Marty_Doyle

Try this:

http://www.ntier.org/index.html

Go to documents and download the Trading Post Catalog for 2004.

They offer a red 100% wool shirt-jac, made by a US manufacturer - Bemidji Woolen Mills, with BSA logo patch already sewn on pocket, two button-down pockets plus two hand-warmer pockets. Only $89.99 plus shipping.

Much better deal than the one in the National catalog. Warm, extra pockets, looks just like the National one, sold by a BSA High Adventure Ccamp Trading Post, for almost half the price.

My wife got it for my last Christmas, and everyone wanted to know where it came from at my Wood Badge course.

(This message has been edited by Marty_Doyle)

I guess if you can order the following from your Scout Shop, it should satisfy you:

# 57-491 Charter and Bylaws of the BSA

# 57-492 Rule and Regulations of the BSA

Though I do recall someone saying something to the effect that since these documents mainly apply to how Councils should be administered, and not how units should be administered, only Councils may be able to receive them.

Finished the first weekend of NE-II-132 on the 11th, looking forward to the second weekend on the 30th.

So, I'm still a Beaver, and a good old Beaver too.

Because if you can't put "New" and "Improved" and "Updated" on the cover (even if it isn't), then it won't sell. Or so the prevailing Madison Avenue mentality goes.

Of course, Irish nationalists serving in both the Conferderate and Union armies realized Proud Eagle's last point and formed a Feinian army, made up of Civil War veterans. This army "invaded" Canada from US soil a number of times in 1866-1870, but was defeated each time.

And didn't some US presidential candidate run under the slogan "54.40 or Fight", which would have meant "annexing" a huge slice of Canada?

So the US, or it's citizens, have actually invaded Canada a number of times, and our politicians have occasionally called for the annexation of pieces of Canada.

Oh yeah, and there was some brouhaha over the US Army War College developing plans regarding an invasion of Canada in the 1920's.

Ain't history interestin'?

The Klan.

"Teacher, is this going to be on the quiz?"

While we do not really want to go down that road, there is a middle gound that we need to find. The Scouts need to learn the appropriate information to advance, and yet they need to get the appropriate real world info.

Last night, I had the "privilege" of being a victim for a first aid demomnstration at my son's troop meeting. I had "a bleeding head wound, a profusely bleeding cut on my left arm and a broken right lower leg." The patrol treating me put a splint on my left leg. I told them that I had passed out from pain first when they moved the broken leg to spint the well leg and then again when they elevated the broken leg to help treat me for shock. The SPL came over to check, told them they did a good job with the splint, but had put it on the wrong leg. It would cost them points at the upcoming camporee, but in the real world, it would probably have been easier to figure out which leg to splint. (The PL then said "We put the splint on the leg that was on our left......" The SPL replied that that response would usually result in further deductions, but splinting the wrong leg was already at zero).

I felt that the SPL handled the situation pretty well - you followed BSA here, and did okay, but, in the real world, think about this...which is what we are ultimately talking about. Transmitting appropriate advancement information, plus relevant real world info,in a way that the Scouts will remember.(This message has been edited by Marty_Doyle)

In what seems like decades ago (because it was), when I received by Webelos badge in a ceremony in the school auditorium, I walked to the other side of the auditorium, where the Scoutmaster of the Tropp associated with the school was waiting, with the Troop. Mr Sevenoaks (I still think that is a great name for a Scoutmaster) asked each of us a few questions, and then gave us the Scout(?) badge and welcomed us into the troop.

My son crossed over last Friday, and when he and his three buddies walked over the bridge, the Scoutmaster gave each a Troop hat, Troop neckerchief, Boy Scout neckerchief slide and red loops (the Pack gave them the Handbook and a Scout Stave).

At his first Troop meeting Tuesday, the whole troop welcomed all four boys, and then they started in on Tenderfoot physicial fitness training.

Not every boy turned in the application or medical form or completed the pamphlet exercises, so the Scoutmaster may be waiting until one of the next Troop meetings to award the seven new Boy Scouts (three from another Pack) their Scout badge.

I am probably one of the few "new" Boy Scout parents that knows about the Scout badge.

I would guess that the other parents would characterize their sons as working on Tenderfoot, since that what their new PL told them they were working on - Tenderfoot fitness requirement 10a - quarter mile walk/run and long jump.

An honest mistake.

Somehow, a thread about food in Issues and Politics inevitably leads OGE to a song.......

isn't stream of consciousness posting great?

You're expecting way too much logic and business sense from a non-profit, FOG.

That's why my council thinks it makes good economic, financial and strategic planning sense to sell a one of a kind piece of real estate (camp) to get funding that they say they will use to keep up the other real estate (camps) and also rent out facilities to replace the one they sold.

Selling your house so you can rent an apartment.....financial planners always recommend that.

OXCOPS, keep bringing it up. Ultimately, squeaky wheels get oiled.(This message has been edited by Marty_Doyle)

I was actually thinking that OGE was really "with it" and "kewl" until he said "which as most any hipster knows".

I'm pretty sure "hipster" was out of vogue before disco was "in".

Another current favorite of the senior Webelos is "Sweet". Everything (except girls and food) seems to be "Sweet".

I can't define "cool", but it is a thing that as leaders we should be aware of, because it impacts recruiting and retention. If they are not here, they will get no benefit from the program.

Being way older than the current crop of Cub and Boy Scouts, I asked the resident expert on "cool" in our house for help - my nine year old daughter.

She said my son is "cool" because he is a fifth grader. Therefore, since he is the "big fish", being in Cub Scouts doesn't detract from that. And no one in elementary school comments on it very much. Cub Scouts isn't cool or uncool, it just is. Like band or chorus or being in a school play, all of which are fun, but may become "cool" or "uncool" in the next great phase.

Middle school.

In our town there are five public elementaty schools. So there are five sets of fifth graders, who are "cool" and looked up to, in spite of what activities they are involved in, because they are fifth graders.

There are only two middle schools in town, and all of those "big fish" fifth graders become the "little minnow" sixth graders, in a much bigger pond. Fitting in becomes more important. Peer pressure is greater. Being different is not "cool". Boy Scouts are a minority which, coupled with the "goody-two-shoes" image, suddenly makes them "un-cool".

But, her brother will still be "cool", even though he teases her too much, because in addition to being a Boy Scout, he is really smart, he will play baseball and soccer, be on the newspaper, probabaly be class president, go camping, be nice and kind and help people.

(There were many "omigosh"es and "like"s in her explanation, which I editted out).

I find it interesting that the purposes of Scouting - leadership, physical and mental fitness, good character - would be the things that my daughter would identify as outweighing the "uncoolness" of Scouting.

My son is oblivious to all of this, and says it is just his sister's blatherings. But I think she is probably a little more in tune then he.

Part of me thinks that we should be marketing it that way - Scouting is so beyond "cool" that it looks "uncool" to you. Sort of Elvis Costello cool.

According to the Council website, there are 22 thousand Scouts in the various programs in Greater Niagara Frontier, and only one Scout Shop.

So the volume could be there to "glom" $40 K per annum.

The problem is that it would have to be $40K in cash (unless Mrs. M was dealing with other criminals, who would cash checks made out to the Council for her). That's around $160 in cash per day, every day the Shop was open (assuming 250 business days a year). Tough not to notice, espcially when she was on vacation.

Obviously, she was the person reviewing the register tapes, counting the recipts and making the bank deposits, as well as keeping the books. Supervision, timely reporting and separation of duties is usually the cure.

Hope they are able to recoup it.

I don't think BSA owns the rights to "Pinewood Derby", so there probably will not be a lawsuit. Also, there is a lot of Scouting stuff in the movie - it is Cub Scouts, with uniforms, Packs et cetera. The producers must have cleared it with BSA.

The Scouts appear to be mostly in correct Cub Scout uniform in the trailer, but from the wrong era. What's with the 1960's "beanies" on the Cub Scouts in the Derby crowd shots? (Is there a comeback in the works? It would be cheaper than than the current four baseball cap/neckerchief scheme - four because Tigers go to blue uniforms with orange neckerchief this year). Also, the uniform pants have yellow piping, and most of the Cubs wear yellow neckerchiefs, save the Webelos, who have the plaid.

It was a short trailer.....(This message has been edited by Marty_Doyle)

This was the first year of leadership for all but the Webelos II den leaders, so the new leaders were not ready at the start of the year to think too much about den outings.

So, as a Pack, we decided to plan a number of events that all dens could participate in. Most events, excluding the few I listed, had around 15 Scouts attending - the Pack is currently at 28 boys, so I considered that a decent attendance rate. (Also, my first Pack calendar only had a few more events that the two previous Cubmaster's versions, so the Cubs kind of expect a full calendar - I have copies going back 10 years. I added a summertime event in August, 3 service projects, split out the Derby and B&G, and added 2 hikes).

By January, the "fear" of den outings had changed. The Webelos I's went on a tour of Yankee Stadium (initially as a den), visited the mayor and town court, and attended a high school football game. The Wolves went to West Point, visited the police and firehouse, and did a den service project at a school for the deaf. The Tigers tagged along on a couple of the Wolf outings, coordinated by the leaders. (We currently have no Bears).

The Webelos II's did a number of events with the three Scout troops in town.

So far, we have not cancelled anything but the Columbus Day parade - which was the City, not us.

I think next year there will be a growth in den outings, and Pack outings should be scaled back somewhat. Only so many weekends available.

I am thinking of adding some kind of bike safety event with the local police when the county closes the Hutchinson Parkway to cars during the spring and summer.

I went with the expedition hat. I was tempted to go with the DI hat, but the Mrs. felt that the expedition hat went best with the red shirt-jac she got me from Northern Tier for Christmas. Couldn't locate an adult generic CS hat.

(This message has been edited by Marty_Doyle)(This message has been edited by Marty_Doyle)

Our Pack "year" runs from September 1 to August 31, based on the "way it has always been done".

So, that means it is time for me, as CM, to start thinking about what next year's calendar should look like (I need to get a request in to the public school facilities department soon to secure dates for Pack events run at the school - our CO is the school PTA).

This year's calendar had a Pack Night every month, usually on the last Friday of each month, at least one Pack event each month, participation in the Council's Popcorn sales and as many district and council events as we know of in advance, and a leader's meeting each month, usually the Wednesday nine days before the Pack Night. The other monthly Pack events included the following:

September: two recruiting nights and one parent's orientation night for returning Scouts, and a themed Pack Night that included a pot-luck dinner to "Welcome Aboard and Welcome Back", plus participation in the Council's Scouting for Food drive

October: participation in the Council's "Thunderbird Games", a day long event for all the Council's Tiger, Cub and Webelos Scouts, with Boy Scout and Venturer help, including JOTA, JOTI, and an overnight family camp out, march in the town's Columbus Day parade and a service project at the school

November: first of three family swim nights at the Council Aquatic Center and particpation in the local Marine Corps League Toys for Tots drive

December: first of two family skating afternoons at town skating rink, service project visting local nursing home, and themed Pack Night with Holiday party with Parent-Son cake bake and finish of Toys for Tots drive

January: second family swim and Pinewood Derby, on a Saturday (not part of monthly Pack Night)

February: second family skate, Blue and Gold on a Saturday, pot-luck style (separate from the Pack Night), and participation in the Council Bowl-a-ree for Special Needs Scouting

March: march in the town's St. Patrick's Day parade, camp-in on Battleship Massachusetts

April: third family swim, particpation in district PWD championships, Earth Day clean up at town park May: second pack nature hike, in conjunction with Jamboree on the Trail, second service project to clean-up at school grounds, march in town's Memorial Day parade,and participate in Council's Akela Campout, which includes family camping at council campgrounds, all day crafts for all levels of Cub Scouts and a Tiger cross-over

June: Pack Picnic with "graduation" ceremony

July: attend local minor league baseball game, with tailgate party beforehand

August: Raingutter Regatta and other events one Saturday at school

Depending on how the Webelos II are doing, the March or April Pack Night would be mainly devoted to an Arrow of Light and Bridging ceremony.

This is something new that I pushed, and the April 30th Pack Night this year has four of the five Webelos IIs getting their AoL and crossing into a troop. First time we have awarded the AoL or crossed any boy to a troop in two years.

This was my first year as CM. Some "failures" in the calendar: Columbus Day parade was cancelled by town, attendance at second and third swim nights dropped dramatically (due to Council announcing sale of facility after first one?), skating events poorly attended (conflict with holidays in December?).

Most other events were big hits with kids.

I made one change to the above - in June we are going to a minor league baseball game, since the team allows Scouts to camp out in the outfielfd after the game. The Picnic will be in July.

I will essentially follow the same format for next year, replacing the Battleship event with a lock- in at a local aquarium (sleeping with the sharks). After discussion with parents and pack leaders, I will be dropping two swim nights (there will not be a Council facility next year except the local YMCA, which will cost more that $25), one nature hike, and one skate afternoon. I will move the Cake Bake to be part of B&G, and try to squeeze in another Pack camping event.

Any ideas on what new events to add or general suggetsions?

Thanks

So I looked at the ad above, thinking I might get a DI hat for myself......

when I thought how cool the color guard in our flag ceremonies and parades would look wearing those white British Army "Zulu" helmets. And the Cub Scouts would want to take part in flag ceremonies. We'll see what the budget allows...

As KS, TwoCubDad, Hunt and ASM1 said, don't buy the magazine, turn the channel, skip over the post. Your choice.

An organized "campaign" seems un-Scoutlike and un-American. I didn't squelch Wheeler, why would I "shun" or "boycott" FOG?

I think Eamonn or OGE said it first, some of what FOG posts is deliberate chain-jerking, sometimes to elicit a specific discussion on a subject that is of importance to him.

And some of it is plain old Bob White bashing.

Most of the posters are "adult" in age, if not behaviour. Part of what we are supposed to be teaching Scouts through "Adult Association" is that not every adult in life is kind, fair or Fred MacMurray in "Follow Me, Boys". There are people like FOG appears to be in some of his posts in the real world. Scouts need to learn to deal with them, too.

FOG is entitled to his tone and his opinions. You are entitled to not agree with either. None of us follows the Scout Oath and Law 100% of the time - we are human.

(This message has been edited by Marty_Doyle)

Just went to one March 6. Some of the better offerings (IMHO):

An intro course to Packmaster/Troopmaster

An intermediate course for both

Cub Scouting beyond the Ranks - covered Progress Towards Rank, totems, arrow points, Academic & Sports belt loops and pins, World Conservation, religious emblems (there was also another course soleley on religious emblems), BSA Family Award, Webelos activity badges.

Missed a few - Crime Prevention, Conservation Good Turn,

US Heritage, Heavy Shoulder, Super Achiever, Twentier, Recruiter, Interpreter, etc.

Safe Swim Defense/ Safety Afloat

Climb On Safely

Shooting Safety

Basic First Aid

Intro to Wood Badge - what it is and why you should go

Adult Training Awards - how to get them for you den leaders and ACM, etc

Risk management as it pertains to outings - not insurance per se but Health and Safety, G2SS, planning, etc

a bunch of courses on personal time management (to control that one hour a week beast), how to remember your spouse, how to avoid burnout, etc

Ceremonies that create Memories

Cub Scout Derbies without Pinewood Cars

Community Service Projects for Packs

Leave No Trace for Cub Scouts

Character Connections

Monthly Themes and why you should use them

Duty to Country - flag etiquette, patriotic opening ceremonies, parades

These are the courses I took or wanted to, but couldn't since there were only 8 sessions. (I skipped lunch).

Sorry, I didn't take any Boy Scout focused course this time. Last year, there was one Boy Scout course I participated in that was on first year retention - as a follow up to Webelos to Scout Transition.

Good luck.

(This message has been edited by Marty_Doyle)

P.S. means "post script", Latin (?) for after the letter.....

Or did you mean the joke about the Mrs. Smith's prepared pies available at your local grocers?

To follow up on OGE's pun..........

{Chorus}

Moose Moose Moose, Moose and Squirrel

Moose Moose, Moose and Squirrel

Moose Moose, Moose and Squirrel

Of All the Cartoons in this world

Nothing can top the Moose and Squirrel.

And if you watch them faithfully

You will have Rocky up above

The Evil Boris Can't catch Me

Nor Natasha Baby

{Chorus}

I pretty much copied the requirements from page 439 of the current Webelos book,

just leaving out the part about being less 18 years old.

We are going over with the requirements with all of our second year Webelos in the Pack, since they spent last weekend building a tee-pee, hiking, "orienteering", setting up camp with a Troop, and have a conference with the Scoutmaster, which finished the last requirements for their AoL.

The Scoutmaster and I went over this to determine the best time to hold a bridging ceremony - as soon as possible but still allowing them time to "show off" their AoL.

I should have cited the page number earlier, but the whole Wheeler quoting and citing thing ......................................

say, Dave, where were you when Wheeler was posting all of that stuff? And now that you are posting, no Wheeler. Never on the forums at the same time. Hmmmmmmmmm................(This message has been edited by Marty_Doyle)

A boy can join Boy Scouts if he:

is 11 years old, or

has completed the fifth grade, or

earned the Arrow of Light in Cub Scouts.

The Arrow of Light requirements include being either 10.5 years old, or six months past the completion of fourth grade.

So one may infer from the question that a boy needs to have completed the fifth grade before he can join Boy Scouts, but there are two acceptable alternative "paths".

Maybe it's just me, but the "Is it allowed?" juxtaposed against a "9/11 remembrance pin" does not seem in harmony with the aims of Scouting.(Citizenship?)

I would focus more on the fact that the Scout was wearing a uniform shirt and congratualte him (or her, since Ventureres were mentioned also) on that, rather than looking to criticize one "illegal" pin.

(This message has been edited by Marty_Doyle)

Unfortunately, one runs into a practical reality at some point. I'm a finance guy at work, and look at the operations of the Pack from that vantage. I worked up the budget last June, and if I could have done everything as planned, it would cost on the order of $300 per Scout. I couldn't ask for that from many of the families in the Pack.

So, revised budget. The trip to the Battleship Massachusetts, the minor league baseball game, the district Akela camping trip, etc. became additional, supplemental fees. A new Pinewood Derby track was put on hold.

There was one check due at registration, of $50. Scouts were asked to sell $300 worth of popcorn, netting the unit about $100, to cover the balance of the Pack budget. It wasn't a requirement.

One Scout sold $1,000, another $700, another $500, and another $400. About 64% of the total.About ten Scouts had sales between $100 and $200, totalling around $1,300. About 32%.The other dozen or so Scouts had sales totalling $200. I do not think I really had to motivate the top sellers too much. The Trails Eend prizes seeemed to be enough (along with internal competition - three of the top four were in the same den).

Some of the families that sold little or no popcorn couldn't afford to write a check for the "balance" - they are already on some kind of pack scholarship. Others could, but didn't really offer. And FOF's complaint, about the affluence of some of these patents, held true. The handful of "go-getters" carried the budget for the entire Pack. A good turn, that earned them a patch.

The distribution of motivated parents/Scouts and not-so-motivated parents/Scouts, and how to equitably deal with them, without sacrificing too much program, is the balancing act that we as leaders need to perfect.

I think it is more that the parents need to learn (or be reminded), that at the Cub level, it is a family affair, and the family needs to help to boy participate in the fundraising for the Pack.