jacksowi

Hey Chippewa 29, as a commissioner, I've had to deal with similar problems with troop committees and SM's elsewhere in your council recently. There are always resources you can fall back on. Your friend in DC had some valid info and I'm sure his dad will give you all the advice you need if you call him. You may need to convince the troop committee to allow a team from the commissioner's team to come in and do some training.

As an OA Advisor, I just want to say that anyone wanting to have anything to do with the OA needs to learn about it from their local lodge/chapter. One of the things I'm starting in my own area is an informational briefing at our SM Specific Training events. It's not in the syllabus, but a voluntary extra session.

Troops can have callouts at out-of-council camps, but only after their lodge approves it and relays that approval to the camp. As another posting mentioned, they can only receive the ordeal at their own council/lodge setting.

On another note, reading the post from ASM1, I'm surprised that National would have okayed what happened. I understand that National would want to help out a scout whenever they can, but to have the SM and some ASM's decide that a scout should be called out because he was overlooked at his troop election is a clear violation of the basic tenet of OA membership; he was not elected by his peers/fellow scouts. That is the basis of the honor of being elected into the Order. If he was on the ballot and the scouts did not elect him, he was not overlooked. Perhaps they knew something the SM and ASM's didn't.

The Girl Scouts do have a neat looking forest green Blazer, at least in the catalog pictures. And you don't have to beat Tiger Woods to get one. Venturers do have an official uniform although the crews can decide to make their own if they wish too. The only requirement then would be that the whole crew had to wear it.

The Venturing pants/short are what the Boy Scout pant/shorts should be like, lots of pockets. It's a charcoal gray color. The back pockets can have the inside thread cut to enlarge the depth, like the shorts Columbia made for Philmont in the past. The shirt is like the Explorer Kelly Green shirt

Please tell me you're kidding about Philmont going up to $415 next year (2002)!!!

I have to agree with the last couple of threads by eisley and Tiny1pg. There are exceptional 12 year olds out there, but they have to be really exceptional to make Eagle. It is possible, but rare, and reading about the mom making calls and less than one handful of scouts available makes me wonder who is doing the service project and where is the leadership demonstrated in getting his fellow scouts to complete a project of service to others? There is more to life than scouting, even though it doesn't feel like it at times. What has this boy done other than scouts to get this far in two years, or has it been some type of tunnel visioned quest?

The age aspect has been a topic of argument for longer than I can remember. I know National wanted to speed up the Tenderfoot to First class process to one year because someone's study showed boys stayed in Boy scouts longer if they make it to First Class. If you look at the program, the emphasis is not in making each scout an Eagle, but a First Class scout.

I was always a fan of minimum time requirements and just answered a survey on the subject a couple of weeks ago. There was a time when you had to be active in your troop for each rank, and you couldn't start on the next rank until you completed the one before. I don't think the scout really learns the tasks because they are naturally progressive. I've seen too many Life scouts not remembering how to tie any knot other than the square knot. That can be the fault of leadership, but I think working on one rank at a time would enable the scout to enjoy his progression more. You have to remember that advancement is only one of the methods to Scouting. Too many units put the emphasis on the rank as a goal and not what the scout learns on the way. It been too much of "Let's work on this requirement now. Okay, you've done it, where's your book?" The idea is supposed to be an observation of the scout over time to see if he truly knows the task not checking off his book like Cub Scouts.

I have a couple of Scout who are twelve and they have a goal of achieving Eagle eventually. Right now there goal is achieving Star by 15, but they are knocking on that door now and they probably will have their Eagle before 15. I encourage the ones who are zooming along and I might mention things to the slow ones, but not push it. It has to be their goal and their motivation. I used to hear about those parents who told their son's that they couldn't get their license until they finished there Eagle. I thought it was one of those old scouting tales, but I've seen it actually happen a few times. That may be why, as an Eagle myself, I don't push the award. It's the self motivation and desire, in addition to serving others, that I feel a true Eagle must have to earn this award and not just the safisfaction of requirements. Just my two cent.

There is no rule that says the male Venturer has to finish up his Eagle requirements, that's an option left up to him. It's the cherry on the sundae. So a female Venturer can't earn the Eagle, big whoop. Neither can a male Venturer who's never been a Boy Scout or completed First Class. It's not a question of fairness, not everything has to be politically correct. It's an option for the male to continue to work on his Eagle if he wants without having to spend additional time with a troop he may have outgrown. As a matter of fact, a Venturing Crew doesn't have to be co-ed.

The same can be said about OA. If the scout or a male/female scouter was a member of the OA before the moved into Venturing, then they can still hold membership. The Order of the Arrow is a Boy Scout program and not a Venturing Program. No Venturer will be ever elected, nor will any Advisor be nominated, into the OA as a Venturer as the program exists at this time, whether they are male or female.

Let the Venturers concentrate on the Venturing Awards program and not worry about the Boy Scout Awards program. I don't think there is a real problem with the female or for a male wanting to earn the Eagle as a Venturer. From what I have observed in this neck of the woods, Venturers aren't concerned with the advancement program as much as getting outdoors and doing it. I know it's not the same in all parts of the country, but it is in this area.