jmwalston

Pack15,

Do you have Den Meetings 4 times a month, or do you have 3 Den Meetings and a Pack Meeting? If you say 50% attendance isn't active, then fine, you have set a standard. Is 67% attendance an indication of active? I know you stated you are not looking for a fight, but none the less, it appears one is being set up. Don't look at the standards you set for your son as the standards of the group. Parents tend to raise the bar for achievement with their children.

Now, trying to return to the original thread -

"I have 2 kids who I have been informed by the former DL whose sign off on things the child has not done. The former DL just looked the other way and moved on, I am not that way. What I want to know is can the parents appeal to the CM and overturn me or do I have final say, or are others in CO involved?"

"One of the parents is good friends with the CM and the other parent is the CM. I am not going to let a child get credit for something they didn't do and I won't except lying or cheating as a way to let a child advance. I simply want to know what course of actions I have."

"I intend to have all work brought in or at least pictures of the work being done and will be talking to the boys about what they did so I can get an understanding of what they have really done. I realize that is a parent cheats it is a bad message to the child but still advancing does also. It is like telling little Jimmy that his daddy is a cheater and lier but thats okay as long as he isn't."

This is a problem between adults. If the Cubmaster and another parent lied to advance their child, shame on them. But Cub Scouting is set up to have a Cub work with their parents on requirements. Why would you tell Jimmy his dad is a cheater and liar? Does a child need to be told these things. You wanting proof of completion only applies to Webelos. I have heard on the Cub side of this forum many times "KISMIF." Don't let adult situations creep down into the boys' program.

Our CITs were there for the whole summer program with camp staff.

When I was on camp staff, the number of CITs varied from year to year. Generally it was always half a dozen or less. And of that number, about half of them really didn't understand the responsibilities that went with being a staff member. Alot of them thought that it just involved instructing a badge or two, serving meals now and then, and helping with campfire activities. Several would quit by the second or third week. Those who completed the summer usually came back as staff. The problem at our camp was the CITs should have been assigned an adult staff mentor for guidance in addition to their program director, but were only assigned to a staff MB instructor with little guidance from the program directors.

Going through the Scout Stuff online site this morning and found that the Jac-shirt is now listed as a closeout item.

While the goal is admirable, I don't think most people are aware how hard it is to photograph small objects up close. To photograph insects at a distance in order to identify them, you are within the focal length of most cameras. And to properly identify some, you need to be able to closely examine appendages and wings. It is not just a matter of killing and mounting an insect. It is also a matter of close-up, minute observation in some cases. This merit badge has been around since 1923. I am sure that the requirements have been reviewed periodically.

"Just so that everyone has correct information. The national guard is not only serving here in the US during disasters and locally with civil duties. The majority of the forces (especially Army) in the middle east, are guardsmen and reservists. So the guard is all over to include combat operations."

Correct. As a suggestion, I only emphasized the civil side such as the National Guard as BSA tries to maintain neutral stance on the issue of military endorsement. As some people perceive Scouts as one step shy of paramilitary, I wouldn't advocate a requirement change that would be overtly seen as a recruitment endorsement. As a veteran myself, I think all of our youth should be made aware of the hardships and sacrifice made by military personel, in peacetime as well as war. But I know others who might feel quite differently on the matter. Must Scouts are probably unaware that many resident aliens enlist in order to qualify for citizenship. Some have died for our country before becoming citizens.

OGE,

I like that, the professional side of the house supports you and the volunteer side doesn't. Talk about the left hand not knowing what the right hand is doing. We have somewhat of the same running of operations in my Council, and it extends down into the Districts. I've noticed that the professionals will encourage you and give support, wanting the organization to grow and thrive. Can't blame them, they will reap the benefits monetarily. But the volunteer side doesn't want to get on board. True check and balance.

Reminds me of an old Blackadder episode. Blackadder has been "promoted" to Lord Archbishop of Canterbury so he can support his father, the King, in the crown's acquisition of land inheritances. His half-brother, Harry, immediately assumes Blackadder is now an authority on theology and asks, "If my right hand offends me and I strike it off, what do I do in then my left hand offends me? How do I strike it off?" Sounds like the volunteers side of our Councils are left-handed.

The VFW as some great programs, maybe one of the requirements that could be amended to the CiN MB would be the option to participate in a Voice of Democracy contest.

It is discrimination if one pays for a service and then is denied it. Or it may be more a case of fraud.

This was placed on our Council website last month. I assume that it is from National -

All registered Cub Scout leaders must now complete the

following four training courses to earn the Trained Leader emblem:

Fast Start Training for their position (online or instructorled)

Youth Protection Training (online or instructor-led)

Cub Scout Leader Specific Training (for their position,

instructor-led)

New Leader Essentials (instructor-led)

See your district Training Chairman for more details.

My world is now complete.

The version we sang went:

Announcements! Announcements! Announcements!

A terrible way to die!

A terrible way to die!

What a terrible way to be bored to death!

A terrible way to die!

But I heard a verse after it that went something like:

Our cow is dead -

Our cow is dead -

And since we have no cow -

We have no need for your bull.

I would like to know if anyone knows how the verse actually went.

Fast Start gives you an overview. Then New Leader Essentials, Webelos Leader Specifics, and Outdoor Leadership Skills for Webelos Leaders. Don't forget Youth Protection.

J-KC,

That was the first song I learned at Summer Camp as a boy, years later I learned there was a second verse sung in a different manner. Does anyone have the second verse lyrics?

DYB,

What tune is "Da Moose" sung to?

"Only if you take their money. It's easy to say, "We own this camp and we give priority use to our members. If we have available space and time, we will allow other groups to use it."

I agree with you 100% on this. And apparently, this was the case here. I understand the gripe, but generally Webelos Resident Camp is not as large in attendance as during the Boy Scout season. I presume that Pack is referring to Daniel Boone Camp in Daniel Boone Council. If correct, it is a large camp and I can imagine the Field Director thanking his lucky stars to bring in money to defray the cost.

The NRA training offered in my area was approx. $300 for Rifle Instructor and same for Shotgun Instructor. Don't recall the cost for RSO. GW, what was the cost for yours?

' "I would advise not to tell the Council you don't intend to return when you do." '

"There's better ways to say it, such as . . . if this situation is going to be repeated next year, we may have to reconsider attending council camp and look for camp opportunities elsewhere. This leaves everything wide open."

GW,

I agree with your statement, I don't agree with telling the Council you won't attend again when that is statedly not the truth.

"The boys and I had fun and we will definately being going back next year, by telling council we might not return I am simply hoping this will let them know what they did effected a lot of people and I know some won't return because of it. I am hoping them thinking there pockets will be hurt will fix the situation."

If I am trying to set an example for my Scouts, whether they be Cubs, Webelos, or Boy Scouts, then I should use the standards of the organization. Pack has stated that he hopes the implication of lost revenue will fix the situation. It is need of revenue that possibly caused the situation. Threating a further loss will only result in the Council making it up in rentals such as mentioned.

Pack,

"I do know that a non-BSA group should not be given priority over BSA. If it where boy scouts who where used to hiking it would not be such a big deal but for Cub Scouts it most certainly is. I am hoping that letting council know the concerns of our Pack and others joining in that they will ensure this does not happen again, to anyone."

I don't know that a non-BSA group should have less access for use of facilities compared BSA groups. It could be grounds for discrimination. Group X paid a premium to use the facilities and got shunted aside by a BSA group. Not great PR there. Once again, cool off and ask around. Do not start a grassroots movement to boycott the facilities when you don't plan to do so yourself.

Pack,

I would advise not to tell the Council you don't intend to return when you do. It doesn't set a good example among your peers or the boys. It might also give the Council the impression to rent out over you if membership at the event is implied to be smaller the next year.

Not sure of any specifics. But it could include the roles of the National Guard in humanitarian affairs, homeland security, and disaster relief.

With the large number of veterans active in Scouting today, and the large number of injured veterans returning from tours overseas, do you think that possible the requirements of Citizenship in the Nation should be amended or modified to include the role of the veteran in society?

Pack,

Unfortunately for timing, the Regional National Camping School was held in March at Camp Barnhardt of the Central NC Council. You can, as was suggested, take the NRA training, but it is considerably more expensive.

The only military prohibition on tatoos that is directed service-wide is in the Marine Corps. The previous Commandant issued an ALMAR (All Marines) bulletin that stated there could not be excessively large tatoos on a Marine. It was issued with an implemention date that led to many Marines rushing out and getting excessively large tatoos before that date.

I believe LE discourages them, particularly with detective branches as they compromise a detective's ability to work on undercover assignments.

uz2bnowl,

Did you get the tat?

"Is building house for a poor person routine labor? Sure it is, if you've built a house, it is all routine."

Actually, in my Council and the Council next to ours, Habitat for Humanity projects get turned down as Eagle projects.