MattR

3 hours ago, SiouxRanger said:

How does one even determine which tribes occupied their area, and their current representatives?

Hi @AshB  and welcome to the forum. Unfortunately this post is from 2011 and I suspect @travers211 doesn't follow this forum anymore. Try sending him a PM, or maybe this will get someone more recent to help you out.

On 1/4/2023 at 10:39 AM, Leehoden said:

However, those scouts are now feeling like to much emphasis is placed on younger scouts ranking up and not enough on them. I am wondering how other Troops find a happy medium.

There's a lot here to think about.

"scouts are now feeling like to much emphasis is placed on younger scouts" Do the older scouts make the program or the adults? If the older scouts are really owning the responsibility for the troop then they're the ones that should be grappling with this problem.

"ranking up and not enough on them" As others have said, the emphasis should be on fun that just happens to cover the skills needed. That, and a bit more time to sign stuff off and advancement is taken care of.

"find a happy medium" If it's a zero sum game then there will always be losers. The challenge is to figure out how to encourage the older scouts to own and enjoy the responsibility for both themselves and the younger scouts. Of course they get bored teaching knots to sign off scouts. Adults do as well. What scouts have that adults don't is a keen sense of playing. Take advantage of that. Show them how to make it a game. That and some great high adventure trips and everyone will have fun. It's when the older scouts are looking out for the younger scouts and the younger scouts are looking up to the older scouts that you've hit the sweet spot. It's never perfect but it can be much more fun than "advancement" meetings. As long as the older scouts are having fun with friends they will stick around.

Welcome to the forum, @Leehoden

10 hours ago, xinaDeRockie said:

You are correct!  SD, not NM. I've been researching patrol-style cooking at the various  summer camps and my focus was in NM.

Now it makes sense.  Better than that I've been to MM and it sounds like they've improved their patrol cooking. We were there years ago and the patrol cooking had problems. I've always liked the idea but seen it not very well thought out, or worse. But when it works it can be great training for patrols.

I hope you enjoyed all the fun things to see nearby. I really liked the caves.

Welcome to the forum, @xinaDeRockie.

The only scout ranch that I know of called Medicine Mountain is in South Dakota by Mt Rushmore.

This has absolutely nothing to do with scouting. Why was this posted under program?

15 hours ago, Cburkhardt said:

MattR:

Our all-girl troop meets twice a month on Saturday mornings from 10 to Noon.  The PLC meets immediately before every other meeting.  The attention span of girls this age allows us to cover the program, in addition to our monthly campouts.  The remaining “free” Saturday each month is often when optional service projects, hikes and other activities take place.

I suspect the increased attention has more to do with a good night's sleep and a 10am meeting then chromosomes. Our girls troop is just as distracted as the boys troop.

Anyway, I'd certainly like to have meetings on weekends but one issue with planning activities nearly every weekend is, well, that's a huge time commitment. How do scouts with other activities deal with it? How do parents with spouses juggle that?

On 12/18/2022 at 1:47 PM, Cburkhardt said:

As examples, the all-girl troops have longer meetings (because of longer attention spans) that are not scheduled at night (avoiding walking home in the dark).

So you have meetings on weekends? Or after school?

19 hours ago, LostLeader said:

Anyone have any ideas?

As @RememberSchiff says, talk to @Cambridgeskip as he's an adult in a UK troop.

On 12/18/2022 at 9:44 AM, KublaiKen said:

A surplus water buffalo? When I was a kid someone had one in our District and brought it to Camporees.

Back when we had 70 scouts we had a big water buffalo that we mounted to a flatbed trailer. I think it was at least 100 gallons.

We have to bring all of our water to most campouts. It's a lot more efficient for us to bring a bunch of 7 gal. water jugs (The scouts bring a full water bottle) than have each scout bring 2 gallons. The water is being brought to camp either way.

If it’s a long term camp they have water and we just bring the empty jugs. If we're backpacking then scouts bring 2 or 3 quart sized bottles or a waterbag like a camelback.

@Cburkhardt, I'm trying to understand your overall comments. I see the need for some form of exoneration if there has been a formal accusation of abuse. I'm assuming that in this case it's all just Mr P implying it might have happened and the council just dropped it with no written record. Are you saying a) there would always be a written record or b) it doesn't matter,  just an implied accusation should be followed up with a formal exoneration?

31 minutes ago, fred8033 said:

Scouts are supposed to be active.  21 merit badges and too many are redundant with school or just boring paperwork.  Now, we have yet another.  Four citizenship MBs is just too many.  ... Five actually ... family, society, nation, world, society?  What next?  Universe?  ... Citizen of the Ecology?  

How about replacing all of those with the only one that a scout can actually do - Citizenship in the Patrol? Elect a new PL. Solve a problem. Decide on something fun to do. Do it. Talk about how it went. Really easy if the patrol is run well and a tool to use when it's not.

Why are nearly a quarter of all the MBs needed not supporting the fundamentals of learning by doing? You can't do Citizenship in the World. No matter how noble it is to understand this subject it's a square peg in a round hole. Scouting is supposed to be a microcosm of the real world where a scout can learn and take skills to the bigger world outside of scouting.

Welcome to the forum, @TheGreenWizard.

To answer your question, first, we've beat this horse to death elsewhere. Next, I've decided that advancement is not anything I care about anymore. It is the source of nearly all the problems I've seen on this forum. The scouts, when put in such a predicament, just suck it up and treat the offending requirement as a hoop they have to jump through. It's all just a game for them so I've decided to learn from the masters. I'd rather make a game that reinforces a skill. That, the scouts will play and enjoy.

I merged the 3 threads into 1 and kept the last title as everyone has seen it most recently.

16 minutes ago, Cburkhardt said:

If falsely accused of YPT abuse, have the CO investigate and exonerate

I'm not going to switch between threads to check this (is it okay if I combine these threads?), but this case sounds more like a parent just being an ass - insinuated abuse but not reported to anyone that has a record of it? I'd find out who has what record before hiring a lawyer.

That all said, Mr P sounds like one of those rare parents that SMs have to deal with. If he's only listed as an ASM then I'd let him know his services are no longer required and that if he does show up the police will be called. I say that because I had to do that once.

While I agree with @Eagledadthat talking through problems is normally the right way to go, you only have so much time and adults that insinuate abuse as a power play are just taking up your time that could be better spent with scouts.

@RainShine, my impression is you're still wound up about this and rightfully so. And yet, your committee went to bat for you. I believe your council did as well. That says a lot. Nobody becomes SM to put up with this sort of thing and hopefully this is the last time you have to deal with a parent like this. Your troop appreciates what you do. The scouts look up to you. Focus on that while you clean up this mess.

7 hours ago, RainShine said:

Until this past week. What happened this past week? Ah, dear reader, Part 2

Let me guess. The recharter paperwork came back and you're no longer the SM?

Either way, having a good relationship with the CO is a really important goal of unit leadership. That's what prevents surprises, at least the kind that come in two parts.

I wish you the best.

My troop hiked up Mount Washington when I was a young scout. I wonder if this is the same one. There was a weather station on top that could handle 100 mph winds.

Really? I got a 10% reduction in pay even though I also got promoted. I'm just glad to have a job.

One rule about signing off on rather subjective requirements is that there should be no surprises. I.e., it should be very clear to the scouts what's expected.

You're new so you're learning. Take it as a lesson for next time but sign off on this scout. Set expectations for everyone going forward, including this scout.

Speaking of which, what are the expectations of the spl and does this scout really know them? Even well meaning but sorta lazy teenagers require a lot of interaction with the SM to teach, coach and get them comfortable doing their por.

I stopped the mix and mash approach and did exactly as you suggest, @curious_scouter. The small patrols enjoyed it because it's a lot easier to cook and clean for 2 or 3 than 8. I said it's their choice. Nobody ever wanted to camp as a single person patrol, 2 worked if they were good friends, 3 or 4 was always a good experience.

I should add it was more of a struggle to get the adults to agree with this. Now that I'm no longer SM, some old adult-think has crept back in. Mix and match patrols, "advancement" meetings. In some other thread someone brought up the best check on a plan: will it be fun? Can it be fun? If not, how do we change it? I was more interested in coaching fun than whatever it is that most adults fixate on. And I have no idea why that was such a struggle.

We got 5lb propane tanks for the patrols. The 1lb tanks have problems in cold weather. Unfortunately, the bigger tanks have their own issues.

I'm trying to imagine a youth baseball team run like a scout troop with ranks and BORs. "You can't retest a player's plate sliding skill at a BOR. You can talk to them about how they learned the skill or how they taught the skill but you can't test the skill." That would never happen.

I read these discussions, and I've participated in them before, but now it just says to me that there's something wrong. The test for a sports player is on the field. The test for a 4H participant is in their garage or barn. The test for the orchestra is on the stage. The adults aren't needed for the test.

The real skills used in scouts has  very little to do with ranks and advancement. Advancement is just a way to motivate scouts to play the game, where they'll learn teamwork,  the scout law and the outdoors. To me, that's the problem with the BSA's version of scouting. The motivation is one step removed from the game. The game should be the only motivation.

Rather than have long complicated documents about how advancement should be run I'd much rather see help on how to motivate scouts to just play the game.

Welcome to the forum, @feistyscoutmom .

18 hours ago, feistyscoutmom said:

the old pack master that is now cc has never liked me and has accused me several times of gossiping about the pack and members

Why?

18 hours ago, feistyscoutmom said:

I recently recieved a very nasty text from the cc stating that if I didn't quit ...

Quit what? Do you have a leadership position? Will your son have to go as well?

19 hours ago, feistyscoutmom said:

... she would kick out my son

A CC that uses a child as leverage to remove an adult is a mess.

Clearly, you and the CC don't get along. But let's face it, you picked the name @feistyscoutmom. Is it possible that you're both a bit feisty?

Scouts is a volunteer organization of loosely affiliated organizations. There are units that belong to chartered orgs. There are councils that don't really like getting involved in people problems in units. Technically, your pack belongs to the chartered org so they might be a start of where to find someone that wants to get involved, if they're at all interested in getting involved in this. Technically, the CC is the one that's responsible for filling leadership positions in the pack. That said, scouters in a unit is really a group of people that just need to get along with each other. So the question to ask is how do a group of volunteers solve their people problems?

My suggestion is get some third party involved or just walk away. This battle isn't worth it because I suspect nobody will win.