ASM915

162,

Were they Homing pigeons? Talk about flying home for dinner!!

915

emb,

Animal Science merged:

BEEF PRODUCTION

DAIRY FARMING

HOG & PIG PRODUCTION

POULTRY FARMING

SHEEP FARMING

and tossed in

HORSE OPTION, guess we could also consider them a food option.

ASM 162, no more squab for dinner, eh?

To my fellow Bicentennial Eagle, welcome to the forum. So you have a Jerry signature also.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but don't forget your time as a Scout. That counts also. That could add an additional 11 years to the total, or 12 depending when they started Tiger Cubs. To bad I took a 20 year Sabbatical. I would be going for 40 years instead of 20.

Good luck. I hope they change their minds.

HAPPY CHANULAH to our Jewish Scouting brothers. May the light burn bright.

Let's not forget the 12 point of the Scout Law.

How about some Chanukah stories relating to Scouting.

Eric P.

inspired

Just talked with my 21y/o Eagle ASM. Eamonn, he just read your post. he respectful disagrees. He feels that we need to find a way to inspire the Scouts of today, not just offer incentives if they advance. "Here's a Slushy, candy bar, a free camping trip." The incentives appear lame.

He stated he was inspired to become Eagle because I was one and he had heard some of the stories about my experiences. He joined at 15. He then wasn't thrilled about how his Troop was being run. This inspired him to push forward with Eagle advancement, to get POR and try to make changes. Once he got Eagle, he felt it would give him credibility with the Scouts, when he became ASM, and hopefully inspire them.

If they see a maintainable goal that they want to achieve, then they will be inspired to get there. But it has to be fun.

He also feels that since the late 80's and 90's, that the boys don't have the things present to inspire them, in society today, that we had from the 40's through the 70's. He feels that during that time frame, that most leaders had had military experience, new how to wear uniforms appropriately, and didn't let the Scouts slack off. He feels that starting in the 80's, most of the adult leadership were not vet's because the draft was gone. The adults placed less emphasize on how the uniform was worn, and that is why we are at the point that we are at today, blue jeans, down around the thighs if that high, shirts untucked, etc. Also they Scouts hardly ever see anyone in uniform other then the Police. The only uniforms visible in todays society are sports team uniforms.

He feels National has let Scouting down by forgetting why Scouting was started, to begin with. It was run by people, who usually had a military backgroun. The skills that were taught were survival skills that the military used. There was a draft, so if and when something happened, the Scouts knew that they would be serving, and that Scouting gave them the skills to survive and lead. Now days, National has bowed to the people that feel that the basic skills that we taught back in the 70's and before, are to militant, and don't belong in Scouting.

Dave states that everyone, including National, is wussing out. He feels that if the draft was still in affect, that Scouting would still have a strong

program. This coming from a 21 year old.(This message has been edited by ASM915)

Chris,

Congratulations and welcome to the forum.

LongHaul, John and Beav have great advice. Follow your passions, but watch your time. If you are older and have a limited amount of time before becoming 18, the project may have to be more meaningful project, then a challenging one that might take longer.

If you have time on your side, 2 or 3 years, take your time with the project. If it extends over several months, and you can keep things moving forward and interesting for those involved, it will show your leadership.

If your passion is the great outdoors, look into the Hornaday program for project ideas. You can use an Eagle project for a Hornaday project, as long as it is not on Scouting property. Depending on the project, you can involve several Troop outings and camp-outs, getting your other scouts needed service project hours, as well as teaching them something along the way. If you have the correct mix of merit badges, you could even earn one of the Hornaday Awards, rarer then the Eagle.

If your passion is for peace and justice, check into programs like the Ulster Project. They bring Catholic and Protestant Irish teens over for about a month. The Project has the teens work together to resolving cultural differences, and to go back home and start building bridges between the communities. Maybe you could formulate a project around one of their program activities. A team building camp-out, COPE, etc.

If your thing is religion, how about creating and heading a mission trip for your church, involving a service project. It could be social, environmental, conversational, or historical in nature. You are a child of the world, and the world is your community.

Good luck and best wishes. Let me know what happens.

Eric P.

Bicentennial Eagle

ASM Troop 915

Canal Fulton, Ohio

How about some of you Scouts(er) who have been to Haliburton, or other Canadian summer-camps give us a comparison on the programing differences. I here those up north have more of an emphasize on programing, not MB's and advancement.

helper2

There are always two ways of looking at a situation. For example:

Viewpoint 1)

My pad need some maintenance. There is problems with the water pressure at the tap. It would be easier to do a shampoo and rinse by sticking my head in the toilet and flushing. There is the broken window that allows the pad to have 7/24 365 year round AC. And the hole in the entry way. if my young lad gets to close, it might swallow him up. It wasn't like this tow years ago. The landlord just ignores us. I'll start putting the rent into escrow and hold it there until he handles our concerns.

Viewpoint 2)

Sorry son, you can't have that bike you have been asking for. And dear wife, next falls trip to the islands Will have to be put off. Those darn renters haven't paid their last two months rents.

Who knows. Maybe the BSA and Sweden noticed an issue. Maybe they took it to the appropriate committees at WSC and or WOSM. Maybe there was a GOOD OLE BOYS CLUB within these committees that tabled the concerns because the concerns interfered with the committees intended agenda.

Maybe BSA, Sweden, and a few other NCO's decide to withhold funds in an escrow to get the attention of the Good Ole Boys and the people above them and to get their concerns addressed.

The Good Ole Boys round up the wagons, send out letters about how the BSA, Sweden and their cronies coup will/is hurting World Scouting (and NSC or WOSM's pet project, that may also be hurting World Scouting, but this is purposefully not mentioned), to all the NSO's.

In you blog, out of all the letters you have posted from the SG, WSC and WOSM, I only noticed one correspondence that even discusses the issues in some vagueness. All the others are circular, not saying or revealing anything about the issues.

Insane,

That's the next project, to see what troop old timers we can find. Hopefully they will have pictures, records,etc. We already have most of the charters back to the early 60's or late 50's. It would be nice to put a scrapbook together or actually print a book with a limited number of copies (preordered) as a fundraiser.

Here's an almost belated HAPPY BIRTHDAY to Buckeye Council's Troop 915 (old Canal Fulton Troop 15). Our Troop was the second chartered Troop to the Massillon Area Scout Council in September 1921 and started functioning in 1922, making us a YOUNG 85 YEARS OLD, possibly the oldest still functioning chartered Troop in the Buckeye Council.

Special thanks to the University of Akron Archives Department for helping with finding this information.

I'm now going out and celebrating.

Thank you John and Avid. Everyone seems to have gotten hung up on the word BULLYING. Look outside the box. It's about the whole realm of YP, not just bullying.

Avid, at least your Troop show the video yearly. How many other SM's reading this thread do likewise?

And as John stated, "Isn't that part of why BSA exists?" and Avid, "They only serve to educate the boys about the dangers they may face in the real world." The real world today is in the schools, streets and homes. The wilderness is now the fantasy world for most boys.

We are suppose to be teaching them to also be good citizens. Going to an authoritive figure when they see something that is not right, is that not good citizenship? The kids need to be taught what to watch for. So many things may seem a little off, but not enough to alarm someone, then gets missed until disaster strikes. Then people start wondering, "If only I had..."

This afternoon while on the way to work, there was a discussion on NPR's "TALK OF THE NATION". The person being interviewed had written a book about child predators.

How did the interview relate to this thread?

The person being interviewed stated that it didn't matter how much was spent on background checks, that the background checks would only reveal the predators that had been caught, not the 1000's to 10,000's that were smart enough to fly under the radar. She stated that the monies being spent on the background checks would be better spent on educating the kids and parents on what to look for.

Sounds like the new advancement requirements fall right in line with this concept. Maybe National realized that by having "A TIME TO TELL" as just an optional training for the troops, that the word was not getting out there, because many SM's thought the training was time ill spent, and could better be utilized on something more fun.

Now we have no choice. It's part of the advancement. Is this really such a setback? Is this really such a bad idea? Are we complaining because we are now being dictated to, because we didn't take the earlier hints and suggestions? Are there some people out there that are upset, because now they have to present this material to their Scouts, and possible opening up some uncomfortable dialogues and possibly bring unpleasant/improper situations to our attention, forcing us to deal with them? Or uncovering some bad Scouters in the process?

As for the supposed parents that don't want their Scout exposed to this training:

1) They can't shelter them forever, or

2) Are they scared that something at home might be uncovered if the Scout gets the training and see the video?

Watch out for the ones who scream the loudest against such training and want to bury their heads in the sand. They may be trying to cover up something in their past that they don't wish to remember, or something in the now and present they don't want the rest of us to know about.

I'm not trying to be a conspiracy nut, just a realist.

Our Troop is lucky to have a cinder block Scout House in the local park.

The 5 years that I've been involved with our Troop the local VFW has been our CO. The COR has been involved with the Troop for the last 7 years, but less over the last 2 years. The IH (a gent in his 70'2) is very interested in the Troop. He attends our COH's, ECOH's and any meetings that we request his presents at.

The VFW supplies flags and poles for any projects that we do that need the items. Other money to us is dependent on their budget.

The IH supplies all of our new Eagles with paperwork for the VFW Scout of The Year. Last year one of our Eagles was Ohio VFW's eagle of The Year.

We do Operation Flag for them at Memorial Day and march in the parade.

They supply us with an upstairs meeting room right off the street for Comm. Meetings and COH's, or if we need a Troop meeting place due to bad weather or flooding of the park. We occasionally get a TO NOISE complaint from the members downstairs (behind locked doors) at the bar area. They must have some good hearing aids down there to be able to hear us over the ballgames and noise at the bar.

Our former CO was the local Catholic church. The relations were good until the whole Diocese Youth Protection thing started up, and all the adults had to be fingerprinted for the background checks. The church had no problem covering the cost for the church volunteers, but didn't feel that the Scouters were church volunteers, refused to pay insisting that the Troop pick up the tab, and so we're now with the VFW.

The church thing was to bad. Almost all of the leaders were parish members as well as 90% of the Scouts.

LongHaul,

I concur about the Feb. crossover. I've been trying to get the local pack to move it to March or April, but they want the boys prepared for summer camp. We almost lost 3 of our 4 crossovers last spring. The first campout was on St Patties weekend. 20's for the low and 30's for the high, plus 2-3 inches of snow when they woke up in the morning. We tried to prepare them for cold weather camping, but you know how kids are.

Jeff, I agree. It would be nice to get him on another outing, if possible.

spinnaker,

Go with Beavah's suggestions. They are on the mark.

Problems I see with the whole thing, both sides, Mr G's and your sons,

Sons:

1) Death bed Eagle - but I have one of those too.

2) Sending his brother with the paperwork, unless this had been pre-approve as alright with the SM. The SM should have notified the CC of the plan.

4) Why the sibling? The clean up, was it a grounding or punishment, or was his brawn and strength needed?

5) Did he approach any of the leaders for help with the paperwork?

6) The thing he did do right was drop everything he was doing, respond to the last minute demand.

7) Why did your family transfer to this Troop?

The Troop:

1) Who called the Troop BOR?

2) Where were the other required two committee members that were needed to make it an official Troop BOR?

SM's and ASM's don't count and can not sit on BOR's.

3) Why wasn't the BOR set up with a time and date, instead of a last minute snow-job?

4) Where was the SM during this meeting?

5) Did the CC or Mr G toss this together without the SM's knowledge?

6) did the troop supply your son with an Eagle Advisor?

Our troop has someone act as an Life to Eagle Advisor, presently our CC, former SM, an Eagle.His job is to follow up frequently with the Scouts that are Life. When it is application time, he gets a packet from the Council, gives it to the Scout and goes over what needs to be done. Our DAC also runs a Life to Eagle RT to discuss with the Scout, SM and parents what is expected, and how to do it correctly. The paperwork is then turned into the advisor.

CC then calls a the Troop 's Committee and sets up an unofficial fishing expedition (Troop BOR), just to make sure that all the dates, POR's, ranks and MB's fall into place correctly. the SM and ASM's do sit in one this. The Scout may see faces that he has never met before. He is told that we are there to prepare him for his District EBOR. Dates are checked over, with his input. Questions that he may come across are asked of him, to see how he responds. He may be given tips on how to answer a question appropriately.

ie) We just had a Death Bed Eagle run through his troop BOR. His letter from the Priest wasn't stellar, with comments like " I don't know this person. I have never seen this person", etc. Not a good start for a letter of recommendation. The family always attended Noon Mass. The priest never held the Noon Mass and always had an Assoc. Priest from the local Catholic hospital handle that Mass. The Scout was into high school before the priest was assigned the parish. The Scout was around as his brothers confirmation advisor, it's just the priest didn't know who he was, no fault of the Scouts.

The SM and ASM are there to discuss any questions that the CM's may have about the Scout and how we feel about him achieving Eagle. The next day the paperwork is handed in at Council.

As long as everything was in the Eagle Advisers hands by midnight the night leading into the 18th birthday, not a problem. If there is an issue because of a missed signature, it's is handled. If it an adult screw-up, it is handled. The Scout is not penalized.

Sounds like G was on a witch hunt. Maybe a little jealous of your son.

Good luck and have fun at the appeal.

Lee,

Welcome. Wear them proudly, and like ScoutDad, have a place in your heart for the ones you recognize others with.

I wear my Eagle with it's Palm, AoL, Adult Religious Award and Scouter Training, the last two being submitted by others.

I submitted a fellow scouter for the DAM and was honored with presenting it to him last year. He has been involved for a while. Love to talk, but never about anything he has done. It took 6 months to drag up any information to put on the nomination form.

The District Advancement Chairperson informed my son when interviewing him for the Heroism Award a few years back, that he had an obligation to wear the knot, so that the Scouts(er) would know that he acted unselfishly and without concern for himself to help someone, and that someday they may be called upon to do likewise.

Some knots you can run through a list checking off requirements. Others, you are nominated for. If you receive one, it is only right to respect the person that nominated you, by wearing it.

If you are in a good unit, you may find yourself nominated for a training knot you weren't expecting. It's is nice when someone is quietly watching and keeping track of what you are doing, even when you aren't.

epalmer,

Thanks for thr information.

So has anyone heard the outcome of the big meeting in Cairo yesterday?

The knots contest was fun. How about all the merit badges that have vanished or been merged with other badges? How many can we come up with? You old timers should have fun with this one.

Everyone duck!!!

The Okpik and Happy Feet references that flew over most heads were to clue people in on verrrry cooold weather, and hopefully someone would put two and two together to come up with the Antarctic Award Knot. I don't know if it is obsolete, or if the luck Eagle that gets chosen to participate in the yearly Eagle Scout Antarctic Program can still get and sport the knot on his uniform.

Okay, how about bygone Merit Badges that have vanished or been merged into other merit badges?

For the Medal of Honor #24, there is also

one for the Medal of Honor with Crossed

Palms (Very Rare).

There is another one that only deranged

Eagles who liked Okpik training and have

an affinity to the movie Happy Feet can

get. Just think "Damned penguins raided

my hot chocolate supply again".

I can't remember the knot colors, but it

is/was on a lite purple background.

For the Medal of Honor #24, there is also

one for the Medal of Honor with Crossed

Palms (Very Rare).

There is another one that only deranged

Eagles who liked Okpik training and have

an affinity to the movie Happy Feet can

get. Just think "Damned penguins raided

my hot chocolate supply again".

I can't remember the knot colors, but it

is/was on a lite purple background.

Yep,

You got it Kraut.

ScoutDad, where is our count now?

ScoutDad,

I attended the'75 NOAC as a Eagle/Brotherhood Scout, and the '06 as a leader with my then 19 year old Eagle/Ordeal. I don't remember a lot about '75, darned Alzheimers. I rmember having fun though. Last year I had a great time. They had great classes, exhibits, shows and people to meet.

I think the next one is in Evansville Indiana. And the dorm rooms WILL BE AIRCONDITIONED, unlike MSU. You have to go. It is a blast seeing what these boy leaders manage to put together for NOAC.

Hopefully we'll meet at the next one. i plan on being there either as a leader or on staff.

Novice,

We've heard "Put the OUT(ING) back in Scouting", but everyone seems to forget about the SC of Scouting, SPIRITUAL COMMITMENT.

I've heard of CO's, religious based, that have asked the SM to strongly push the Emblems programs, wanting as many of the Scouts in the Troop to get their Religious Emblem Awards.

Cubs and Ventures have options in rank advancement to earn their Religious Emblems, but not the Boy Scouts. They have an opportunity to earn the award, but not as part of rank advancement. Maybe if they did, we would see an increase.

In our Council, there is presently a major initiative to talk with as many religious leaders in the Council about starting new units, especially with signing youth groups as Venture Crews. A win-win situation. I also knew a DL that informed his parents that the Cub or Webelos Den would be working on their Emblems Award for an additional 30 minutes after the Den meeting for those that were interested. He usually had a good response.

Does your Council have a "DUTY TO GOD" page on their site? I managed to get our Council to start one. The groups were out there in the Council, but the information was not flowing. Last year, our Council only had 8 or 9 Scouts receive their Catholic Religious Emblems, all from the same area in the same county. This year the numbers are up to 20 because of the site. Some of the other Scouters involved with other faiths have also received additional calls about information.

The Catholics usually have a better formed movement then the others. Maybe it's because they have larger numbers, and the Protestant faiths have splintered into a number of different DUTY TO GOD or GOD AND COUNTRY awards specific for each faith, unlike when I was a Scout in the 60's and 70's when there seemed to be only the GOD AND COUNTRY that was generic for all the major Protestant faiths. They also all have their own Committees, but locally they seem to put forth little effort at promoting themselves like the Catholic Committee does.

Our Council also throws a Religious Emblems Recognition dinner each spring for all Scouts and Scouters who have received a religious award. This last spring we had around 150 to 200 Cubs, Scouts and Venturers and adults recognized.

The best way is to lead by example. If the leaders aren't setting the example by showing their faith and Duty to God, why do we expect this of the Scouts?