Gonzo1

That's MY point, he started it at summer camp, but got a partial. So, his questin is about the kinds of mobilizations troops do.

Beavah,

I think the courts over step their bounds frequently. California supreme court just over turned a voter approved measure ruling that lethal injection is "cruel and unusual punishment" of a convicted child rapist/murderer.

Son's question is "what do some scouts or troops do for requirement 8b: "Take part in at least one troop mobilization." He can certainly describe his part and do the after action review. He'd like to know what troops are doing for "mobilization" as he hasn't been in the troop long enough to see another scout do this part.

BTW, he asked me to post his question here.

Thanks on behalf of little Gonzo1

Well said Beavah,

Packsaddle, sad story, sorry about that.

Packsaddle, Thanks for the amplification.

Pack212,

That was my only concern, build the float, have fun, but be very very careful.

Acco, (no attack, just info)

People also join the military for patriotic reasons, you know, like defending the country and helping to prevent another attack. Democrats and liberals will say that it's a way out of da 'hood. It is a place to learn a skill and get money for an education. The military is not a meals on wheels program. However, when disaster strikes, we can send an aircraft carrier to a stricken area quickly. The carrier has a hospital, food, supplies and a means to transport many people and things quickly. I enlisted into the Navy 1982 for patriotic reasons and later retired from the Army Reserve in 2006.

Pack212Scouter,

The Army will take recruits as old as 42 if that suits you.

Overall, I think the US population experiences severe apathy because there is no sacrifice, not to mention the media bias in reporting.

Merlyn, I meant to type "problem".

No, I don't have a problem with AA discriminating against me. I probably couldn't join the JCC either, I'm not Jewish.

I think the BSA only saw a problem after being sued and threatened with more law suits.

I've heard that the YMCA holds or sponsors after school programs right there in the school.

Public schools no longer charter BSA units, we both agree on that and this should now be resolved, right?

Fscouter, I forgot to add the Spanish American War, American Indian War, other actions / operations, Persian Gulf War, and of course the "Cold War". So, Fscouter, if you can read these posts, thank a teacher, if you can read them in English, thank a veteran. Now I'll stay on topic, sorry.

Merlyn, I didn't see a probably with public schools chartering units before, I wouldn't see a probable today. It's a right to peacably assemble. But, we CAN still meet at schools, just not be chartered by them. Done. Units can be chartered to the Friends of the school, the PTO or PTA or some other group and still meet at the school.

Lisa,

I don't really want to join the DAR, but my point is like what vol_scouter said, my defense wouldn't further their agenda. It's all about the agenda.

Merlyn, if AA doesn't accept my application, isn't THAT discrimination based on religion? I would be discriminated against because I am religious.

Fscouter, War, today, may be unpopular in a liberal viewpoint, BUT, war has been necessary and is necessary today. Where would we be without war? How about the Revolutionary War, the War of 1812? The Mexican American War, The Civil War, WW-I, WW-II, Korean War and the ever popular Vietnam War. We must have the Global War on Terror to keep the %^*&% over there. Our nation is not ready to have car bombs going off at the mall, your local coffee shop and the ball parks. In our country's short memory, please remember that President Bush made many, many warnings to Saddam before taking the troops to the Gulf. But, since Saddam thumbed his nose at us AND THE MIGHTY UNITED NATIONS SECURITY COUNCIL and our Congress who all voted for the use of force, well, you get the idea, we're at war with an enemy who does not wear a uniform. How would the country feel if Great Britain had been attacked and we sent troops somewhere? (This message has been edited by a staff member.)

If BSA "took over" all the units, who would "own" the gear? The unit or BSA? If BSA were to own the gear, what ould stop them from taking from a nicely equipped troop and helping a new troop by giving aaway your gear. You show up one Tuesday night and BAM, it's gone.

LisaBob,

You oblviously missed the point. I couldn't care less about joining the DAR. My point is to raise the hackles of Merlyn. If's he's such an "advocate", I'd like him to advocate for me. Perhaps you'd like to join the Sons of Confederate Veterans. But, you see, you can't either. My comment about my civils rights being "trampled" was COMPLETELY "tongue in cheek". Nobody has a "right" to join a private club or organization.

Lisa, I wish tone and inflection could come through the keyboard, but it can't. I'm not arguing with you, but that each of these groups is private, has their own membership rules.

I don't know how many times we're quoted the

First Ammendment: "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances." but there is no "separation of church and state" in there. Just like there is no "constitutional guarantee" to have an abortion, but that's another matter. We also have the right to peacably assemble. We also have the right to free speech, so if i want to pray or proclaim something I can - I also know that freedom of speech does not guarantee a right to be heard.

I suppose it's really OK that a bar for sex discrimination is at a different level than say for national origin, race, "orientation" or religion. My point here is that the bar should be same, shouldn't it? Or is it OK to discriminate against a discrimination factor?

Merlyn, I'd like to join American Atheists. I'll send in my $25, when I'm turned down, will you get your ACLU goons to represent ME? How much do you think I can sue for?

LisaBob,

When I go camping with my son's troop, and I see a dad (moms in the troop don't go camping) and I see a dad "do" something for a boy, I just ask the dad "what are doing?". He might say "I'm helping Johnny set up his tent" or "I'm cooking pancakes for th boys" or whatever, I suggest that the dad have a seat and let a scout help him or ask the PL to get someone to help him, but not the SM or ASM's/MC's. Sometimes I suggest that if left alone, they'll do it. Sometimes the dad will make excuses like "well, since the boys worked so hard on _____, I just thought I'd give 'em a hand".

When scouts drift over to the adult campsite, I don't mind if they visit for a moment, but then I send them back to their patrol area. I'm not rude, it's just where they belong.

I'll drop by a patrol campsite and observe for a few minutes, but I don't butt in. When my son asks me to help thus and so, I'll tell him what he can do, but I also tell him to get a scout to help or ask his PL.

Bob White is right, there's no rule that troops must camp every month, but it's more fun to camp every month.

Merlyn,

Since public entities no longer charter BSA units, what's the problem?

Since participation is VOLUNTARY, what "civil right" has been infringed?

Packsaddle,

I'd explain to the boy and his parents what the joining requirements are and I'd do so gently. I'd let them know they could visit anytime, but can't join until he can meet the joining requirements. I'm sure he might feel sad, but little Johnny might get a lesson that night that not everyone can join the Boy Scouts. I think it is necessary, unpleasant, but necessary. Not everyone wins, not everyone can join. Not every Little League game ends in a tie. It's not always about how you "feel".

.........

You know, I just took at look at the Daughters of the American Revolution membership requirements. The first thing is that "Any woman is eligible for membership who is no less than eighteen years of age and can prove lineal, blood line descent from an ancestor who aided in achieving American independence." No man can join and no woman younger than 18. Hmm, sex discrimination and age discrimination. ........ Merlyn, go round up some of your ACLU buddies and go get 'em. How dare the DAR allow only women, my civil rights as a man are being trampled!

(This message has been edited by a staff member.)

Read, then re-read the G2SS with respect to floats and riding o them.

Have fun, and uh, Merry Christmas.

Who says the whole troop has to camp at the same time at the same place?

Let's say out of 12 months a troop attends 2 camporees as a whole troop. And, let's say a troop has 4 patrols, 2 of older boys, 2 of younger boys. Why not have the 2 older boy patrols go to XYZ State Park and the other two go to council camp ABC. Each can do their own thing, maybe compete against another patrol, but 16 or 17 year old competing against 12 year olds ALL THE TIME? I don't think so.

Then, how about each patrol camps individually a couple times a year.

I think the most important part for adults is to stay out of the way and allow them to fail (safely - without getting physically hurt). It's OK if a scout doesn't cook his food all the way, just remind them to cook chicken all the way though.

Since the BSA no longer chaters units to schools, I guess you "won", so what's the problem now?

Oh yeah, you must look through every haystack to find a needle.Millions of haystacks (schools0 and a couple of needles (BSA units that might have slipped through the cracks and might still be chartered. Good luck!

Gern,

In your model, any atheist who would be allowed to join would have his parents suing because his kid didn't advance, he'd be stuck without so much as a Scout Badge (not even Tenderfoot) because "his best" performance of Duty to God would be ZERO, no duty since he doesn't believe. Sure, he could earn merit badges and go camping, but couldn't advance.

I suppose overwieght kids could get a talking to in the SMC, maybe the SPL could look over patrol menus before campouts and check them during campouts. Maybe Have more aerobic games during the meetings and on campouts to encourge more fitness. Maybe the SM could encourage more fitness during the SMC.

OGE,

It also goes against the Duty to God and being Reverent.

One cannot do his(her) duty to God if he doesn't believe in God.

I think the CO's would be more liable if such a "contract" or "local option" were in place.

BSA has had Duty to God at its' core for almost 100 years. Let's not cave in to the 50 or so people who mught be able to join if DRP is dropped. I don't think dropping DRP would change enrollment numbers a bit.

Merlyn,

Again, no right has bee infringed upon. Joining a lcub is voluntary, mot mandatory. Go start your own.

Are you a member of an atheists rights group? Perhaps your are the CEO or some other officer. If so, how would you feel if I forced my way? Probably none too happy.

So Merlyn, since you want to join us so badly, what style pack do you prefer? Do like Silva compasses or lensatic?

Raincoat or poncho?

Or, are you just agitating and don't really want to be in scouting?

Eamonn,

I hope you enjoy your course.

Sometimes, a few word here and there, a smile and a few hand gestures can make a big difference and make the other person feel more at ease.

JG

Packsaddle,

You know that you and I disagree RARELY. I disagree that any harm has been "inflicted" because membership is completely VOLUNTARY.

I'll agree that many boys who are not now members would benefit greatly from BSA programs, but no one is forced into joining. Plus, with school and other public entities not chartering units, it's a moot point, like water under a bridge.

For outdoors type programs, there are many groups someone could join, nobody is required to join BSA, so I disagree that any "harm" has been done.

Please see PM.

JG

I like Lisa's idea.

For what its worth, I much prefer discussing the merits of using flint and steel over matches or lighters or nylon tents over canvas, exteranl frame pack over internal, patrol method over troop method, boy led over adult led, etc.

So Merlyn, since you want to join us so badly, what style pack do you prefer? Do like Silva compasses or lensatic?

Raincoat or poncho?

Merlyn,

Do you know the difference between a priveldge and a right?

I'm sure you do, you're probably insulted at the question. Well? You don't have a RIGHT to join the BSA, it is a priveldge, the BSA is a private organization. Not every group is open to everybody or every body. You can't join ulness and until you can meet the joining requirements.

How about the other question you're now shying away from? Why don't you just go and start your own group?

As an attorney, you must love and highly regard all Supreme Court decisions, right? Well, apparently the high court has previously ruled that the USA is a Christian nation. What do you think about that?

Why don't you start you own group?

What do you think about the SCOTUS Christian nation ruling?

I don't wear an interpreter strip even though I'm bilingual. I speak, read and write English and Spanish. However, my decision is based on a limited vocabulary as it relates to scouting. So, I don't want to be put on the spot for interpretation. I'll converse, even translate, but camping type vocabulary is limited. Someday, I'll study some more words.

I have translated for adult training sessions, military hospital classroom training sessions, military patients care and in my own clinic too. I qualify, I just don't wear it.

(This message has been edited by Gonzo1)