FireKat

Kids in accidents... Alway a sore subject with me. Thank God mine have been exposed to the true things that happen to someone in an accident, not these sanitized programs on TV and their warnings of graphic content. That is the mild stuff, they don't show the real bad stuff. I wish that it would become manditory for new driver applicants to do a tour of a morge, trama wing or accident scene with victims. Show them what really can happen. I saw too many kids mutalatedby accidents as a firefighter, EMT and working in a funeral home. When the death was a young person and was preventable, most pe

....... to laugh at the fool on the hill.

Sometimes the comments bug me as I may be a bit rushed and it feels like he is wasting time. Some are funny, some just don't make much sense. I just wonder what is bugging him to make most of his comments negative. And when GW is serious he has some good points.

Sometimes the comments bug me as I may be a bit rushed and it feels like he is wasting time. Some are funny, some just don't make much sense. I just wonder what is bugging him to make most of his comments negative. And when GW is serious he has some good points.

eagle90, you missed the point of the rant - it is hard to do the patrol method if the camp does not support it. He said that those doing their owm cooking were not privy to announcements during camp. Stosh - That is realy poor planing by the council/camp. You know what they say runs downhill? Looks like it is time to make waves to change things. After all it is your council camp and reflects on all scouts/scouters in your council.

I don't mind a kid blowing off MB classes as long as they do not expect to get the MB later.(as has happened - kid only showed up on the last class and expeceted blue cards - parents did the same)

Scrap the ELSP? No Fix it: Yes. Fix the adults which are out of control. ELSP being no fun? Not in our area! The boys realy have fun doing the projects. Maybe not the paperwork. When we review the projects we make sure there is ample ways to show leadership. No hours involved. We make sure that the project is not too big. Some scouts go a bit overboard on what they want to do. Sometimes it needs to be pared down to a manageable project. We encourage them to do what they can but if it does become too much to concide that a change to be recorded in the paperwork. I see the ELSP as

I think you have an answer to your question in that the CO want the boys out. The troop belongs to them and they have the right to say if someone can belong as this is a private organization. As much as I hate to give up on troubled kids these may not be worth losing the whole troop over. By 15 you have lost much of the time to change a kid's behavior, especally if the parents are not supporting the change by acknowledging the problems. Time to clean house and get the troop back into shape. Good luck. ( you will fight the reputation for some years before you can re-earn the troops good name)

I saw this at our scout shop: A large banner the boldly announces that this is an "Eagle Scout Leadership Service Project" with areas to write in the troop number. Eagle logo (BSA copyright) on it. This is ment to hang in front of the project as it is being worked on to advertize that a boy scout is doing said project. Bob, how do you explain this? It is being sold by the offical scout shops? Can your expert explain it?

Sorry to hear aabout your troubles. A few questions before any advice. What about the boys' parents? How do they feel/act about what has happened? Any input from district/council/camp personal? Any signs of changing attitue with any of the boys? What about the new scoutmaster? Are the boys' parents on the committee? How does the COR feel? (added) What rank and age are the boys?(This message has been edited by firekat)

Ok. Now that we know there is a problem (some adult leaders) How do we fix it. Who can we go to when we have troubles? Any places higher if there is no solution at first level? Please do not just say 'training' as many of the 'problems' have had or refuse to go or listen as they can be set in their ways. Somethimes someone from higher up in the orginization needs to come correct things before they will listen. P.S. we have a great DAC who watches birthdays and contacts the ageing scouts to help them make the deadline.

Eamonn, our summer camps are only for one week. Two might be nice but most leaders probably could not be off work that long. Some of ours have trouble getting a week. Our adult participation is high and we have a small troop. Most kids have one parent as a leader. No, never really had trouble with them doing things for the kids as they look at it as a vacation but are around if something comes up. The boys also mostly ignor the old folks. Kids like it as one is there for parents night. I try to got to parents night mostly as one parent is unable to do the drive especially at night. That par

I am sorry you missed camp. Health issuesare nothing to brush off. With your family history is is always best to error on the side of caution. I hope you keep looking into what your Dr saw. Sometimes things show up one time but don't later. Just like when you take the car to the mechanic. It runs fine when he is looking at it and doesn't act up again till you are far away from the mechanic. Make sure your regular Dr get the right info to the cardiologist. And next year start your physical early (This message has been edited by firekat)

FWIW, our troop has a different style of fundraising which makes it impossible to track individual earnings. All monies go to the troop account and we track participation in the fundraisers. As long as the boys and/or parents particpate they get their camp paid for. We are a small troop so this has been the best way for us. Our camper fund is and has been sound and also helps defray costs of the high adventure camps which our troop tries to do every other year. Have you also checked with your council for camperships? (a type of scholarship to attend camp)

One other thing I have found to build up legs without fear of doing damage by applying weight is horseback riding. Done properly it will help both legs and backs.

Before you completely consider this topic a dead horse... I noticed alot of people argued against this because of thinking it is a waste of space. These are many of the same people that aqrgued for the other two new 'approved' Knots that are more based on money then what a boy accomplished. I see more logic to this knot as some who earn all MBs do not have enough time left to earn the matching number of palms. As some one else pointed out you need to be an eagle at 13 to do it. How many 13yos do you think there are? How many 13yos are eagle maaterial at that age? It would be nice to see this

The best way to get into shape for an activity is to do that activity. We had one boy very determined to get into shape for Philmont. He put rocks in his backpack starting small and working up in weight and go on short hikes or just walks around the neighborhood. his worked very well for him. He was in great shape for Philmont.

It is not the West knot that bugs me but the new ones. Why one for life members of the NESA vs regular Eagle knots? Why one for going to Philmont more times? Most that have been to Philmont have things such as the bull, belts, and patches to show. Why do they need a knot? Before you know it they will come up with more knots for donations as Nat'l is getting very money focused. Yes, award them something but use something else. Drat the typos!(This message has been edited by firekat)

"But, my own scouts told me that if I expected them to wear their insignia as earned, and wear it properly and proudly, then I should do the same. " (emphasis added) The point is earned not bought. Yes, reward people who financially support scouting but don't make it look like a service (working) award. Keep them different so people can see those that just give money and those that just work and those that do both. Give life members of NESA somthing else besides a variation on the Eagle knot. I want to know who has working experence with the boys so I knowwho to ask for advice. If they all w

Thanks, Eamonn, for reviving this thread. This has been the best place I have found to get both sides of a subject without always falling into individual attacks. I don't have endless time to search all over for the info I am looking for. Here you ask and you politely get the info pro and con and links to placeswhere more can be found. There are also the hijacks which ramble off and lead to the obsurd and give us all a break from the serious and many time a well needed laugh. As to 3 members I do not think I could keep it that short. All in their way have added a lot to the site. Best of all

John wote "There should be someone in your Council Service Center who is the designated "go-to" person for ScoutNet apps, including Internet Advancement and Internet re-charter." I wish!! I am computer savy but the design of that site leaves a lot to be desiered. Mosts people nneed super simple apps with lots of outs and workarounds. Most people I have talked to reciently wonder when certain links to Nat'l will become active. Do to the new programming at nat'l they will not. They have to be hand done and out council site is sorly behind. Asking too many computer related questions are our

The bar is very high so be aware. One boy wh was short in the head only got an extensionfor the time inhospital. Get all your ducks in a row with lots of documentation.

And da local tour permit does not require that you bring a copy of G2SS along on a trip. That would just be silly. - Opps, bev, you had better look again! "Under the Leadership and Youth Protection Training You must fill out everything. You will need to know you scouting position and your unit expiration date. The Tour Leaders and Unit must be chartered for Approval. You must have Youth Protection training for Camping. You must have read and be taking with you the Guide to Safe Scouting. The Tour Leader will be signing that they have read and will be taking the Guide to Safe Scouting with

Thank you, Beavah, I was just about to ask about insurance for the boy durning an ELSP. Now, does the insurance also cover any of the troop or neighboring troop members who work on the project?

simple, Service to others. Along with- Adult association (oversite, approval) Leadership How can an ELSP not be part of a boy's BSA career? The BSA does oversite, approval, and reconition. All the BSA is trying to do is get the scout to look outside the BSA and become a member of the community. Plenty of scout do projects for the BSA as service hours. This is a gental push of a fledgling eagle out of the BSA nest.(This message has been edited by firekat)