awesome. We canoed, cooked, hiked and generally had a blast as kids. We went to national parks, provincial parks and conservation areas. Some were better equipped than the scout camps (showers and flush toilets).

 

Me feeling is that scout camps have a place, but that they should be on a provisional basis across the board. If parents wish to send their scout to summer camp do it. But if you want troop bonding then the troop needs to plan and execute the summer camping experience. I have been to 6 different BSA summer camps over the years and not one fosters troop/patrol bonding. Each scout has his own program and is seldom with his troopmates. Even evening programs foster individuality. Merit badge can come from other sources.

 

My girl scout troop plans and executes a summer program each year and once every 4 years we go to the West Sussex Jamboree (hey Skip you going next year)in England. Our summer camps have been a blast. We have backpacked, gone to a Midwestern city and done the tourist thing, vegged at the side of a great lake for a week, whitewater rafted and rock climbed. The girls research everything, plan it all and arrange the campsites. They make the shopping lists, and do all the cooking. The adults make reservations, drive, aid in shopping, and generally are available to assist when asked. We have a great week too, some of us partake in the activities planned, some just veg with a good book.

 

Very few of my girls go to council provisional camps. They're expensive and bland compared to troop adventures. On the other hand just about every boy goes to council summer camp and adults have to go too. I don't know any troops in my area that even attempt to plan their own adventures. I get the feeling its frowned upon by the BSA.

 

I guess my feeling is we need scout camps to be a resource, trained staff members that can teach/monitor activities that can't be done at home. They don't need to be scout schools with set class periods, pre-reqs and report cards (blue cards). Imagine a camp where scouts get up in the morning on their (the troop's) timeframe, make and clean up breakfast, the scouts pick an activity or 2 for the day and head off for some fun in the sun. Back for dinner and troop time around a campfire or an evening swim at the lake.No stress, no classes, kids being kids and playing and having fun.

 

Oh, but we can't have that happen, BSA would have a fit. No merit badges, no progress towards Eagle, no badge sales income. How anit-scouting could I get ;-)

You have basically described Daniel Webster Council's Camp Bell, in NH.  All patrol based program, boys are responsible for all meals, the camp does not have a dining hall, and while they may earn a merit badge or two, my son earned Horsemanship this summer, they are definitely not run of the mill.

I too, will miss Moosetracker, although after getting to know her online, I had the joy and priveledge of getting to know her in "real life" I served on her training team and helped her son and husband get into trouble.  I will make sure that the hugs I give the family are big enough to come from her whole online family as well.

God Speed until we meet again

Fred,

I apperciate your concern, however there are reasons for NOT including hard numbers. Lets say Larry Life Scout puts in a proposal for an Eagle project to collect food for the local food pantry, will build collection boxes, have them manned 4 weekends and will collect 1500 pieces of food. An admirable goal to be sure, with the organization and leadership skills displayed. Now Larry does exactly what he says he is going to do in fact even gets to add a weekend for collection and collects 1400 pieces of food. Did he complete his Eagle project, by your request to include hard numbers and hold them to them, no he did not complete his Eagle project.

Had Larry worded his proposal as collecting a significant amount of food for the pantry, he would have made Eagle.

I understand the sentiment as someties the Larry Life Scouts do thi project, collect 100 pieces and call it "Significant" this is where the oversight of the benfactor as well as the SM and others involved in the process comes in. Not to mention, a Scout is Honest.

A big monkey in with the wrenches for sure, but as with other requirements, after the initial grumbling it will settle down.

The bigger question, can the State of PA get all those background checks done in 6 months?

The Feds may have some say in the Mississississppi (oh heck) bus bill. The CDL laws were mandated to be uniform across the country.

Or, they choose to leave it alone as the "C" in CDL is Commercial. Hard to argue that the interstate commerce clause applies to volunteers driving the church bus.

Now, that being said:

"To be honest, I've driven vehicles much larger and heavier than a 30-passenger vehicle, including some very large, long, ornate and very, very expensive motor coaches ($500 k) without any special driving endorsement."

This scares me a little. I thing thee needs to be an RV licensing process for the larger units as it is a far stretch from a Smart Car to a 42 foot diesel pusher motor home, yet the licensing is the same. . . same to be said for that crew cab dually truck hauling the 40 foot 5th wheel trailer too.

A small hop maybe, but not a leap. a yellow flag was was what was called for above, yes it is a stretch for YP violation, but one of the first steps is making the boy feel special, this may be that. It is more the appearance of impropriety than anything else, but it warrants a look.

Welcome to the virtual Campfire, grab a cuppa, enjoy the snacks you brought and Have Fun!

As "just the Commitee Chair", you work with the COR and find new ones.

How does WB relate to venturing? patrols? (none in crews) Which uniform? . if i wore our "official" crew uniform I'd stick out like I had two heads.

Depends on the course, on mine, the SPL, a troop guide and 4 participants plus several instructors were in thier Crew uniforms (most went with the green uniforms) but Venturing as well as Cub Scouts are part of Wood Badge, heck they even let in Varsity Scouters. ;-)

", put them in a room, and have them hash out what kinds of things they'd like to do/see at their camporee. It should be what they want to do and not what I want them to do. (Even though a Green-Bar-Bill-themed camporee would be AWESOME!)"

Yep, that is what should happen. Give them your idea, see if they want to run with it, then get out of thier way.

A couple years ago a troop of boys decided to do a nighttime Zombiw Apocolypse themed Camporee in our District. Word got around and the Coucil Exec called the Scoutmaster to change the theme. HIs response: "the PLC meets on this date, you want to tell them to change thier camporee, you tell them"

Needless to say he did not show up and our District Camporee had more attendees than the other 3 District Camporees held the same weekend, combined.