Mike F

We were about #1000 on the waiting list for this summer. I got a letter today saying they have had an unprecidented number of drops and have worked their way through the entire waiting list. They are giving waiting list folks one more opportunity before opening up the opportunity for new crews. We're heading to Sea Base and can't swing two HA trips in one summer. For some very lucky folks, it's time to jump-start your training and fitness program for the adventure of a lifetime!

bnelon44, You bring up another important point which impacts "chaos theory." In the troop I serve, we always encourage the boys to elect/select the best available leaders for each position. As a result, it's not uncommon for PLs to serve 2 or more terms, although not necessarily consecutively. Most SPLs only serve one term, but we've had several who served for a full year. Same is true for other PORs. The more seasoned leaders are more comfortable and effective. They have all commented on how much more they enjoyed the second term because they were finally getting the hang of this leaders

I'll have to say I don't think "total chaos" is necessarily a positive measure of merit. In the troop I serve, the older boys demand discipline. Within a few weeks of crossover, we have a silent, still formation with each scout in line looking toward the front. If someone starts to twitch, he'll have several surrounding boys give him the eye of disapproval. It's amazing how quickly they catch on. When it's time to play, they are loud and boisterous. When it's time to work, they're pretty much down to business. This isn't 100%, but very close. It didn't come easy, either. Older b

Kudu - I just noticed - welcome back. Coffee is a little thick. Let's finish it and start a new pot. We've missed your voice.

CPA Mom, If as you describe, Troop A is on life support and Troop B is probably in trouble because Boy Scouts is not supposed to be just more school. From the boy's point of view, it's about fun, friends, and adventure. Ask more questions about Troop B's retention and level of activity. With every similar troop I've known, over half of their new scouts drop in the first 2 years and virtually all have become inactive (not camping, not running the troop, etc) by the time they are in High School. The guys have been in school all day. They don't really want to come to scouts just to

I reckon we all struggle in this area and most have a few scars if we try and maintain integrity in the system. Specific things like participation percentages can be expectations, but it gets messy when someone tries to make them requirements. If a scout is falling short of the expectations, its time to take a closer look to make sure theyre still meeting the requirements of the job. We use a written contract tailored to each POR. They are discussed as part of Troop JLT. It is signed by the leader, his immediate boss, and SPL. We make them available for interested parents. At the end

Exibar, We just did something like this as part of an annual survival campout. It got some discussion here: http://www.scouter.com/Forums/viewThread.asp?threadID=265429 You can find a fairly comprehensive description of what we ended up doing on Page 4. This was a new experience for almost all of our guys, but well received. Go for it!!

Night is a great time for some skill action, too! A couple of our favorites: 1. Night orienteering competition. We do this at least once a year as a troop. Last year we ran it as an official event at District Camporee. 2. Night compass course in canoes. Guys do 3-4 legs of a compass course on the lake and place a survey marker at their final location. We do this about every 5-6 years, so it's a totally unexpected skill competition when it happens. (We don't use distance - just follow bearing until hit shore, then head out on next bearing, so they are effectively bouncing around

On our first one, we threw down near cars with tents/sleeping bags on Fri night. After quick breakfast on Sat morning, the tents and bags were loaded into cars and we hiked into the forest to start the scenarios. The senior staff was wondering what we would be doing in the afternoon. They were shocked to find out how much work surviving required. (Low temps around 45F, no rain.) Great stuff!

allangr, Sounds like fun! Is this the troop's first survival campout? Please tell us how it goes.

Buff's old thread is full of excellent ideas! This annual activity was initiated solely by our PLC about 4-5 years ago. It has become their favorite campout of the year. Since it's pretty hard-core, we always do it in Feb, just before the new cross-overs start joining. We always do it on a remote bit of National Forest and leave branches/poles/boughs in natural-looking brush piles for animal shelters. Our staff and adults all do the same things - using only the materials the boys have, with the exception of a little bit of coffee. Options: - Allow them to have day packs wit

Wow lots to comment on! Engineer, If you thought I was making an excuse, I wasnt clear. I am very proud of my guys for coming up with some exciting ideas and taking the initiative to figure out how to make them happen. Im not making an excuse Im sharing a victory. We have no vegetarians in the troop I serve, so everyone is involved in the death of living animals for food, even if they dont think about that part of the process. Local public sentiment? Irrelevant as far as Im concerned. We dont take a community poll before doing what we believe is right within the boundaries establ

From the lack of information, it sounds to me like there's also at least a threat of legal action here. In my not-so-humble opinion, that rarely makes things better. Hope they can get it resolved so the young man and everyone can move on. It would also be valuable to find out what exactly did happen so we can all avoid it!

I know we had one scout family who decided not to attend because of the planned rabbit dinner, but 25 scouts had a great experience with some saying this was the best campout ever. Not just because of the rabbit, but more due to the survival scenario and challenges they faced. The scout who skipped the campout has been active since and nobody buy me knows why he wasn't there. It's no big deal. We camp all year and he's free to skip one for whatever reason. Or he's free to transfer to another local troop if he doesn't like our program. By the way, this wasn't just a Survival MB course

asichacker, Wow - according to your profile, your interests are "Youth baseball coach, no involvement in Scouting. Don''t see Scouting as beneficial." I appreciate the work you do as a coach. My boys all played baseball and I'm glad guys like you had the skills and desire to share your passion for the game with them. I never slammed my kid's coaches because I knew they understood the details of the game and instruction better than me. And I have never been inclined to wander by the local ball fields to criticize coaches of random teams. Why do you feel a need to wander by this f

Update. We had a very successful survival campout last weekend and enjoyed delicious fresh rabbit! Found a place to buy live rabbits which had been raised for food and we brought them in on Saturday afternoon. SPL and his Senior Staff killed the rabbits humanely and placed the rabbits in patrol snares. Patrols brought their rabbits to central location for coaching and assistance in cleaning. Some of the boys were willing to get their hands dirty and some watched from the edge with apprehension. Some patrols had a small container for boiling rabbit into soup. Others cooked theirs

UPDATE: PLC and Instructors have now been trained in dispatching and dressing a rabbit. All parents were consulted, talked it over with sons, and gave consent. Looks like we're on our way to a legendary survival campout!

We already have a troop rule: If you kill anything bigger than a cockroach, you eat it. I know it's not in the Wilderness Survival MB any more, but we always have the patrols building snares and traps on these campouts. If they do a good job, they are rewarded a store-bought chicken or two. If they don't do a good job, they stay a little more hungry. The truth is, the energy required to build the snares and traps is very unlikely to be offset with captured prey and is unnecessary in most situations, but it's a cool skill that boys want to know.(This message has been edited by Mike F

We have found sources for both live rabbits and chickens raised to sell for food - no problem there. We did a chicken on a survival campout a few years ago - the guys are still talking about it - and now the current PLC wants to go one better with live rabbits. (I agree - cleaning rabbits is much easier - but more emotional because they're cute and they are sometimes pets. Important tip: Do not give your dinner a name!) We're negotiating with concerned parents now. Will probably spare the guys the up-close-and-disturbing part by giving patrols rabbits which are freshly killed and boy

Our guys are working on survival skills leading up to next campout. PLC wants to demonstrate how to kill, clean, and cook a domestic animal like a rabbit or chicken. We have adults who are ready, willing, and able to teach this skill to a few senior boys so they can do demonstrations at the patrol level. I really like it when the guys lean forward to try something new, but one parent objects to the guys killing living animals when it's not really a survival situation. We certainly won't force this activity on any boy or family who objects, but I also want to know if BSA says anyth

asichacker, I may have gotten a little carried away in my last post. From your son's point of view right now, it's all about Fun, Friends, and Adventure. These are the things which should be making him want to be in Boy Scouts. In a few years, he'll start to feel the need to start controlling some portion of his world. At that time, Scouting leadership opportunities will help him grow a lot. No sweat if you're not interested in the camping. Volunteer to assist on the Troop Committee, drive and drop-off on campouts, etc, and you'll be welcome in any troop!

I know Jeff - he's a great guy. His son was in our troop, so I knew him from the dad's point-of-view. Aloha Council was his first SE job. Previously he had worked mostly on the money side of things. It's sad, but that tends to be the biggest part of SE job, too.

If you've only visited them once, you might go back with or without your son to get to know them better. Don't be pulled aside to get more sales pitch. Spend the time observing closely for any signs of negative attitude and to see what makes them tick. Spend some time chatting with one or two experienced adults to understand their philosophy of delivering the program. Every boy has a personality and every troop has a personality. It's important to find a good match. In fact, I think this is much more important than Web buddies all going to the same troop, unless they all had very similar perso

Lots of good ideas and comments! If attendance is low because someone is scared off, be sure to take lots of pictures, then show a slide show at troop meeting and/or Court of Honor and tell some "war stories" so guys will be determined not to miss the next big event.

Along with a host of other skills, a Super Cub/Web Leader is one who has great organizational skills and a passion for making sure everything is properly prepared, communicated, and executed according to his/her excellent plan. They go into shock when they move into most boy-run troops where we allow the boys to make mistakes and learn from them. What they see at the meetings and campouts is older boys being inefficient at running things and adults (SM and Staff) who obviously don't care or they would be jumping in to take over. They don't see the behind the scenes PLCs, Troop JLTs, and week